Can I grow peppers in zone 5?

[garden5]

I'm talking about from seed, not from store-bought transplants.

Last year, I started some seeds indoors around March and placed them outside in I think June. They never got that big and only yielded about one pepper per plant (sweet banana).

On the other hand, my store-bought jalapeno transplants did very well and yielded way more peppers.

The main difference that I can see between the two is the size when planted: the jalapenos were about seven in. tall whereas my sweet bananas were only two or three in. tall.

Do I need to just start my plants earlier or am I too far north?

I should also note that all I fed my seedlings was water and I used no grow lights. Are these things essential for growing peppers, or won't they make much difference? Is there some type of fertilizer (organic only!) that I should feed the seedlings?

I am trying to learn all I can about growing plants from seed, thanks for your great advice.

[treeguy]

good news you can grow peppers I'm also from OH I planted mine in march used lights and kept them nice and warm when did you trans plant I think I set mine out in the begging of may It our 50/50 percent to get or not to get a frost you could also try to make a minni hoop house I use 1/2" pvc usally I cut down to 4-6 ft but you can make it as big as you need stick both ends in the ground to make a bow I run this the lenth of the row for long rows I use T's and 4 way's to conect the pipe in the middle put plastic ofer the whole works and then use rocks or dirt to hold down the clear plastic be carefull if the sun is shining bright it will get hot in there I have had the same pvc for about 5 years now still in pretty good shape

[garden5]

I started them in the end of February and planted them in the end of May. They were only two and a half inches when planted.

Maybe grow lights really do make a big difference. I'm starting my plants in the beginning of February this year. Although I don't have any grow lights, I plan on surrounding the plants with some aluminum foil. Has anyone else had any results doing something like this?

Thanks for any tips.

[rainbowgardener]

I'm in southern Ohio in zone 6 and I do peppers from seed every year. You just have to realize that they are slow and start early. I start mine beginning of February under lights. Yes, you have to have lights. Peppers are full sun plants. Sitting on a windowsill near cold drafts in short, grey winter days will NOT cut it. But it doesn't have to be fancy grow lights. I use regular shop light fixtures with regular fluorescent tubes. Very cheap! But they hang just a few inches above the seedlings and they are on 16 hrs a day. Bottom heat helps for germinating the seeds - I use a plain pharmacy heating pad sitting under the tray. They get started a lot faster with bottom heat, though I have germinated them without it, just slower.

Most potting soils have fertilizer in them, Miracle Gro, usually, not an organic product. I'm mostly an organic gardener, but for starting seeds I do use the M-G potting soil. Starting seeds in a tray in my basement isn't a natural environment anyway. Once the seedlings have sprouted there are a variety of organic fertilizers (some fish or seaweed based) you can add. Again, like the bottom heat, you don't really have to, but it does definitely speed things along.

[garden5]

Thanks for the advice. I thought that my small seedlings might have been because of lack of artificial lighting.

How big are your peppers when you plant them? Is Feb 1 too soon to start peppers? That's when I think I will start mine this year.

To review; for peppers: Artificial Lights: necessity----Heating Mat and Fertilizer: optional.

Do I have to use fluorescent lights or will any type of artificial light do?

Oh, and by the way, does anyone recommend a good book on starting plants from seed?

Thank for clarifying things. Sorry for all the questions.

[TZ -OH6]

In addition to what has been said about getting strong seedlings there are a couple of factors to consider after the plants go in the ground. Peppers are tropical/subtropical plants and their roots need warm temperatures to work efficiently. This year I planted my strong pepper seedlings deep and had a terrible time because the spring was relatively cool and soil temperatures didn't increase until July so even though I had my plants in the ground a week before the last frost (mid May) I saw almost no growth for another six weeks. If I would have planted shallowly in a raised burm I would have had better results early in the season. Many northern growers prefer growing peppers in containers for this reason, and some will open up the bottom of containers and then partially bury the container so that the plants get early season warmth and access to soil moisture under the container later in the summer.

Because of the temperature issue I'm not so eager to get my peppers started before my tomatoes since they don't grow very well if planted out at the same time.

[garden5]

In addition to what has been said about getting strong seedlings there are a couple of factors to consider after the plants go in the ground. Peppers are tropical/subtropical plants and their roots need warm temperatures to work efficiently. This year I planted my strong pepper seedlings deep and had a terrible time because the spring was relatively cool and soil temperatures didn't increase until July so even though I had my plants in the ground a week before the last frost (mid May) I saw almost no growth for another six weeks. If I would have planted shallowly in a raised burm I would have had better results early in the season. Many northern growers prefer growing peppers in containers for this reason, and some will open up the bottom of containers and then partially bury the container so that the plants get early season warmth and access to soil moisture under the container later in the summer.

Because of the temperature issue I'm not so eager to get my peppers started before my tomatoes since they don't grow very well if planted out at the same time.

Thanks for the tip. I think that I will not set out my plants until June this year.

I never knew that pepper plants could be planted deeper and the stem would create roots like tomato plants. Pepper stems seemed more woody to me so I though that they would not do anything if planted in the ground.

