Squiggles
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Advice growing loofah / luffa

I've been growing a loofah plant (of the cucurbit family) this summer, and so far it's been doing really well. The problem is that the female flowers have begun to bloom before the male flowers have. This, as far as I know (and based on previous experience), is not supposed to happen.
I have about 50 male flower buds on the plant, but none open. There are only about 12 female flower buds, and today the third one just opened. One female is blooming each day, and at this rate they'll all have bloomed and died before the males bloom.
Anyway, what might be causing this? I've had good weather, warm, sunny and not too rainy. They get watered about twice a week now. What can I do to help the males bloom?

imafan26
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Sometimes you just can't get mother nature to cooperate, but if the vine is healthy more flowers will be on the way. It is unusual to have the female flowers come before the males. If you are really really lucky someone else has a vine nearby and the bees will help out with pollination.

Squiggles
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I live in Canada where loofah vines aren't common (I had to plant early last spring indoors) - most people I know still think loofahs come from the sea!

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rainbowgardener
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If you are in canada and your vine hasn't set any fruit yet, will you have time for it to develop before frost? We had a mod here applestar who was trying to grow loofahs and I think had the same trouble of not being able to get it to ripen one in the growing season:

https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/vi ... p?p=166038

"The time it takes for luffa growth, flowering, and maturity can vary widely between plants. It usually requires around 160 days or more, but it could be anywhere from 130 to 220 days or more. Some of the sources on our luffa links page also have botanical and growing information." www.luffa.info

160 days = over 5 months of not just frost-free, but warm growing season, since they don't do well in cold weather. They are really a plant of the tropics and sub-tropics. To grow it in your climate, I would think you would at least need to give it a big head start growing indoors before transplanting out and maybe need a greenhouse.

imafan26
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What rainbow says might be true. If you live in a cool climate and it is just starting to flower now, you might not have time for it to mature.
I live in the tropics and the only trouble with loofa or cee gwa as I know it is finding enough people to give it too. It is spiny which isn't bad, but it is slimy like okra and unless you stuff it or put it in soup it is a hard sell. Loofa would be eaten when it is young. Most of the time, I don't let the fruit mature to produce the sponges and the vine is prolific and long.

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rainbowgardener
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I expect with the reference to confusing them with sea sponges, OP is intending to grow them for sponges. That means they have to stay on the vine until fully mature, which takes even longer than harvesting them at a small size to eat. I'm not guessing there is time left for that to happen.

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applestar
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This thread is reminding me that I really want to try growing them again... Maybe I'll get some seeds for next year 8)

imafan26
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Loofah, like most squashes need a lot of heat to grow. He started them indoors but to get enough time to grow them to seed he probably would have to sow the seed in Mar or April using a heat mat, and keep them warm and growing under lights. Even then, they would still probably grow at a slower rate than in a warmer climate.

Very challenging conditions, but I guess if it succeeds, it can be rewarding too.

Squiggles
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I started the plant indoors about a month and a half before the last frost. It's almost at the 150 day mark now, and there's a bit over a month and a half until first frost this fall. It's been plenty hot here the past few months. The male flowers just opened today finally, so the pollination will happen very very soon! Maybe they won't grow to full maturity, I don't know. I could just eat them in that case. I have faith I'll get at least one though. I was just curious if maybe the soil was lacking in some sort of nutrient and thus causing delayed flowering for the males. Anyway, thanks for your responses!

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applestar
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Keep us posted! :D
If you don't mind my asking, where did you get the seeds?

imafan26
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I don't know where Squiggles got her seed, but they are available from Kitazawa seed. They are located in California but carry a lot of vegetables that we normally like to grow and eat in Hawaii. It is easier to get it from them than to try to get seed from China or Japan, where some of these seeds originate.

https://www.kitazawaseed.com/seeds_luffa_angled.html

Squiggles
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Applestar, I was in Tuscon, AZ three years ago volunteering on an organic farm. They grew loofahs there and I brought one home as a gift for my mom. It still contained a few seeds in it, so I snagged those. This was pretty much the last seed I had left (and still viable after three years :D ). I'm not sure where they got the seeds on that farm, nor what kind of loofah it is for that matter.
Just pollinated my first two flowers today! Will keep you posted as they grow.

SuburbanHomestead
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I would love to grow loofa, but this year I had no luck with any curcubit. Will loofa get the same pests and diseases squashes, cucumbers and melons get?

