what to do what to do.... worm compost

[sheeshshe]

I put my worm bin outside for the summer etc and now its getting cold so I need to do something about it but I don't know what. I can't leave it outside because itll freeze, but at the same time I can't bring it back in here because it is FILLED with fruit flies etc. what on earth should I do? leave it to all die over the winter? I really don't want to infest my home with fruit flies all winter long like last winter. my DH will NOT go for that. and right now it is completely infested. thoughts? ideas?

[applestar]

Sift the worms out with chickenwire or hardware cloth and start a fresh bin with new bedding?

[markaw]

I put my worm bin outside for the summer etc and now its getting cold so I need to do something about it but I don't know what. I can't leave it outside because itll freeze, but at the same time I can't bring it back in here because it is FILLED with fruit flies etc. what on earth should I do? leave it to all die over the winter? I really don't want to infest my home with fruit flies all winter long like last winter. my DH will NOT go for that. and right now it is completely infested. thoughts? ideas?

I would put the worms in to the ceter of a compost pile if you have one as there would be plenty of heat for them to survive any cold spell,
Not only that they would help with providing you with excellent compost for your garden ready for the spring,

[sheeshshe]

Yeah, I don't have an outdoor compost pile. I was just doing the worms...

[applestar]

So, what DID you do?

I'm getting ready to start up my winter worm bin again. I found it was too tedious to try to maintain the worm bin during the warm months. I'm more apt to go outside and take the kitchen scraps with me. I kept 1/4 of a tray of bedding and worms inside, barely fed and maintained -- in fact I'll have to make sure they're still alive, but I haven't smelled any foul odor from them. I was afraid to put the bin outside because I thought they'd get too hot, too dry, etc. I was also concerned about ants invading.

I find it easiest to deal with indoor fruitfly outbreak by vacuuming up the adults -- they land on predictable surfaces -- and setting homemade traps.

[sheeshshe]

I've done nothing. <bag over head> I can't decide. and the yellow jackets and flies are having a fun time with all the apple peelings I've thrown in it and I don't dare touch it or go near it! (made a bunch of applesauce)

I really have no idea what to do. can I bury the bin in the ground and cover it with straw? IDK!

I read somewhere that I could maybe put it in my chicken coop, but then there wont be room for my chickens LOL!

[rainbowgardener]

I've never done worm composting, just outdoor pile (which I keep adding to all winter), so this is all speculation, but here's some thoughts:

do you have somewhere protected that isn't in your house to put it? You mentioned the chicken coop, but how about a garage, garden shed, etc.

We have some times made a little "house" to give the outdoor cats some winter protection out of hay/straw bales. Could you do that for the worm bin, being sure it was up off the ground too?

Or Apple's suggestion about sifting the worms out

Or dump everything (bury it in a garden bed, since you don't have an outdoor compost pile) clean the bin out thoroughly (perhaps with a little bleach solution or something to remove fruitfly eggs) and start over fresh indoors. If you do that, be sure if you are going to add banana peels or other fruit remains, freeze them first to kill fruitflies/eggs before you put them in the worm bin or you will get the fruit flies back.

[sheeshshe]

hmmmm.... I could put it in the shed, do you thin that'll be enough?

[Green Mantis]

I just made a worm bin a couple of days ago, out of a plastic tote. Drilled holes in the top of the lid, then along the sides, 2 rows of holes. Then in the bottom. I had already ordered the worms and I was really excited when they came.---I put mesh on the bottom, so they can't get out, with a tote lid underneath for drippings. Inside I put damp newspaper, a couple of inches of Topsoil, then straw, then leaves and more shredded newspaper. I put the food in about halfway down, then covered it back up. When I put the worms in with the food they have been doing nothing but eating!-----I keep the tote in our furnace room. Seems to be working very well. I am composting outside too, but in the winter here, I'm not going to get anything for my potted plants.-------Plus I want something ready to put under seedlings when I go to plant in the spring.-----So guess I have "new' Pets, LOL!!! Really fun to work with though. Plus I just go to the furnace room with tablescraps. So far works great. I check to make sure it's damp enough everyday, and just feed those food loving muncher's! ----First try at this, but I did a lot of research before I ordered the red wriggler worms, so hopefully it will be a success. -----I love this site! Never would have tried this before I came on here!

[sheeshshe]

still haven't done anything with it! I'm bad. but they're completely invaded with bees. honey bees, yellow jackets, wasps. you name it.


