Native roses

[The Helpful Gardener]

Native roses; anyone growing them? Finding them? Not seeing them?

I am falling in love with R. virginiana; the glossy red fall foliage, the beautiful hip set, the way it hip-checks that invader R. multiflora. Those soft pink blossoms on that sturdy little chassis....rrrow

But I already have my sights on another, R. nitida. Someone else has always got shinier foliage than you...

[grandpasrose]

By native roses, I assume you are referring to "Species Roses", the earliest roses from which all other roses have been bred. "Species Roses" also, when self-fertilized, produce seedlings that are identical to the parents. These roses make up some of the hardiest roses grown.

The only "Species Rose" I have Scot, is R. Canina. They are particularly hard to find, especially up here. They also are almost always a single petal bloom, which I am not partial to.

R. Virginiana though, is a double flower, and has a very pretty pink to it. I like the color of R. Nitida as well.

Species Roses are also known for their colorful foliage and fruit in the fall.

Val

[The Helpful Gardener]

By native I mean here before European colonization. R. canina is a Euro/Asian/N. African rose commonly used for root stock and not native...

HG

[grandpasrose]

I apologize Scott! I thought you were referring to a classification of roses, and I had never heard of a classification called "Native"!

Anyway, the roses that you are referring to as Native are, in fact classified as Species/Wild roses. Quoting Peter Harkness "Wild roses are also known as species roses. These ancient roses were native to many regions of the Northern Hemisphere."

To quote Charles and Brigid Quest-Ritson (Encyclopedia of Roses) "The ancestors of our garden roses are the wild roses from which all our cultivated varieties are descended. It is more correct to call them 'Rose Species' rather than 'Species Roses'. Wild roses occur all over the northern hemisphere."

Finally, to quote Liz Druitt (The Organic Rose Garden) "Species roses are the wild roses collected anywhere between the Arctic Circle and just above the Equator, the natural range for roses on this planet."

In regards to the specific roses you mentioned in your post, r. Virginiana is classified as Species/Wild, and was cultivated before 1640 by a breeder named Miller. It is native to North America.

R. Multiflora is also classified as Species/Wild, and began being bred around 1804. It is native to Japan.

R. Nitida is classified as Species/Wild, and began being bred around 1807, and is native to North America.

R. Canina is classified as Species/Wild, and began being bred in 1737 and is native in Europe.

So, I guess if you go by "Native" - I don't have any! But if you go by the classification - Species/Wild - I have one - big deal eh!

Val

[The Helpful Gardener]

Well, if you like the rose that is...

Frinstance, the reason I bought my Weed Wrench was R. multiflora. One of the worst invasives, yet when I mention tearing them up bird people get out of sorts, yelling and arm waving "That's a bird plant!" Yep. Motly our non-native sparrows (although some of the native sparrows have learned a new source), starlings and the like recognize food from home. SO they eat it. And fly a few miles. And poop. Bird borne invasives are the most pernicious type.

R. rugosa is getting a few stern looks around these parts; the Cape Cod/Martha's Vineyard crowd are watching it starting to gobble up shoreline and that one time darling of the beach is starting to get a bit of a cold shoulder. I have seen some bird use but suspect that issue is more clonal, as the thing really does sucker freely, as you know if you've grown them...

I am adding native roses this spring because, as mentioned here before, I have no need of roses that need coddling, and these will need none. Secondly, the plants that get displaced by invasives are the ones most like them; they compete for the same growing conditions. [img]R.%20multiflora[/img] has booted out these other roses until they have become hard to find around here. Every leg up helps, and maybe birds dining here will poop these and take up a spot that otherwise would have gone to a bad guy...

And they smell good (C'mon! Isn't that the big draw for roses? )

HG

[grandpasrose]

I have to admit there is nothing like sitting on our deck in the evening and having the smell of the roses swirling around us! People who come to visit us in the summer, have often said, when they round the corner into our back yard - oh smell the roses!
The only real species rose I have seen much of is r. canina, so I guess multiflora can't be much of a problem over here. And the problem with rugosas surprises me. I know they sucker badly, but never dreamed they would get that carried away. I have a few rugosas and they behave, but there again, it may be the weather.

I remember as a child, collecting as many petals as we could of the r. canina bushes when they were blooming, and we would soak them in warm water and make "perfume"! - and making necklaces out the the hips in the fall. Wish life stayed that free sometimes!!

Val

[The Helpful Gardener]

Shining Rose (R. nitida) is known for it's shiny foliage and great fall color as well as lots of hips. I fergot to mention R. carolina or pasture rose, another cutie that smells great. I remember a talk in Pennslvania where a lady brought a cutting in from one that her grandmother had given her, worried that it was one of the bad ones she'd been hearing about...boy was she happy to hear it was native!

Hybrid teas and most bred roses are very well behaved; it is simply the non-native species that bear watching...

Scott

[arkansasrose]

I'm still trying to get a cutting rooted of Rosa arkansana, though not native here originally, coming from the Arkansas River in Colorado, I see it growing a lot of places in the wild. We also have several apparent natives growing by our spring fed pond, I'm still trying to get IDs on them. Multiflora is found here a lot and since it's a host for Rose Rose Disease and responsible for the spread in the Mid-West, it's not a welcome sight.

https://www.biosurvey.ou.edu/shrub/rosa-ark.htm

[The Helpful Gardener]

Hear hear, Arkansas!


I believe R.palustris is native in your area, and the nearness to water is a likely indicator, but be careful as they are often very similar to other natives and some invasives as well...

Scott

[gardenmob]

Hello,

I just want to clear this up > there is a difference between native and species roses. A plant is described as being native when it has originated in a specific place. A plant that has been introduced and succeeded would be considered naturalized. Species roses refers to parentage. You can certainly have a species rose that is not native. Regardless of what Harkness says.

For example, Cherokee Rose which is a species rose, is in fact, not native to Georgia (where it is the state flower). The original poster clarified his question by being specific about roses prior to western European introductions, and in this he clarified it perfectly. He wants native roses, and they may or may not be species roses.



Barrie