redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Well something ain't right here.

I'm having problems in my nightshade and leafand vegetable bed. I'm not sure if they're related or not but can anyone give me any advice?
First off are the tomato plants.
IMG_20150724_131805.jpg
They get this every year it seems and I'm not sure if its a blight or some kind of deficiency. Starting at the bottom the plants leaves start turning yellow and then die.
However this year is the first I've noticed the samevthing or something close on the potatos.
IMG_20150724_131818.jpg
And while I don't believe its the same thing the leaves on my cabbage plants are turning dark which never happened before.
IMG_20150724_131835.jpg
So does anyone have any idea what's going on?

User avatar
rainbowgardener
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 25303
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:04 pm
Location: TN/GA 7b

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Something isn't going well. To start with nothing looks like it is thriving very well; everything is a bit stunted. When did you plant the cabbage (seed or transplant?). Cabbage should be huge by now.

Here's a couple pictures of mine from two weeks ago:
2015-07-12 16.05.41.jpg
2015-07-12 16.06.04.jpg
2015-07-12 16.06.04.jpg (53.12 KiB) Viewed 1066 times
Tomato plant is also looking spindly with not much branches and leaves, as well as not producing yet.

It should be looking more like this:

Image https://www.star-telegram.com/living/hom ... %20(1).jpg

When plants are not healthy and thriving, they are vulnerable to whatever pest/ disease is around.

Tell us more about your soil and how you treat these plants (watering, fertilizing, etc). It is hard to tell from a picture, but your soil is looking a bit hard and compacted.
Twitter account I manage for local Sierra Club: https://twitter.com/CherokeeGroupSC Facebook page I manage for them: https://www.facebook.com/groups/65310596576/ Come and find me and lots of great information, inspiration

User avatar
ElizabethB
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 2109
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:53 am
Location: Lafayette, LA

Re: Well something ain't right here.

DITTO RBG on soil quality. From what I can see from your photos your soil looks terrible. Good soil should be very dark - almost black and very loose. Not gray and compacted. Your soil looks like clay - heavy clay. Nothing will grow well in that other than weeds.

IDK what you can do this year other than start a compost bin. Check out the composting forum. If you start now you will have nice compost to amend your soil with next year.

Good luck
Elizabeth - or Your Majesty

Living and growing in Lafayette, La.

When weeding, the best way to make sure you are removing a weed and not a valuable plant is to pull on it. If it comes out of the ground easily, it is a valuable plant. ~Author Unknown

redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Lol. The weeds and groundhog are thriving.

My cabbage was planted as seed on 4/15 and sprouted on 4/30. Its Copenhagen market and is my first time growing this variety. I wasn't sure if it was really behind or not being a new type.

The tomatoes never get good for me. My beefsteaks usually don't produce much and half of the tomatoes rot on the vine. The cherry tomatoes do a lot better and usually give me a better harvest unless something eats or breaks the plants.

As for my soil its clay. With rocks mixed in. seems like the more rocks I get out of it the more clay its becoming....
I've been using a 6 year rotation system but since I'm still making the garden bigger I do get some overlap. I've tried adding some shovel fulls from a 20+ year old manure pile into it but I don't think its done much. With the compost pile started this year I'm really hopping to have my own compost for next year. I have very few worms in the garden but do have some ant hills.
For fertilizer I have some store bought 10-10-10 that I mix in at the start but I don't do much else throughout the year. Usually every few days I dump a bucket of pond water with some fish blood mixed in on it but this year that's mostly been going to the compost pile.
For watering unless its raining or rained hard I give the garden a good watering with the hose every night. Also this past week has been much hotter so its probably dryer then usual

I don't know how much compost i'll have for next year yet but hopefully it will help.

User avatar
GardeningCook
Greener Thumb
Posts: 787
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2015 12:35 am
Location: Upper Piedmont area of Virginia, Zone 7a

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Your soil is your biggest problem. It's pretty much criminal at this point. If I were you, I'd most likely write off this season & work on getting your clay, rocky, dust-like soil in better shape for next season. I frankly don't think anything is going to help you this season. Even if your current compost isn't ready yet, try working in some bagged peat moss, compost, manure - heck anything loosening, enriching, & organic can only be for the good. But from the looks of that soil, you're going to need a lot of it.
My body is a temple. Unfortunately, it's a fixer-upper.

lexusnexus
Green Thumb
Posts: 358
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:06 pm
Location: MD Suburbs of DC, 7a

Re: Well something ain't right here.

We had an extremely wet late May, June and early July so losing tomato leaves on the bottom would not be unusual (hey I lost some too). What did you do to your soil prior to planting?
Dan - "Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends..." Emerson, Lake and Palmer - Karnevil #9

User avatar
rainbowgardener
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 25303
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:04 pm
Location: TN/GA 7b

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Just happened to bump in to this thread again.

As we discussed, your soil is your problem, why everything is stunted and not doing well.

But I did notice now that you said your cabbage seed was planted 4/15. That is pretty late. Cabbage is a cool weather crop, very cold hardy and frost tolerant, doesn't do as well in hot weather.

