MaxDread
Newly Registered
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:35 am
Location: Norfolk, United Kingdom

Advice on pruning young apple, pear and medlar trees

Hi all

I am new to fruit trees, having bought some last year. Now is the time to prune and I have been reading loads about the subject but am still unsure as to what would be best.... For these three trees I don't know whether they would be best suited to an open vase shape or central leader. They were bought last year as "2-year bush" trees; suggesting they were pruned to be open vase at the nursery. The nursery said that they could be trained to either form, but when I spoke to another nursery about them I was told it would be best to stick to the original form (open vase) and not to change it at this stage of development. However, each tree has a very central branch and not too many at a good angle to form an open vase. So I really don't know. Perhaps I should go for modified central leader...? I'm very confused and would be great to hear what people on the forum would suggest. Other pruning advice would also be most welcome. Here's some details and a pic of each.

Rosemary Russet Apple Tree. M26 rootstock. 3 years old.
Rosemary Russet Apple Tree Feb 2017.JPG
Discovery Apple Tree. M26 rootstock. 3 years old.
Discovery Apple Tree Feb 2017.JPG
Packham's Triumph Pear Tree. Quince A rootstock. 3 years old.
Packhams Triumph Pear Tree Feb 2017.JPG
Aside form those trees, I have an Obelisk Pear Tree (columnar/pyramidal) and a Dwarf Medlar Westerveldt. I've been told that for both of these trees no pruning is ever required except for general shaping and the removal of the "3 Ds". Would people agree with that? Again. here's pics and details:

Obelisk Pear Tree. Quince A rootstock. 3 years old.
Obelisk Pear Tree Feb 2017.JPG
Dwarf Medlar Westerveldt. It's either 3 or 5 years old - not sure which!
IMG_1330.JPG
Huge thanks to anyone who can help.

Kind regards

Max

PS - I am in the UK.

JONA
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Posts: 812
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:11 am
Location: Sussex. England

Hi Max
First the Medlar,
Nothing really to do here
.just water and feed and let it grow.

Now the rest.


First I would for future reference get a couple of things off my chest.
It does anger me that nurseries offer trees at full price to customers that growers would never accept. Apart from a very few varieties of apples and pears which have problems producing feathers (side shoots) a well grown tree should have a minimum of 8 to 10 feathers at even the maiden stage.. giving the grower the best opportunity to have a good shaped tree for many years to come. He should not have to fight for the first few years of the trees life trying to get a good basic shape into the tree.

Sorry Max. But it does make me feel sorry for you folks who then have this battle at the start.
Nuff said!


The Obolisk.
The whole purpose of this type of tree is to have a true column shape.
You have to look at the tree and try and keep the strength of the wood grading from the strongest at the bottom and the weakest at the top. If the side shoots at the top are allowed to become strongest then the tree can rapidly turn into a top heavy bottle brush.
So that means removing any shoots from the top of the tree that are as thick or thicker than those down low.
General pruning should not be needed on these trees...but keep that ..thinner at the top look, If you can.



The Packhams.
You need some shoots down lower on the tree. So, first get that thickish lower branch tied down to as near to horizontal as it will go without snapping. This will encourage fruit bud to develops along its length and slow its growth rate down.
For the moment leave the top untouched as you don't want that to race away by encouraging the sap to charge up there. All those other lower shoots tip back just a few inches to an outside bud to try to stimulate growth down lower in the tree and eventually give the tree a more even shape.

The Discovery.
Discovery is a tip bearer and so don't go tipping the shoots back on this tree . You could just tip the leader back a little just to make it the dominant shoot...it pays in centre leader trees, like yours are, to use the top of the tree as a control tap as they get to full height. If the trees growing too strong...leave only weak shoots at the top...if the trees not the height that you want...leave the top with strong shoots. This then controls the sap flow through the tree.

The Russet.
As you say..the trees are more centre leader looking than open vase.
If you want to make an open vase on them you will have to perform hard surgery and prune them down to half way between your knee and thigh. Removing all that top growth. Something that was done in all our orchards many years ago....but on maiden trees ( 1 year olds).
I would go for the centre leader shape.
But...on this tree I think you have to do a little work to get the shape you want.
First get those two lower side shoots tied down to a lower angle. The large one on the right of your picture leave untipped. At the moment it's almost as strong as the top of the tree and you don't want it to become even more dominant by encouraging growth on it. Tying it down will slow it up and give it time to produce fruit bud along it.
The other side shoots that are much weaker tip back A few inches to an outside bud to try and get them to grow.
Now the drastic one.
You've got those lower shoots down and the weaker tipped so you need to put a slight check on the top of the tree while the lower ones develope.
At the top you have a fairly strong leader and just below it a weaker shoot.
I would leave the leader untouched but tip that weak side shoot back a couple of inches to an underneath bud. This will normally force the shoot to produce two smaller shoots during the summer while taking power off the leader.
Next winter you can look again to see what the response has been.
Hope that helps.

MaxDread
Newly Registered
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:35 am
Location: Norfolk, United Kingdom

Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed and helpful reply. I've asked on some other forums, and been reading and watching videos. There's plenty to think about! It's quite a tricky topic for a newcomer as people seem to approach it in such vastly different ways, both in terms of the finer details and the major ones such as whether to even prune or not!

JONA
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Posts: 812
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:11 am
Location: Sussex. England

All I can suggest Max is that you have a go.
All gardening should be fun.
The problem for fruit trees is the one I moaned about at the start. A well grown tree could be left to its own devises for a few years if the gardener wanted and although it would eventually get 'messy' it's basic shape wouldn't be too bad and could be brought back under control without too much difficulty.
Alas, so often the trees that are offered for sale are so poorly shaped at the start that left alone they will become very difficult to do the job they were bought for in the first place....give nice fruit!
Whatever you do Max.....enjoy your garden.



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