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Duh_Vinci
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Tomato - Kumato (commercial variety)

This year, I've enjoyed growing out Campari from a store bought tomatoes, but I just found another tomato from the store that I want to try in 2010 - Kumato

Went to Giant this morning for last minute shopping, and I see this very unusual looking tomatoes for supermarket - deep chocolate brown, not purple, light hint of green on the shoulder and some faint stripes:

[img]https://drphotography.smugmug.com/Garden/2010-Garden/2010kumato2seedcollection/753931388_oodCE-L.jpg[/img]

I was excited to try them as soon as I got home. Impression - 2 fruits, both tasted a little different. One had more pronounced acidity, the other one - a bit sweeter. After doing a little online reading, appears to be commercial variety, no info of hybrid or not (I tend to believe that it is), but described as good keeper, and sweet...

Now, after tasting 2 tomatoes - I would never refer to them as sweet by any means. But, then again, depending on the season, soil, ripening condition and such - this can be the matter of those variables.

What attracted me to this tomato - size, chocolate color, but more importantly - aroma! Very fragrant tomatoes! Even 20 min or so after I tried it, and washed my hands, I can still smell the rich tomato on my hands.

And after a little deliberation:


[img]https://drphotography.smugmug.com/Garden/2010-Garden/2010kumato1seedcollection/753931418_su6zQ-M.jpg[/img]

Collected some seeds from the one that was sweeter. Let the seed fermentation begin!

I'm actually looking forward to growing this one in 2010, hoping to find my "long keeper" after all!

Regards,
D

Tater
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Judging from what i have seen on the world wide web that is way to get seeds for a Kumato. or is there a supplier that I missed?

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Duh_Vinci
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Nope, nothing you've missed. Commercial variety only, no seed sources to my best knowledge (not legitimate seeds anyway) and no transplants.

So for me, specially after reading all these "rave" reviews online, it is a sheer curiosity - how would this variety produce in the open environment of a basic garden with plenty of sun and rich soil...

Regards,
D

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I have tried growing some F2 seedlings from store bought Kumato fruit, and then saved those seeds for an F3 generation, and they came out strikingly similar. I tried an F1 hybrid variety called "Black Velvet", which was remarkably similar to Kumato in physical appearance, being somewhat larger and slightly ovoid, was very crack resistant unlike heirloom varieties, and stored very well. Taste in my opinion is superior to Kumato. The seed is sold by Seedway, which sells to professional growers - however they sell to anybody - the catch is they have fairly large minimum seed orders. The variety was developed by Dr. Kanti of California Hybrids - which produces many fine varieties of tomatoes - including his most famous one Golden Roma.

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gixxerific
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Just checked the Kumato seeds you gave me D_V are doing great I have at least for going in there now. Thanks the fruit in your pic look good. We shall see this summer.

Thanks D_V

Dono

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I spoke to a man at the store about these and he did say that they were a cross between two varieties, one of those being a black one. I cannot remember the name of them, though.
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garden5
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I spoke to a man at the store about these and he did say that they were a cross between two varieties, one of those being a black one. I cannot remember the name of them, though.

This leads me to think that they may not come true to seed. But, hey, you never know so give it a try. :)
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bigdoug
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They look just beautiful. I am a big fan of any and all black tomatoes. I love the perfect mixture of smokey, sweet and acid tastes that you get with them. I grow Black Krim, Paul Robeson, Black Prince and Black Cherry just to have black toms in every size. In fact, Paul Robeson contends with Brandywine Pink for best in show year in and year out at the big tomato festivals.

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Duh_Vinci
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I'm definitely interested to see what this Kumato will do, saved 1 space for this guys. Will post results of the growout as they come up!

Paul Robeson, Black Krim and Noire De Crimee (once a private variaion of Black Krim) among few other black varieties will be grown this year. Thus far, Black From Tula had my personal vote for taste and continuous harvest even during the heat/humidity of VA's mid summer.

Regards,
D

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gixxerific
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I will keep you posted as well I just potted up i think 5 Kumato's not sure how many will end up in the garden maybe 1-3.

How are your Black From Tula's coming I have a few that came up but 2 of the Peat pellets with several seeds did nothing. I did plant some more because this is the one I'm waiting for the most this year. I have heard NOTHING but rave reviews on BFT. I do have maybe 3 BFT's transplanted though.

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Duh_Vinci
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Dono - Black From Tula - my results are similar to yours. I also planned on growing out Spudatula (Potato Leaf version of BFT), and my seeds are from direct source of their "father" in NM), no sprouts yet. So I re-seeded few more, with no bottom heat, will see if there is any difference...

