easylife
Newly Registered
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:29 pm

Tomatoes

Hi newB here.I have recently decided to plant some tomatoes for the first time in my life.Im in the sacramento area.My question is this.I sprayed round up a couple of months ago in my backyard(which is undergoing a huge change)and now i want to plant a garden where i may or may not of sprayed round up....What should i do?Remove soil?Lay down plastic and plant over?
Im eventually goin to have a 15x20 area with raised beds but for now im going to just plant some tomatoes for starts.Thanks for any advice.

opabinia51
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 4659
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

My first piece of advice to you is to stop using round up altogether. It does way more harm than it does good. In fact, stop using all poisons for the same reason.

All you can really do that is relatively safe and environmentally sustainable is is try to encourage a healthy, well balanced soil where you have sprayed the Round up.

So, in the fall, collect up fallen leaves, run them over with your lawn mower and lay them in the areas where you sprayed the round up (Round up is very long lasting in the environment and can persist in the soil for at least 10 years after spraying it.) The leaves will help to dilue it's concentration. Lay some manure over top of the leaves to speed their decomposition.

Anyway, for you tomatoes, don't try growing them in the areas where you sprayed Round Up, they may grow but, chances are you will run into a varying amount of problems.

Try to find an area that has some nice, healthy soil and plant your tomatoes there, a spot that recieves a lot of sun is best and try some heirloom varieties if you can find them.

Good luck and welcome to the Helpful Gardener.

Also, give the thread in the "What doesn't Fit Elsewhere" forum on Round UP.

garden girl
Cool Member
Posts: 61
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:10 pm
Location: Humboldt County, CA

Hi! I would buy some 5 gallon containers to plant in sothat you are not consuming anything dangerous, some have recommended smaller, but they are my favorite size because they are big enough to keep a more consistent moisture level.

harleysilo
Newly Registered
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 2:17 pm
Location: Idaho

I would till up the area you have sprayed with round-up. I would add some compost to the soil, and I would plant my tomatoes deep. I should add I would not till into the soil the grass/roots of grass you killed, throw that away. You have more to be worried about getting in your car and driving to the store for your tomato seedlings.... :twisted:

opabinia51
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Posts: 4659
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Tilling actually breaks down soil structure and breaks down recalcitrant soil nutrients that feed plants over many decades. The result is a nutrient depleted soil that becomes either more sandy or more clayey.

So, my advice would be to add some recalcitrant (slow to break down) carbon sources ( leaves, etc.) to rebuild the soil structure and disperse the Glyphosate found in the Round Up.

And please, tell your friends and neighbours not to use the product, it is very detrimental to the environment.

Tammy
Full Member
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:30 am
Location: Faulkner MB Canada

Sorry to say that if round up stayed in the ground for 10 years no farmer in their right mind would use it because nothing would grow then. Farmers spray in the fall or spring, wait for the kill and then till and seed or seed the following spring if the kill was done in the fall.
Round up kills at the root and then the plant breaks down in the soil. Farmers do not throw way the plants that have been killed. the dead plant matter is composted into the soil providing some not alot but some nutrients.
Round up and other sprays need to be used in moderation as with anything else in life, and at the proper plant stage following directions. they also need to be rotated so that there is not resistance build up.
The round up you get at let say walmart or at the local green house is far more diluted than the agricultureal stuff we buy.
I have rounded up my garden in the fall, added grass clippings and leaves and tilled, added more leaves and grass clippings in the spring, tilled and then planted. My mother in law who lives next door thought my garden would not amount to much because it was the first year. She planted extra so i would have some. To her surprise, my garden outpaced hers and we both had so much to give away.
Have you ever noticed or seen farmers gardens? Especially the older generation? Their gardens are 2 to 3 times larger than they planted. Why? Becasue they would move there planted area each year to give last years garden area a chance for the soil rest. Just like we need to rest so does the soil. Now we expect our soil to perform year after year and we have...my soap box for the day!
Of course organic is best because it is, well, organic. But the other ways have their place and should not be so boldly dismissed without the reputable science to back up those claims.

check with a local agriculture office and if you are urban call the closest university with an agricultural department for the lowdown on things like round up.

opabinia51
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 4659
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Round up is actually intended to kill the foliage and not the root, however; glyphosate has detrimental effects on both soil flora and fauna and when using herbicides that are so recalcitrant, they continue to wreak havoc on the environment for years after their intitial use.

Furtermore, these compounds leach into local water supplies, rivers, lakes and eventually make it to the ocean along with all of the water solubler fertilizers that North America and other continents are currently using.

This results in an effect called: Eutrophication where algal blooms deplete the dissolved oxygen from areas in the ocean. The result of this are a series of "dead zones" surroudnign North America.

So using chemicals like Round Up not only have detrimental effects on your local soil and soil biota but, also on the grand scheme of life on this planet.

In actual fact, nature works just fine without all of these human made solutions. If you garden in a manner that is more intune with Nature, you will have reduced disease, reduced herbivory, you will have to spend little to no money on fertilizers and your plants will be much more healthy. Even you lawn will look better.

Tammy
Full Member
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:30 am
Location: Faulkner MB Canada

I'm sorry but you made my husband laugh. I'm not sure if you use a different round up than we do but the round up we have used kills the folage and the root. In it's most simple to understand form the plant "grows itself to death".

You have your way and i have mine. Some where there is a happy medium.

Newt
Greener Thumb
Posts: 1868
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 2:44 am
Location: Maryland zone 7

Tammy, with no disrespect meant, DDT was used for years too and ended up with tragic consequences. When you and your hubby stop laughing, you might want to read this.
https://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/glyphosate2.htm
https://www.safe2use.com/poisons-pesticides/pesticides/organo/glyphosate.htm

Those of us who speak against these products do because we care about the environment and poeple. I hope you understand and are open minded enough to learn about something new. :)

Newt

Tammy
Full Member
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:30 am
Location: Faulkner MB Canada

Hello,
here is a post to check out,
Posted Wed mar 28, veg gardening, post subject killing grass and weeds question
in there you will see that i am open minded to organinc gardening. i believe i say that in that post. In fact i beleive that i said "it was best" but...sometimes we need outside help in problem situations.
You advocate one and only one way of gardening. i see both sides of the coin.
My husand and i do care about the enviroment. We do not regularly use chemicals but there are times when they are used. When we use them we use them responsibly, as directed, when directed, following withdrawl times and safely.
Open mindedness is a too way street thank you.
Tammy

Hortoholic
Full Member
Posts: 53
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 11:49 pm
Location: NH - Zone4

https://www.safe2use.com/poisons-pesticides/pesticides/organo/glyphosate.htm

Description....
It is absorbed mainly through the leaves and is transported around the whole plant, killing all parts of it.
Environmental Toxicity
when glyphosate comes into contact with the soil it rapidly binds to soil particles and is inactivated. Unbound glyphosate is degraded by bacteria. Low activity because of binding to soil particles suggests that glyphosate's effects on soil flora will be limited.
I agree that tilling the soil does more harm than good, but unless your growing native plants in that virgin soil it's not going to yield.....

You must modify the soil first, then it can become a till-free garden.


Thank you for this healthy banter, it forced me to learn more which is always a good thing.... :D

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