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applestar
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I would say yes -- especially hot season pests like stink bugs and squash bugs, leaf footed bugs (not SVB's since no hollow stem). I think loofah is more resistant to mildew though.

Glad you bumped this thread -- I wonder how squiggles is doing.... 8)

Squiggles
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The loofahs are coming along nicely! Six flowers pollinated, two died shortly after. Another died later but I have three left. The biggest is nine inches long (that's big for me). All I need is one good loofah to plant a crop for next year! The vine flowered like crazy for awhile, mostly male flowers. I had no pest problems with it either - I guess I got lucky there.

The plant's been handling September's fluctuating temperatures really well too. Some days have been hot, some cold, some in between, most nights have come close to freezing, but the vine is still going - well, it's starting to die off a little now, but it's still flowering (tiny flowers at this point) everyday. Loofahs are hardier than we give them credit for. I'll try to upload some pictures when I get them on my computer.

My next concern now is letting them dry out. Should I leave them on the vine for that? Can I pick them off still green if the frost kills the plant before the loofahs get a chance to dry on the vine?

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GardenRN
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When it comes to squash and gourd vines, I used to worry my head off, try to pollinate by hand etc. The most successful crops come when I just give it up to mother nature. I left a volunteer long handle gourd vine to do it's thing in with the beans this year and the one vine gave me 15 of the biggest I have ever had. True story...lol.

I tried to grow some luffa gourds last year and got nothing. But I only had 3 seeds and I babied them to death. They never even sprouted. If you'd like to trade or sell any let me know. I'd love to have a second go at it!

valley
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Do you have them on a support of some kind? If it's getting cold I'd cover them during the night. Leave them on the vine as long as you can. Dad used to grow them. I transplanted them too late this year, they didn't have time, poor things. Let us know how the drying works out. Good luck.

Richard

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GardenRN
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Valley, I wasn't sure if you were asking me or squiggles.

Mine are on an 8ft tall trellis "tunnel". I covered it with plastic netting and just cut small holes to let the baby gourds hand through and develop with nice straight handles. I already had to take them off though. The first frost killed the vine and one fell from the trellis. Luckily it didn't break, but it wasn't even the biggest one and I didn't want the others to drop and shatter. I have had great luck just leaving them in the yard to dry. Usually takes about 6-8 months. I let the rain, snow and wind hit em at will. Seems to work for me...

valley
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So this isn't a new thing, you've grown them before. Have you eaten them, the smaller ones before they develop the coarse fiber?

I started some early in the greenhouse but being busy we didn't transplant them at the lower ranch until late, too late for them to do anything. Next year.

Richard

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applestar
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Did you take any pictures? Are you crafting them into ladles, etc.? 8)

Squiggles
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The frost killed my vine off just before Halloween and I had to pick my three loofahs while they were still green and heavy. I gave one away but the other two I have don't seem to be doing too well. I opened one up and it was getting a little moldy. The seeds were still white and immature, so I can't do any trading - sorry Garden RN.

They're still drying so we'll see how things do in the long run. If I ever want to grow another vine though, it looks like I'll have to just buy the seeds.

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applestar
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I'm so excited -- I'm going to try growing luffa again. :D

DH received as souvenir from Brazil, dried luffa fibers -- they are intact luffa fruit fibres and are obviously long fruited variety -- about 20-24" I guess (actually 25.5 inches). When I was showing them to my father, I happened to hold them up against the light and REALIZED THERE WERE SEEDS STILL INSIDE! :-() ...I've coaxed a dozen or so seeds out and will be taking the time to get the rest out. 8)

I admit I would not have purchased this variety to grow because the long fruited varieties takes longer to mature... But I have seeds -- what more is there to be said? :mrgreen: Now to go do some serious armchair gardening to plan how to grow. :cool:

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applestar
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In preparation, I looked up old luffa/loofah threads :wink:

Luffa • Loofah links

Here's a thread from last time I grew luffa
Shading wall with trellised vines REALLY WORKS!

Cucurbits - Loofah

luffa - I need all the help I can get!


Photo links are broken in this old post, but this member outlined a successful growing season step by step:
Subject: Growing Luffah and making sponges. Zone 5
Durgan wrote:https://xrl.us/mxa8 Trellis and transplanted into garden 25 May 2006

Loofah plants were put outdoors today 25 May 2006. These three plants were started in February in the basemant, and put in my small greenhouse in late March. The seeds seemed to take forever to germinate and I had several failures. The vine was wrapped around itself, since it was getting out of hand in the greenhouse.