Regards,
D

EDIT - just set few seeds into a damp paper towels and ziplock bag, so I can "see" the process of germination...

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s.studer
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Kumato

I grew some from store-bought fruits last year. Planted in June, was able to get quite a few fruits to mature by end of August.
I just planted some seeds today. I am really curious to see what comes of it.

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gixxerific
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Doing some reorganizing
[img]https://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj185/gixxerific/Gardening/DSC03391.jpg[/img]

Here are some of toms grown from seed from you D_V
The spirodonovskie are on the left the BFT (not from you) are in the middle back, the brandywine are front middle and the kumato are back right.
[img]https://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj185/gixxerific/Gardening/DSC03393.jpg[/img]

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Duh_Vinci
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Dono, you are in full throttle there man!

Good looking plants, nice and green, nice work in doing all the prep and growout!

Dono, one favor to ask, in this picture, bottom right:

[img]https://drphotography.smugmug.com/photos/804629396_Xaxoo-M.jpg[/img]

It is labeled "Brandywine", correct? This plant should be a Potato Leaf, and what I see is a regular leaf. If these were my seeds, one of the following could have happened: Possible cross with either Black Krim or Cherokee Purple were near by, or somehow a stray seed got in the bulk I collected (spontaneous mutation is unlikely, well established variety, but still possible).

If you grow this particular one out, and it turns out a cross, could be an interesting "variety", maybe even worth stabilizing - all three plants (BW, CP and BK were great producers, BW and BK really tasty fruits (BK was good too, but would take 3rd place among this, but 1st place in productivity in hot weather)!

Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease, save some seeds from a largest fruit or two!

Regards,
D

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Kumato Seedling day 7

what do you think? Not all of them germinated. should I plant more seeds or wait?

[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/untitled.jpg?t=1268593749[/img]

BTW, how do you insert pictures in the post? I don't seem to be able to...

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applestar
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Re: Kumato Seedling day 7

s.studer wrote:what do you think? Not all of them germinated. should I plant more seeds or wait?

[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/untitled.jpg[/img]

BTW, how do you insert pictures in the post? I don't seem to be able to...
I was able to fix your code to display the image by changing
from this:

Code: Select all

[img] https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/untitled.jpg?t=1268593749 [/img]
to this:

Code: Select all

[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/untitled.jpg[/img]
Note that in addition to the superfluous data from ? to the end, the space TO THE LEFT OF http was the problem. (I didn't know the space could cause a problem until I was trying to fix yours.)

--
In answer to your question, if you don't have bottom heat or have the seeds in a room temp of 72 or above, it can take 2 weeks or more for the seeds to germinate. Keep moist but not wet. Also, the ones that have germinated look like they need more light. It's a good idea to put them 2~4" under a fluorescent light (CFL or tube). The light will also provide a bit of extra warmth that may help the other seeds to germinate.

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s.studer
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Thank you!

Since I am new to this, I have a few more questions:

1. I do have bottom heat, so should I assume the seeds that haven't germinated are not viable and plant some more?
2. Do I have to remove the germinated ones from the heat mat?
3. Also, should I remove the plastic dome or take the ones that have germinated out and put them closer to the light?
[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/8.jpg[/img]

[/img]

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hendi_alex
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Your seedlings are stretching way too much. Move the light to within a couple of inches of the plants.
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s.studer
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hendi_alex wrote:Your seedlings are stretching way too much. Move the light to within a couple of inches of the plants.
Yes, I did it immediately. Added 2 fluorescent lights and moved them closer.
I now have 1 t5 and 2 T12 lights over the seedlings.

Thank you for your help

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applestar
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I remove the humidity cover and remove the seedling flat to under the lights as soon as I spot the first seedling to lift it's loop above the soil.

My usual rule is, if I spot them sprouting before lights out at night, then I move them first thing in the morning, if I spot them sprouting in the morning, then by lunch time at the very latest.

The reduced temperature, additional air exposure (supplementing with an intermittent air movement with a fan is best) and additional light will help to strengthen the stems. Don't fertilize until they grow true leaves.

Listen, are the seeds you're growing from a store-bought 'Kumato'? Because if it's not, I feel that I should split your query and the subsequent responses to a thread of its own.
Please reply asap.
*** Other members, please refrain from posting in this thread until we get this sorted out. ***

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s.studer
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applestar wrote:I remove the humidity cover and remove the seedling flat to under the lights as soon as I spot the first seedling to lift it's loop above the soil.

