sherdev
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Perennials that Handle Shade until 2pm?

My house is on a mountainside on the west side of the valley. The front of the house faces the mountain and I want to plant perennials there. This area is in shade until about 2pm, at which time the sun blasts it, then goes behind the mountain around 5pm.

This is actually a very small area, maybe 6 feet long. I've planted false sunflowers there but this isn't working. They lean to look for the sun most of the day and then droop when it finally hits them.

Can anyone suggest some perennials that can handle these conditions? I would say it's a dry area but it's no trouble to water it. I have actually planted a "Korean Maple" in front of this bed but since the deer are keeping that pruned, it's not actually providing any shade.

bullthistle
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You might be better off to get the deer out of there because you will be constantly replanting. You could investigate ferns because deer generally will not touch them but as for flowering plants it will be limited because of the deer and a waste of time.

sherdev
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You're probably right, bullthistle. The deer are taking away my will to garden. But this area is right next to the house and though they've nibbled on the maple which is 4 feet from the house, so far they haven't been any bolder.

I might give ferns a try a bit further over where the sun doesn't reach. Thanks for the idea.

GardenRetreat
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I would try Lysimachia clethroides( Gooseneck Loosestrife ). This can be an invasive plant but will grow almost anywhere

Astible is another idea (False Spiraea, Meadowsweet)

Hosta's are another good idea.. they will grow almost anywhere with correct watering..

I could probably come up with several more but I have to go. If you would like some more ideas respond to this and I will post tomorrow
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sherdev
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Astilbe is something I like and hadn't considered. I do have some that ended up in the sun due to losing an old tree and they seemed to be ok.

I have some variegated Hostas that also ended up in full sun and they'd probably look good in this area so I'll try transplanting them.

I would like something taller too because the kitchen window starts maybe 2 feet above the ground and it would be so pleasant to see the flowers from inside. I'm not sure about gooseneck loosestrife, I'll have to look it up. The purple is a no-no here like many places I guess.

Thanks GR, I'd be happy to hear any suggestions you have.

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applestar
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NW side of the house has similar issues -- Heuchera does well there as well as daffodils and holly bush. Grew Moonflower vines one year and they COVERED the front porch. Giant fragrant white flowers that lasted well into the morning since the morning sun didn't hit them.

If acid soil -- Azalea and Blueberries maybe -- not sure if 3 hrs sun is sufficient. Wild strawberries will fruit even in the shade. Mountain Laurel?

Ugh. Getting constantly interrupted here. That's all I can think of right now. :wink:

sherdev
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Hi applestar

I should have mentioned that we get a lot of snow and this bed is under a very steep roof. I tried shrubs but they just got flattened. I would love to be able to grow azaleas. And I think vines would suffer from crushing too. I tried trumpet vine and it just disappeared.

I could try moving some heuchera to this location. I guess I could try translplanting a sample of all my perennials to see how they do.

I wish I could grow this Moonflower. The name alone would be worth it :wink:

The Helpful Gardener
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Here's an article from the front end of the site...

[url]https://www.helpfulgardener.com/design/2003/shade.html[/url]

No sun until 2 PM is full shade. The list is not long, and includes only hosta from the suggestions so far (sorry guys but hours of sun are from ten until three, not enough sun for any of the partial shaders you listed)

. I like fern, hostas, and heucheras together as the shade is short on flowers, but the foliage on these three genus' is an amazing array of color. Try those three groups first to see what you like and we can go from there...

HG
Scott Reil

sherdev
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Thanks HG. I guess my concern is what will happen to the hostas when the intense sun hits them at 2pm?

The Helpful Gardener
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Anything past two is not really full sun; it's starting to get low enough in the horizon it has to come through some more atmosphere to get here. 10 till 2 is the killer sun. Besides certain hostas like 'Krossa Regal', 'Sun Power' and 'Regal Splendor' are heavy substance hostas and can take that kind of sun anyway; darn near full blast if you need them to, but they will love the shade. The fragrant varieties like 'Fragrant Bouquet' or good old H. plantaginea are also better in full sun, so there are options. Stay away from lots of white varigation or thin leaves; steer towards fragrance, yellow foliage, and fragrance...