The trellis network is in full sun and about eight feet high about eight feet wide by sixteen feet long. Last year I started late and did not have full sun, so I expect full success this year. The soil is compost, clay and wood chips, which is well drained.

https://xrl.us/ni3k
18 June 2006. Update on the Luffah plants. Four plants are thriving and there are some fruiting bodies.

https://xrl.us/npro Luffah update.
24 June 2006. The fruiting bodie's size can be judged by the mesh in the background, which is 6 sq. inches. The dead branch on the left of the third picture was caused by bird droppings on the junction with the main trunk. I suggest the chemical reaction caused damage.

7 July 2006
https://xrl.us/ose8
Loofah Progress 7 July 2006. One vine was lost for some unknown reason, but about four are doing well. One fruiting body is about 15 inches in length, and there are others forming.

https://xrl.us/paah
21 July 2006. The luffah plants are coming into their own. It rained yesterday, and all plants are now thriving.

https://xrl.us/pt4d
30 July 2006. Luffah are growing well.

https://xrl.us/q438
23 August 2006. Pictures of making my first Luffah sponge. One fruit was ripe so I made a sponge. Neena, my Pomeranian dog, was very interested in the proceedings. I got a total of 14 sponges, some fruit didnt dry, since we had a very wet fall season.

The seeds of 2006 were planted in January 2007 anad I now have four plants growing well. Ths seeds take about 14 days to germinate, planted with sharp end into the soil. I planted three to a pot and had 100% germination this year. The fruit takes about 180 days to mature. I grow them for the lush vegetation and they make a great conversation piece.
Durgan.

kcwil007
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I have the same problem! (female flower appearing first)

This is my first time growing luffa and so far I've only seen ONE flower (and it's OCTOBER!) ...and it's a female flower, which I thought didn't come first???
It looks like there is a little fruit growing at the base, which I don't know how because there are no male flowers in sight (just buds)
Can someone tell me if this looks like it's been pollinated somehow, or will it just fall off and die.
I'm so confused!! :shock:
Picture attached - it's about 3" long...

Thanks everybody!!!!
Attachments
IMG_5340.JPG

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applestar
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Here is the first post from my successful luffah growing experience in 2016. I believe if the flower attached to the embryonic fruit is as fresh as that, you won’t know for sure for another couple of days. The embryo fruit with fading flower in the top middle of the collage dropped off, I think.

Subject: 2014–2016 Luffa • Luffah • Loofah Growing Adventure
applestar wrote:2016 luffah. I did NOT hand pollinate any of these. I keep forgetting to take a picture but two of the fruits fell off last Saturday -- probably because I was clipping off browned leaves and accidentally cut a few supporting tendrils :roll: . (I don't know because these were growing on my neighbor's side of the fence, but he kindly picked them up and left them by my porch. :D )

One is *almost* mature enough, the other one is probably not. But they are hanging in the house in hopes of getting them to develop a bit more.... Here are the rest of the fruits growing strong on the fence. Image

Image
...
There are additional posts after this, but I didn’t report on the luffahs much earlier in the season because I wasn’t sure how successful they would be.

How much time do you have left before first average frost?

kcwil007
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Thanks so much for your reply! The internet says that November 26 is our first frost date, but is that even enough time for the fibers to form for a sponge?
I wasn't sure from your last message, but is the flower dying a good sign or bad sign? Sorry, I'm really out of my element here!

imafan26
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luffa or seegwa (angled gourd) as I know it is a long season summer vine. You need to plant it early in Spring, maybe start indoors as it is sensitive to cold. It takes about 14 days to germinate at 80 degrees (use a heat mat). You can soak the seeds to speed germination, but warm soil is more important. Water seedlings with warm water. It is a vining plant and for me it will get more than 12 ft long. Smooth luffa makes better sponge gourds, but seegwa is better for eating. The other name for it is Chinese okra. It is ridged and has to be peeled since the ridges are hard. It is slimy like okra, so good for thickening soups, stir fries, and you can make tempura with it as well. One vine can be very prolific when grown in full sun and you have at least 150 days of warm weather. It does require pollination, I have a lot of bees so it is not a problem for me.



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