I dn't know what I'm going to do still. I don't want another fruit fly invasion all winter long again. my DH is not going to tolerate that. thats why they went outside in the spring. I just couldn't get the fruit flies under control in the house because of my bin. I'm afraid my worm compost is done for in a few weeks ;(

[applestar]

Maybe the first step is to go out there on a cold frosty night and evict the lot out of your wormbin. Whether tp rescue and recover the worms or not, you can decide later.

[sheeshshe]

I think that the bees leave the bin when its getting dark... but how do I get rid of the fruit flies?

[soil]

but how do I get rid of the fruit flies?

stop feeding and let the worms eat what is in there and then wait a few more days to slowly start feeding again.

[The Helpful Gardener]

Mix in paper shreds (it will heat, worms love it and it will get rid of the bacterial ferment that is attracting everyone else... wood shavings would be good (no treated wood).

Is this bin open to the soil on bottom? The worms will go south to avoid freezing if it is. The hay bale idea is pretty cool, too...

[applestar]

I was thinking more along the lines of dumping the lot and cleaning out the worm bin, actually. Of course if you dump the contents on the ground the worms will "head south," but I was thinking more along the lines of putting the contents in a tub or a tarp and breaking them apart to discourage the bees/wasps from staying.

Once that's done and you have a clean bin to start over with, AND anything that might sting you are gone (plus hopefully the contents are somewhat dried enough to do so) you can go back and sift out the worms. If you are concerned about ANY fruit fly larvae or eggs remaining on the slimy worms, you could even give them a brief bath in rainwater.... You could start afresh -- set up the wormbin indoors with fresh bedding and tuck the worms in.

You should still end up with sifted finished wormcompost and unfinished wormcompost after sifting the old compost. You could use them outside or you could make AACT with them, effectively drowning any maggots while extracting all the nutrients and microbes.

[Green Mantis]

You can buy things that catch the fruit flies in the house. Go to your local hardware store and look around? Get a few and put them around your compost bin, once you get it back inside, you should be fine? As long as you get rid of the bees.

[The Helpful Gardener]

Cut the top third off of a two liter soda bottle.

Invert and insert. Secure with tape

Fill bottom two inches with vinegar.

Instant fungus gnat trap.

HG

[Blue Fox]

HG, do you mean put the top of the soda bottle upside down in the bottom part? Sorry if I have a hard time picturing this. A photo would be great!

[The Helpful Gardener]

Yes Blue Fox; exactly what I meant. You have pictured it just fine... Just leave a big enough gap between the mouth of the now inverted bottle and the vinegar for the flies to get into the space (secure the two cut edges together with the tape). TA-DA!

HG

[Troppofoodgardener]

I just made a worm bin a couple of days ago, out of a plastic tote. Drilled holes in the top of the lid, then along the sides, 2 rows of holes. Then in the bottom. I had already ordered the worms and I was really excited when they came.---I put mesh on the bottom, so they can't get out, with a tote lid underneath for drippings. Inside I put damp newspaper, a couple of inches of Topsoil, then straw, then leaves and more shredded newspaper.

Any pics to give me some tips? I've just started a worm farm too, but made it out of a polystyrene box. The worms don't seem to be eating the food at all..

[The Helpful Gardener]

Polystyrene might not be my first choice for container...

Here's our favorite [url=https://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_Chemical.jsp?Rec_Id=PC35643]chemistry site on polystyrene[/url], Not as bad as some of the chemicals out there, but note it is listed as a toxin, and is noted for gassing off by some folks. Worms may not like it.

Are you mixing carbons like paper into the soil? Worms like that as much or more than the food and it sops up moisture (and holds it too). I like brown paper bags, napkins, that sort of thing. Use this as your first layer, wetting it down to compact it and then the food. Ground up is better than not, but they will shred it up eventually either way.

Try layering some compost on top of the food to aid decomposition. The critters in compost will help keep the food from getting nasty smelling, and worms eat the critters eating the rotting food as much as eating the food itself. Compost adds them. This also helps "mulch" down the other layers, and worms live in soil, this makes them feel right at home...

Paper, foods, compost at every feeding and they would probably like a more stable plastic for home. One man's opinion.

HG

[Troppofoodgardener]

hmm.. never knew that polystyrene was toxic to marine animals! I chose it for its breathability. It is porous after all, but I guess there's a host of other negatives.

I've made the bedding out of a mix of finely shredded paper, grass clippings and compost. I've sorta mixed it all through rather than have them in separate layers. Does that make a difference or is it better to have layers? It's moist enough and I've cut the food up in very tiny pieces. I've also added used teabags and crushed eggshells.