I started my cabbage seed indoors mid Jan and planted the seedlings in the ground mid March. My average last frost date is mid-April, so the seedlings definitely went through some frost and snow after they went in the ground, but they were fine.
Twitter account I manage for local Sierra Club: https://twitter.com/CherokeeGroupSC Facebook page I manage for them: https://www.facebook.com/groups/65310596576/ Come and find me and lots of great information, inspiration

redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Sorry for the delay. I've been really busy lately.
The part of the garden everything in now is the oldest part. (This will be the 5th year.) It was starting to look better but it had a lot of rock in it yet and at the start of the season I dug a lot of that out. I'm not sure but I think doing so made the clay situation worse.
I mixed a little (not enough) old manure in with it and some 10-10-10 fertilizer. Also in previous years I had left a lot of the weed and old plant that I cut out laying in the garden or mixed them in when digging. This year since I started the compost pile I've been tossing all of that in it.
Honestly I’ve known my soil wasn’t the greatest. I'm coming to the conclusion that I haven’t been doing as much to correct it as I thought I was and since most of the garden got eaten by wildlife or taken out by storms over the past 2 years I wasn't really able to tell it was still degrading until now.

Rainbow I may be wrong but I think we talked about that when I first started here. My location is apparently strange for gardening. Lol. Trying to start plants from the cabbage family indoors hasn't ended well for me. My last frost date is may 20th so following the packs I try to plant the seeds outside around the start on April. The first 2 years it worked and I was able to harvest the heads in August. The next 2 years they were eaten by wildlife...

lexusnexus
Green Thumb
Posts: 358
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:06 pm
Location: MD Suburbs of DC, 7a

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Before charging head long into amending your soil I highly recommend getting a soil test done so you have an idea what needs to be added. However, adding compost at any point is never a bad idea. Also, don't try get that perfect loamy soil at once. Work on it over time.
Dan - "Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends..." Emerson, Lake and Palmer - Karnevil #9

redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Thanks. I'm not sure about the soil test at this time. I may try to bring in some other dirt and if so I'm guess I should wait until after that to get it tested?

Taiji
Greener Thumb
Posts: 885
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:19 am
Location: Gardening in western U.P. of MI. 46+ N. lat. elev 1540. zone 3

Re: Well something ain't right here.

I was going to say that since it's late summer now, you could plant some kind green cover crop to mix in later. My frost dates are similar to yours and I just planted buckwheat in some new beds I'm creating. After that, I'll probably plant another crop of annual rye or something similar to help build the soil even more.

But, if you're going to bring in new dirt maybe not the thing to do just yet. And, cover crops won't eliminate the rocks. Everyone has some rocks, I just toss them aside when I find them, but sounds like you have an inordinate amount.

tracydr
Newly Registered
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2009 5:48 pm
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Well something ain't right here.

I would also recommend cover crops,since it sounds like you only use 1/6 of the garden at a time. Try to never have any empty dirt in the gardens, always have a cover crop planted if you're not using it.
You could do just about any readily available seed. Annual rye, rye grain,wheat,clover,hairy vetch,field peas or favas. Leftover seeds. One year, I used a pound of mustard seeds from the spice store. You can also try fenugreek,which adds nitrogen like clover and can be purchased in bulk from spice stores.m
In summer, try buckwheat ( could do that now), sorghum,millet. Corn or okra if you have a shredder.
Do you have a source of leaves or straw? Add 4 inches of straw or 1-2 feet of shredded leaves and let sit over winter if unable to cover crop. Till in spring or just pull back to let soil warm and then use as mulch,allowing the worms to carry it into the soil.
A soil test will be free or inexpensive from your extension agency. You may have a serious pH issue or nutrient imbalance.

redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Thanks.
I do have a lot of rock but I'm working on digging it out. Its just that the more I do the more clay the soil seems to become.

Also I try to use the whole garden as much as I can except for 1/6th of it that's supposed to be rebuilt each year but right now its down to just 1/3rd in use because I gave up on planting anything late this year.
I am looking into cover crops.

User avatar
jal_ut
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 7480
Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 3:20 am
Location: Northern Utah Zone 5

Re: Well something ain't right here.

How many hours of sunshine does your plot get each day? Plots on the East or West of a building that only get half a days worth of sunshine are not going to do that well. Full sunshine if you can.

Next comes soil fertility. NPK can be bought in a bag. Put it on as per the instructions on the bag.
Amending the soil with organic matter is also a good practice. Best to have a compost heap and
do the decomp there then add it to the garden. Or till it in in the fall and by spring it will be ready
to go.

Grass clippings used as a mulch are good to help hold soil moisture.

In my dry Utah climate water is a valid concern. We don't usually get enough rain to water a garden,
so irrigation is a must.

Variety of plants is also important to consider. Look for things that are known to do well in your area.
Gardening at 5000 feet elevation, zone 4/5 Northern Utah, Frost free from May 25 to September 8 +/-

redneck647
Senior Member
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:18 pm
Location: Pa.

Re: Well something ain't right here.

Thanks.
My gardens away from the house but its close enough to the woods that the tree line gives it some shade in the mornings.
Everywhere else is either on a slope or the trees on the other side block the sun in the evening.
I cut back to just the one bed for my real garden next year. I dug out all the rock I could and mixed in some 10-10-10 and 3 5gal. Buckets of compost. Next year I'll hopefully have the money to get sand or something for she whole garden.
Next my plan is to plant radishes to help break up the clay more and then cover the bed with leaves and a tarp before the snow falls.
I know it still won't be perfect for next year but hopefully better then it is now.

Return to “Vegetable Gardening Forum”