HG
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perennials deer don't like

I received my https://michiganbulb.com/ catolog and they have lots of flowering perennials thet deer do now like. they will also help with what will grow in your area. Can't hurt to ask them. You can get free catolog, too.

sherdev
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Well thanks, HG. I'm thrilled to hear that I can plant hostas in this area and I'll be sure to look for the fragrance.

Lil, I didn't see anything about deer in the catalogue unless it was the "browse" section. ;) But what I did notice was the hemlock hedges. I started one a few years ago since we have 80 acres of young hemlocks it was an inexpensive solution. Now I'm thinking I should surround the whole garden because I doubt the deer would break through it.

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I have daylilies that grow and bloom very nicely in the northwest part of my yard. They're right up against the south side of a 6' tall hedge and mostly under my cherry tree. They pretty much get full sun from mid afternoon until sundown, and none before that. (I haven't paid attention to the exact hours.) I also have a bunch of daylilies that grow and bloom on the south side of my house. They're in full sun all day. I hardly ever think to water the poor things, except when triple digit temperatures are predicted, but they're doing beautifully.

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Ummm...yeah, deer and hostas may not be a great mix; the deer do seem to like them some better than other plants...and daylilies will take a lot of shade, but this is full shade and you won't get much flower out of them... I always err to the side of foliage over flower when I get to deeper shade and I am never dissappointed...

I still like ferns, especially with deer...

HG
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applestar
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I WAS going to post this in the Permaculture forum but -- I noticed some of my Ostrich ferns started coming up today -- last two days of rain must've helped! :D Only the most sheltered ones so I only got a handful of shoots but enough for breakfast side dish for me -- luckily the kids are still saying, "No thanks! We don't want them." :wink: . Went simple -- just quickly sautéed in butter and a bit of sea salt, a splash of extra virgin olive oil. (Could've used a bit of lemon juice -- I'll remember next time) Mmmm! Can't wait for the rest of them to start growing! 8)
Last edited by applestar on Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

The Helpful Gardener
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Your still ahead of me, but mine should be in soon...

HG
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sherdev
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Kisal, I have some daylilies that I can divide to experiment with so I'll see how that goes. I'll relocate some hostas and I'll see if I can find some ferns in the local nurseries. But I absolutely am not going to eat them! Not even with gobs of butter which is my favourite sidedish ;)

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I have been away from awhile and just read through all the postings... it seems like you are only going to be doing hostas and day lilies??..

I still do not understand why you cannot grow astibles.. they thrive in shade and some sunshine.. I have them in both places in my garden. as long as they get enough water.

I think you should try any plants that say partial shade that is what I did in the part of my garden that just gets that late afternoon sun..

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applestar
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You never now till you try
Same goes for eating them. Ostrich Fern (Matteuccia struthiopteris) shoots are tasty -- somewhat reminiscent of asparagus and green beans. It's the other ones like Cinnamon Fern (hairy and no midline groove) that gives ferns a bad rep.

sherdev
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Ok, I will try hosta, daylily and astilbe. All things I have already in other areas so I can transplant these. It will be an endurance test to see who is still standing by the end of summer. I won't try heuchera because I've found they lean towards the sun and make me feel sorry for them.

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applestar
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:lol: I started reading your reply and thought you were talking about EATING them! :lol:
Actually Daylily flower petals make colorful and tasty addition to salads. They were a great hit with the kids in a "Wildflower Salad" I took to a play date. Someone else was supposed to bring the lettuce, but she didn't, so it ended up being a big bowl of edible flowers and "weeds"! The kids particularly liked daililies and purslane -- one mom told me her daughter NEVER eats salads, and there she was, munching away! :cool: But don't worry, I don't make anybody (including my kids) eat anything they don't want to. :wink:

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