I emailed my worm supplier, they said that the worms aren't feeding yet as the majority are still babies. I got mainly worm capsules and juveniles in a form of a worm 'bomb'. Apparently they only reach maturity in 2-3 months. So I have a bit more to wait...

Another question: if the worms are eating paper which also forms part of the bedding, how much shredded paper do I need to put in each time?

[johnphall]

Awesome! This is what I was looking for. I wanted to do this for a long time and now we have the right place. Thanks for sharing.

Cheers.

[Green Mantis]

Just make sure the bin is at least 3/4's full, wih leaves, grass whatever. As they eat it down, keep topping it up. I have topped mine up 2 or 3 times now. They seem very busy!

[Troppofoodgardener]

Thanks Green Mantis! just what I needed to know I can't wait til they actually start eating.

I found a worm in my farm kinda buried in a chunk of organic matter. When I picked up the chunk, the worm just kinda lay there, half in half out. Eventually it made a very slow attempt to escape the light. Is that normal? Was the worm asleep, sick?
It was quite small.. about an inch long, and very skinny, 2mm thick.

Unlike the monster worm I found in the garden the other day while digging! That guy was about 7inches long and 9mm thick. And wriggling quite strongly when I picked it up carefully.

[applestar]

I started my worm compost bin with the worms I found actively feeding in my compost pile. This forum was my impetus to start one -- that and a store closing sale last fall where I found a Can-o-Worms for 1/2 price!

Hey! I could cut a piece out of that coir rug to make a new blanket for my worms too!

[rainbowgardener]

I'm thinking maybe this will finally be my impetus to do some worm composting also, at least for the winter. Our programmable thermostat is set down to 59 at night and during the day while we are at work. Is that too cold for them?

[Green Mantis]

That shouldn't be too cold for them, as long as they have lots of paper, grass clippings or leaves to burrow in. Mine are doing great. This little experiment has to be the cheapest experiment for me ever! LOL!! Plus the most fun. Every time I take food scraps out there, I have to keep looking in too see how they are doing. Probably getting tired of that! Remember to keep it slightly damp too.

[Blue Fox]

Every time I take food scraps out there, I have to keep looking in too see how they are doing. Probably getting tired of that!

Me too! I stir it around a little too, as I found the lower layers are a bit too wet. I'll have to check again soon, as I haven't for a week or two. I keep three Rubbermaid tubs in Glory Be, the root cellar which stays just above freezing even in very cold (-20 Celcius) outside temps. I occasionally put my kitchen scraps in, about every sixth time I empty them. Otherwise they go into my outside compost - a wire bin with another bigger one around it filled with leaves. The number of worms in there was amazing!

[Green Mantis]

I am too nosy to look every two weeks! I found my bin was getting a bit wet at the bottom awhile ago too, so I dug in and turned everything so there was no more dampness. Seems to help every so often. They are still working away down there, where it is wet seems to be the most soil like. But turning does help. Not too violently though. Just nice and easy. Shouldn't be too long and they will have finished the first of all the bedding I put in there for them. I topped it up again yesterday, they really go through the leaves etc. Very interesting experiment though. The only expense was buying the worms. I had all the other stuff here already. Even my husband has gotten interested in them, he takes his coffee grounds and filter out every day, and finds it interesting to see what's going on too. This is one experiment that will keep going from now on. But if I hadn't found this great site, I wouldn't have ever tried!

[Green Mantis]

Rainbowgardener----59 isn't too cold for them. Go ahead and get started having fun! We are finding the worm bin super interesting!

[rainbowgardener]

I did get started. I posted "I HAVE A WORM BIN!" in some thread that I'm not going to go looking for right now. But now my worm bin is starting to get some kind of little flies in it, maybe fruit flies, though I have not put any fruit in it. Not sure what to do about that. Every time I open the bin a few fly out. I don't want them to get established in the house.

[applestar]

They might be fungus gnats. Try putting a little open container of soapy water inside the worm bin on top of the bedding.

If they're fruitflies, make a vinegar trap with a tiny one-way funnel opening (I tape a rolled up magazine subscription card to a bottle). Baiting with small piece of spoiled fruit (bruised spot, core, peel, etc.) and apple cider vinegar does the trick.

