When should I germinate my seeds?

[Beecmcneil]

I just got 124 rose seeds. And I want to know how and when to germinate. der der der. I've done a lot of online reading, but I know how unreliable the Internet can be. It seems as though this is a really reliable website. [/quote]

[cynthia_h]

Roses are most frequently propagated via cuttings rather than seeds. I give my rose "hips" to friends who use them in cooking (jam/jelly, I think).

Since you have so many seeds, though, maybe you could run a small-scale experiment with a dozen or two of them:

1) Take half of the "experimental" seeds and start them according to the advice in our Seed Starting forum, giving them a nice, warm heating mat and watering from the bottom, etc., as if roses were tender, delicate plants. When they're "of age," transplant them into the next size up, hardening them off carefully, and as they grow, move them successively into larger containers until they're ready to go into the ground.

2) Take the other half of the "experimental" seeds and sow them directly into small (4-inch) pots with good, fine-grained planting medium outdoors when the weather warms up a bit (in the Bay Area we've had some beautiful days lately, but I still wouldn't trust the weather; February can get cold and very wet--the rain would wash out the seeds). These seeds are being treated according to the theory that, since roses (Rosaceae family) are related to blackberries (also Rosaceae family), a sturdy, invasive, almost impossible-to-eradicate plant, the roses will be likewise sturdy once they get underway.

Good luck!

Cynthia H.
Sunset Zone 17, USDA Zone 9

[Beecmcneil]

Sounds interesting. The reason I'm trying to start from seeds is cause I don't have rooting hormones. I know it's gonna be hard to get a good plant this way but its what I got to work with. I'm stratifying my seeds, gonna let em go for ten weeks, you think that'll be a good time of year to start my plants?

[cynthia_h]

Ten weeks gives maybe mid-April? should work for the outdoor seeds. The indoor seeds may want supplemental lighting, but the Seed Starting folks will know better than I; I just do in-the-ground seeds.

Cynthia

[Beecmcneil]

Yeah April 15th. I think I'm gonna finish a little earlier than that. Like maybe the 1st. I'm gonna grow outdoors. It's cheaper. I mean I don't have the money to buy a 1000 watt light and ballast. Plus fans and all that jazz. I'm not even gonna be able to buy nutrients or fertilizer. Is there any alternatives to nutrients and fertilizer?

[cynthia_h]

Compost. Are you making compost yet? If not, definitely do so. Cheap/free! Helpful to your plants! etc. Read the Stickies in the Composting forum for help getting started.

Cynthia

[Beecmcneil]

I don't really have anywhere to do compost. I live in a second floor apartment. I guess I could make a compost tea, a friend of mine made one. It smelled awful, but he said it worked well. How do I determine the NPK levels? Or does that not matter. I read somewhere that I should use 20-20-20.

[cynthia_h]

Compost is compost, and NPK is NPK, and never the twain shall meet. (Apologies to Rudyard Kipling)

Worm habitats are amenable to apartment life; we've had some recent discussions about worm composting (aka vermicomposting), so the Search function will probably help you find them. (There was a TON of discussion about it during The Currently Lost Period which search won't bring up for you. *sigh*)

You say you're not "near" me in the Bay Area, but heck, maybe I could recommend a Freecycle list for you so you could get free composting worms or even a starter worm habitat?

Cynthia

[Beecmcneil]

"Near"?

[rainbowgardener]

I don't really have anywhere to do compost. I live in a second floor apartment. I guess I could make a compost tea, a friend of mine made one. It smelled awful, but he said it worked well. How do I determine the NPK levels? Or does that not matter. I read somewhere that I should use 20-20-20.

If it smelled bad, he wasn't doing something right. Probably it wasn't aerated. Anaerobic decomposition is stinky. Oxygenated is not, just smells pleasantly earthy.

The 20-20-20 is synthetic fertilizer, which you said you would not be buying. It is very concentrated, because using synthetic fertilizers, there is no microbial/fungal life in the soil to break down the nutrients into forms the plants can use. Compost, aerated compost tea, worm castings and other natural nutrient sources are full of soil life.

So, if you don't have an outdoor spot for a compost pile, what are you going to do with 124 rose bushes once you sprout them?

And incidentally rooting hormone is not necessary for rooting cuttings, just speeds up the process.

[Beecmcneil]

I'm going to grow them in pots on the roof

[rainbowgardener]

If you have place for pots of rose bushes on the roof, then you have place for compost bin. Plastic compost bins like this:

http://www.hayneedle.com/sale/exacother ... 4AodQW0AXA

take up very little room and are very contained and mess free. It doesn't have a bottom, so you would want to set it on a heavy plastic tarp, but otherwise should work fine. My son did rooftop composting when he was living in a tenth floor apartment.

[luis_pr]

Just do not place any pots near the home exits! If the earth shakes, you do not want to be hit by falling pots when exiting.

[Beecmcneil]

Awesome! So I can do a compost pile. I can do it in a tote right?

[cynthia_h]

"Near"?

From Introductions night before last:

I'm totally excited about learning all kinds of things here. And no Cynthia, I'm not near you.
Well anywho, thanks for the welcome.
I can't wait to start my rose seeds for my fiancé, Ambrosia, and our baby that's in her belly, Poet.
Good day,
Bee.

Sunset zones also affect planting times, tendency toward powdery mildew and other rose plagues, and a multitude of factors re. growing plants. But Freecycle lists range over both wide areas and narrow ones; I'm on at least one of each.

You can do worm composting in a tote; be sure to provide drainage and ventilation holes. There are lots of sites on the Web, but The Source for many of us is Mary Appelhof's trail-blazing book from way back when, Worms Eat My Garbage. I'm currently in my third copy--I keep lending them out and never getting them back. It's that good. See if your local library has a copy; if you like it, then get a copy for yourself, because you'll probably want to write in it!

Cynthia

[Beecmcneil]

I wish I could afford books. I have a baby girl, Poet, on the way. Most of our money goes to rent and feeding mama and Poet and myself.

[rainbowgardener]

That's what the library is for! Congratulations on the baby coming!

What cynthia meant is that you can do worm composting in tote size. You can't really do regular composting in anything smaller than those bins I linked to. The process requires a certain volume of materials.

You don't have to buy bins though (they are getting cheaper all the time). There are lots of plans around for DIY compost bins made out of wooden pallets you can get for free from stores, or other free or Freecycled materials.

[Beecmcneil]

Thanks! I'm so excited to hold her and see her face, and feel her hand wrapped around my finger!
Wish me luck
Bee

[tomc]

I just got 124 rose seeds. And I want to know how and when to germinate. der der der. I've done a lot of online reading, but I know how unreliable the Internet can be. It seems as though this is a really reliable website.

Rose seed has a very hard coat. I tried several times scarifying seeds. After a half dozen years of trials scarification does little to increase or speed of germination.

Rose should probably be cold stratified outdoors over the course of a winter. The person who reads this and interprets it to mean in a refidgerator, is also going bring their seeds in and out of the fridge daily, because it is the cycle of warming and chilling, not mere cold or freezing.

The longer seed is dried the longer it takes to get seed to germinate.

IMO pick 'em, and plant 'em.

Sometimes seed will stay dormant through an entire growing season and germinate the second year. So-o-o discard your spent germinating pans where they can sit undisturbed. You might just get a second at- bat.

I grew mostly rosa rugosa, but over the years if I ran into a good cellar hole rose, I'd come back and pick hips in the fall.