My usual rule is, if I spot them sprouting before lights out at night, then I move them first thing in the morning, if I spot them sprouting in the morning, then by lunch time at the very latest.

The reduced temperature, additional air exposure (supplementing with an intermittent air movement with a fan is best) and additional light will help to strengthen the stems. Don't fertilize until they grow true leaves.

Listen, are the seeds you're growing from a store-bought 'Kumato'? Because if it's not, I feel that I should split your query and the subsequent responses to a thread of its own.
Please reply asap.
*** Other members, please refrain from posting in this thread until we get this sorted out. ***
Regarding the seeds, they are the seeds from the Kumato that I grew from store-bought Kumatoes last year. I did bag the flowers and harvested the seeds from fruits that were not cross-pollinated, does that count as store-bought?)

These are some pictures from August 2009
[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/ihone005.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i550.photobucket.com/albums/ii419/sstuder1/ihone007.jpg[/img]

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applestar
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Thanks for your quick response -- and for the photos! :D Looks great! Good luck with this year's too! :()

OK, everyone, anyone else growing 'Kumato' toms? This thread's open to posting! :wink:

p.s. I'm also growing DV's Kumato, Jr.'s Started 3/1, germinated 3/6, and just the tip of true leaf starting to show. Took some photos this morning but not uploaded yet. Looking forward to how they turn out. 8)

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gixxerific
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Same here I have D_V's Kumato's, about 5 of them going, and going wel they are. Very healthy I can't wait.

Another month or so huh? before going outside that's a long time.

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Duh_Vinci
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Dono - I hear you, another month!!! Patience is running out :lol:

s.studer - since I've never grown those myself up to this point - are these indeterminate or determinate? Would you happen to have any pictures of later in the season with mature fruit?

Regards,
D

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DV, do you want to see the Kumato, Jr.'s? Here they are with Campari, Jr.'s
[img]https://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll272/applesbucket/Image6538.jpg[/img]

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Duh_Vinci wrote:Dono - I hear you, another month!!! Patience is running out :lol:

s.studer - since I've never grown those myself up to this point - are these indeterminate or determinate? Would you happen to have any pictures of later in the season with mature fruit?

Regards,
D
I don't know if they are determinate or indeterminate. I was able to harvest in mid September I think and then brought the plants indoors, but they didn't survive long. Unfortunately I didn't think to take any pictures of the plants with mature fruits. The mature fruits looked a lot like this and were really good!
[img]https://www.tomatokumato.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/07/showimage.jpeg[/img]

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s.studer
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applestar wrote:DV, do you want to see the Kumato, Jr.'s? Here they are with Campari, Jr.'s
[img]https://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll272/applesbucket/Image6538.jpg[/img]
Your seedling look so much better than mine!

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Duh_Vinci
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applestar wrote:DV, do you want to see the Kumato, Jr.'s? Here they are with Campari, Jr.'s
Beautiful, thick little babies Apple!
s.studer wrote:I don't know if they are determinate or indeterminate. I was able to harvest in mid September I think and then brought the plants indoors, but they didn't survive long...
That's too bad they had fairly short season! I've searched many sites, but nowhere I could find it's growth habit, I guess will just have to see this year?

Regards,
D

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lj in ny
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I just started a Kumato seed saved from a tomato bought at the grocery store. Kumato's taste A LOT better than any other fresh tomato you can get this time a year, and only $0.10 more per pound. Totally worth it IMO.

I'm interested in how they compare to other tomatoes grown at the height of tomato season. I did find a listing on Tatiana's Tomato Base that says they are indeterminate:

https://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Kumato

Tatiana's also has a picture.
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I was growing Kumato last year. It's a nice and tasty variety, indeterminate, firm (ideal for salads) and juicy. Unfortunately I didn't take any photos (I was to busy saving sees :wink: ). The plant doesn't grow very tall. The fruits are pretty, smooth and shiny.

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Tomato_girl - thank you for the description, looking forward to growing it this year. Firm and tasty, and just the right size for snack of the vine or salads indeed!

Regards,
D

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gixxerific
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D_V I saw some in the store the other day and they were good looking. Slightly smaller than a tennis ball and they looked firm. I didn't buy any though, I have something against store bought tomatoes. :lol: I still have like 5 of yours and can't wait to get them all going.

O.T. I just re-potted a bunch of tom's and gave your special Brandywine an extra special pot still looking great. Will keep you updated.

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