[Green Mantis]

It talks about the little flies earlier in this thread, but they don't seem to get established in the house. At times I have opened the lid and lots have flown out. When it's wetter, they don't seem to be around as much. Fruits, and tomatoes I bury a bit deeper. If anything attracts them, it seems to be those sort of things. Maybe you need to add more bedding on top? But I wouldn't worry about them getting established in the house. When I added more leaves and food the other day, I turned the stuff a bit, so it wasn't so wet and then put the food down in the middle. There were no fruit flies this time at all? Guess this is something we can all do some researching on, and see just when there are fruit flies, and when there are none? Something to check on. As there really isn't too much else to do with the worm bins inside in the winter! It's a topic anyway, after all winter can get boring!

[rainbowgardener]

Checked my worm bin (I'm still so impressed with myself that I actually have a worm bin after all these years of only doing compost piles!). Only one more little fly came out, so I'm not worrying about it yet. Seems to be working well. Kitchen scraps keep disappearing, there seem to be more and bigger worms than I put in there. So I added another serving of coffee grounds and kitchen scraps, some more bedding material (that seems to disappear too), some more leaves.

Questions:

1) I found several things in there that I thought might be cocoons. But I looked up worm cocoon pictures and it's not these. They are whitish, shorter and thicker than the worms but definitely not tear drop or roundish like the cocoons, and highly segmented. Don't seem to move a lot and didn't have any visible legs. Anybody know what they are? Is it going to hatch out into something creepy? Do I need to post a picture?

2) No sign of any worm tea coming out the bottom yet. Should there be by now? The first batch of worms has been in there a bit over two weeks.

3) When I put the worm bin together everything was in nice layers, bedding at the bottom, then leaves, worms, food, more leaves, brown paper. 17 days later, what with digging around in it to check on the worms, adding stuff, the action of the worms themselves, everything is kind of jumbled up. Does it matter?

[Green Mantis]

Doesn't seem to matter if everything is jumbled up, at the bottom, ours is the same way. They seem to be eating into that newspaper I put at the bottom originally now. I haven't seen any signs of worm tea either. Maybe a bit early for both of us? As for the bugs or whatever, I wouldn't worry. When I was moving the stuff around one day, there were little white worms, tiny things. I at first thought they were baby worms, but they aren't apparently. I read somewhere on here they aren't. But not harmful. A picture might be interesting, then I could go digging in my worm bin to see if there is the same thing in there.--I think I just like looking in there, and any excuse is good enough! Lol! Glad to hear you only had one fruit fly this time.---I do remember seeing that you posted that you finally had a worm bin, but now I can't find where it was.---Fun isn't it! By the time spring comes, we should all have some lovely worm castings to add to our potted plants and outdoor seedlings.-----If nothing else it's something to do when you can't do much in a garden, for the cold and frozen ground. They really do go through their bedding don't they? When I first got the worms in the mail, they were quite skinny, not anymore, plus there are more of them. At this rate a person could keep them going without buying more worms for years. Cheapest beasties Iv'e ever fed! Makes it even more fun! Hubby doesn't get upset I'm spending too much on feed, Ha! Maybe for christmas, I will get another bin ready and then put some worms in a little later. Make my own christmas present Some women dream of jewlery, I dream of worm bins! Good Luck with that Worm bin!

[rainbowgardener]

Pictures aren't great, but here's the mysterious beastie:

[img]https://i602.photobucket.com/albums/tt102/rainbowgardener/larva1.jpg[/img]

[img]https://i602.photobucket.com/albums/tt102/rainbowgardener/larva2.jpg[/img]


it isn't really as dark as that, that's from the flash, more dark cream colored or light brown. It is rounded on one end, pointed on the other, and has teeny little bristles. (The second picture shows the pointed end better, but it has a little clod of dirt stuck to it.) I expect it is a larva of something, but it would be nice to know what before it hatches out.

I didn't see these in any of the stuff I put in the bin, though of course I can't guarantee they weren't there. But I'm thinking they appeared since then, like maybe they were much smaller or they were eggs or something at the time of loading it up...

[Green Mantis]

Don't know what THEY are, but I think I would be getting rid of them. They don't look very worm bin friendly. Actually they look pretty yucky to me. I definately would be tossing them. Must have come in on some dirt or? Not nice looking though. If you ever find out what they are please post OK? Thanks.

[rainbowgardener]

I should have said the pictures are about X2 life size.....

I got rid of the one I photographed. Not sure if it is worth the trouble to comb through it to try to find the others, I know there's at least a couple more. I'll wait to see if anyone has ID.

[rainbowgardener]

no one knows what my critter is? I have seen them in my compost pile sometimes too. It is hard bodied, not soft and squishy like a worm....