rocky
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Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:40 pm
Location: Northeast

Grubex on beds

I applied Grubex to the lawn which will be reseeded in about a month.

I have been doing work on the front beds and am ready to put down landscape fabric and mulch. I noticed a very few beetles ( maybe 4 within the whole bed of 100 sqft).

Should I treat the bed as a preventative measure with Grubex before I put down the fabric and mulch? If so, can I put the fabric and mulch right down after watering, or should I wait a couple days?

The Helpful Gardener
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Location: Colchester, CT

Rocky, Rocky, Rocky... :(

Ease off with the harsh chemicals my friend. You can do a much better job of grub control with milky spore and that won't whack your earthworms and other beneficials (they ain't all bad guys, Rock...). Plus milky spore is a livving organism that breeds where it has a food supply (grubs) so you only need to apply every five to ten years or so...cheaper to boot!

Four beetles (probably just black ground beetles, am I right?) is NOT worth poisoning the land you live on...

The new reformulation of Grubexx just got Scotts fined by New York State; seems they hadn't registered the new active ingredient (did you know about the new ingredient, Rocky?) Seems there are concerns about groundwater contamination and insufficient studies on the active ingredient, halofenizide. Cost Scott's $1,200,000, so New York State must think it's pretty bad, huh?

Just because they can sell it doesn't mean it's safe folks. And in this case they shouldn't even have been selling it!

Watch out for poisons they may kill someone you love, not just bugs...

Tell me you don't have well water, Rocky...

rocky
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Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:40 pm
Location: Northeast

The Helpful Gardener wrote:Rocky, Rocky, Rocky... :(

Ease off with the harsh chemicals my friend. You can do a much better job of grub control with milky spore and that won't whack your earthworms and opther beneficials (they ain't all bad guys, Rock...). Plus milky spore is a livving organism that breeds where it has a food supply (grubs) so you only need to apply every five to ten years or so...cheaper to boot!

Four beetles (probably just black ground beetles, am I right?) is NOT worth poisoning the land you live on...

The new reformulation of Grubexx just got Scotts fined by New York State; seems they hadn't registered the new active ingredient (did you know about the new ingredient, Rocky?) Seems there are concerns about groundwater contamination and insufficient studies on the active ingredient, halofenizide. Cost Scott's $1,200,000, so New York State must think it's pretty bad, huh?

Just because they can sell it doesn't mean it's safe folks. And in this case they shouldn't even have been selling it!

Watch out for poisons they may kill someone you love, not just bugs...

Tell me you don't have well water, Rocky...
The beetles were black and I thought possibly there were the results of hatched grubs, so I was wondering how many more might develop.

Yes, I did hate putting the Grubex on the lawn but a voice (spelled "w-i-f-e") kept saying to me (you know, if we're putting in a new lawn, we should put on the Grubex so it doesn't get eaten next year -

I have heard pro and cons about Milky Spore - many have said that it will take quite awhile and it does nothing.

I will look into what you have said about Grubex and halofenizide.

And, no, no well water here - we're pretty close to the city and pay dearly for our water and sewage - don't get me started on that..

The Helpful Gardener
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Yeah, I'm in that boat for the first time and boy, do I miss well water...

I don't want to sound alarmist (okay, I do :roll: ), but we are losing a good deal of our native wildife and habitat to indiscriminate use of chemicals, with nothing more than a cursory look at whether they are harmful to humans, and almost no thought to any other species. An alarm is an appropriate response, in my mind...

Concerned In Connecticut

(The Helpful Gardener)

yngvarn
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Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:57 pm
Location: Laconia NH

milky spore

Can someone tell me where I can buy some milky spore?

I have a terrible grub problem, and I started to appy grubex, then I felt just horrible poisoning the earth and contaminating where my children play. The grubex is headed to my towns hazardous waste collection day, but I still haveto do something about my grubs...my lawn is very damaged. I know it won't work right away, but I don't care, better that than spreading poison...

The Helpful Gardener
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Location: Colchester, CT

Milky Spore won't work for you in NH; you're too cold and besides MS only really kills Japanese Beetle, which is only a tiny part of white grub complex... I've learned some new tricks since that post...

Nematodes, my friend...

[url]https://www.yardlover.com/products.php?catID=700&gclid=COrOxtG7hZoCFRabnAod6UC4QQ[/url]

Normally I would recommend two species for sort of a hammer and anvil effect, as HB nematodes (what these guys call Terranem) are hunter seekers moving deeper in the soil ion search and destroy. SC nemaotodes (Capsanem) and SF nematodes (Entonem) are root area ambushers; they wait for the food to come to them. This site makes it out like these guys are really specific on foods, and that just isn't the case, but I will go with their recommendation for the HB if you are just choosing one for grubs...

I had a nasty outbreak of grubs two years bacj; one treatment (HB and SC) has knocked them so far back they are still not an issue. These nematodes will populate your soil to a degree and will offer some residual factor, but they are guaranteed to not be harmful to anything beneficial like earthworms or mammals, and that makes them SO worth it...

Check in again when you have them and we'll talk about how to use them...

HG
Scott Reil

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grubs etc

I'm not a lawn person (why I totally stay out of the lawn care forum) and I think organic gardeners really need to re-think the whole lawn grass monoculture thing. We have a little patch of lawn left in front (the only place I haven't ripped out to plant something more interesting and diverse) and I do nothing to it but mow frequently. (Actually this year I'm working on planting wild violets and spring beauties IN to it -- I love the look in spring when people's lawns are full of violets, dandelions and spring beauty.) I don't water it except a little bit in the worst of drought, to keep it from totally dying. Otherwise, it can go brown in the summer and it comes back later. Watering lawn is a waste of water. If you live in arid territory where you can't have lawn without frequent watering, try xeriscaping! My lawn is more weeds than grass, but it is all green. In fact my neighbor who does the chemlawn thing is always asking what I do, because my lawn is greener than his. Once mowed it looks smooth and green. I know there's grubs in it, because I find them when I dig, but it doesn't seem to be huge infestation and in a diversified system, they don't seem to do much visible damage. So no water, no fertilizer (not even compost on the lawn, I've better uses for it, the lawn fends for itself) no herbicides/ pesticides, I don't pull the dandelions because I think the bright yellow flowers are pretty, no care, just keep mowing the grass weed mixture frequently to keep it low and even and smooth. (Mowing frequently keeps the dandelions from going to seed, so that my lawn doesn't become a major problem for the neighbors who don't want them) Works for me.

The Helpful Gardener
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When we use chemicals the first biology to die is the micorrhizae, the symbiotic fungii that helps plants roots. Chemical Lawn Guy wants to know why RG's "uncared for" lawn looks greener? RG still has these. As a consequence, organic lawns develop much deeper root structures than chemical lawns, making them more drought and grub tolerant. Chemical Guy has wiped out the cavalry, and his "rug on drugs" has a shallow root system, so it burns out easier in summer. He probably cuts too short to top it off...

Lawns can be green and water free for the most part in many places in the country; mine has not seen supplemental water in two years. But those in California, Arizona and other hot dry places should think about doing without, as the water drain for landscaping is insane in these climates (I have seen an estimate of 4/5 of ALL water used in some areas is irrigation of landscapes :shock: ). But if you get enough rain, and use the right seed and fertilizer, organic lawns can be as green as any other garden...

(Did you know that tall grass prairie stores more carbon than forest? Turns out the root densities (and the roots are MUCH higher in carbon than the tops) are a lot higher in grassland (of course).)

HG
Scott Reil

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