Good tips.

[rainbowgardener]

Well TZ was talking about soil warmth. I start my peppers indoors in February and put them in the ground somewhere between mid-April and 1 May depending on the weather. But I'm a small scale backyard gardener and TZ is a farmer. I grow my peppers in a raised bed which sits on top of concrete. So it's a limited amount of soil, sort of like a 4'X8' container and it's elevated. I sometimes water early in the season with warm water from the tap to help warm the soil up. They do just fine that way and get an early start.

But it's all about conditions and what works for me with my few little raised beds isn't the same as what will work for TZ with acres and may not be the same as what will work for you.

[TZ -OH6]

Actually I'm not a farmer, I'm a biologist/ecologist. I teach rather than do. I did grow up with a dairy farm and corn fields across the road, but my garden is hacked out of compacted clay subsoil left from construction of the house/yard.

[rainbowgardener]

I said that because I was thinking I remembered you posting pictures of turning your land with a tractor. But I went looking for it and I think I had you mixed up with someone else, sorry!

But I'm guessing you still garden larger scale than I do...

Anyway my only point is that what works for one person in their location, with their scale of gardening, climate, etc etc is not necessarily the same as what works for someone else.

[garden5]

Do you think that, all else being equal, pepper planted slightly later, when the soil is warm, will outperform peppers planted earlier, when the soil is cooler?

I'm thinking that this may be an interesting experiment to try this year.

[jal_ut]

I am thinking you can grow peppers just fine. I would plant the seed about the second week of February. Yes, bottom heat will help them germinate faster, and you need grow lights. When May arrives it is time to start to harden them off, but don't plant them out until memorial day. The soil needs to be warm and it must be past frost.

[BrianSkilton]

I grew around 35 pepper plants last year, and had peppers coming out of my ears, and I live in South Dakota. I started my pepper plants from seed in February, so start your seeds soon. I just use aluminum lasagna trays with bottom heat and plastic lids. For the bottom heat I use old fashioned heating pads. The pepper seeds will germinate in 4-5 days, depending on how hot the pepper is. I am technically in zone 4b, and I had no problem growing peppers. I was still getting peppers late in the season, up until the first frost.

[garden5]

I grew around 35 pepper plants last year, and had peppers coming out of my ears, and I live in South Dakota. I started my pepper plants from seed in February, so start your seeds soon. I just use aluminum lasagna trays with bottom heat and plastic lids. For the bottom heat I use old fashioned heating pads. The pepper seeds will germinate in 4-5 days, depending on how hot the pepper is. I am technically in zone 4b, and I had no problem growing peppers. I was still getting peppers late in the season, up until the last frost.

Thanks for the inspiration, everyone. I think I may be able to have a successful pepper-from-seed garden after all.

BrianSkilton, did you use grow lights?

[BrianSkilton]

I use fluorescent tubes cool white or daylight. You can also experiment with one cool fluorescent tube, and one warm fluorescent tube. The blue spectrum of light is used more for green growth, while the red spectrum of light is used more for blossoms and fruiting. Anyway, I just use a 4 foot T8 Daylight fluorescent tube, one of which recently broke, so I had another fun cleanup, dealing with mercury. I so badly want to use LED tube lights, but they are very expensive.

[pharmerphil]

Last summer, raising peppers was a little tougher for Us here in Minnesota, we had a very cool period when it should have been in the 80's.
Yet, Our 125 hot pepper plants, raised from seed did very well. the summer before, we had 186 plants out, we still have a few pounds of processed peppers left over..They'll be fine, follow these folks reccomendations and you'll be fine...

Hello everyone, winter weather has had me in quite a funk...but I'm back!!

[garden5]

Thanks, pharmerphil and BrianSkelton.

I'm thinking that my problem last year was partly starting too late (end of Feb.), but mostly my problem was probably due to the lack of any grow lights. There may have been a few other things, but I feel that these were the main two.

Brian, I did not know about warm/cold fluorescent lights. I plan on using 6000k bulbs this year; I don't know if these are cool, warm, or if there are both cool/warm variations from which I can chose. I suspect I would mainly want cool, since I do not plan on having the plants flower until they are outdoors.

Can anyone else weigh-in on the subject of cool/warm fluorescent bulbs?

[BrianSkilton]

No problem, glad to help 6,000 color temperature will do just fine, that is leaning toward the more bluish spectrum. Daylight white, is considered 4100k, while 6,000k is considered cool. The further you go down on the scale, the warmer the light is (red/orange). You are correct in your assessment, about having more of a blue light. Some people believe full spectrum lights work better, because the sun provides a full light spectrum. I think using lights that lean more on the blue light spectrum will do just fine.

[garden5]

No problem, glad to help 6,000 color temperature will do just fine, that is leaning toward the more bluish spectrum. Daylight white, is considered 4100k, while 6,000k is considered cool. The further you go down on the scale, the warmer the light is (red/orange). You are correct in your assessment, about having more of a blue light. Some people believe full spectrum lights work better, because the sun provides a full light spectrum. I think using lights that lean more on the blue light spectrum will do just fine.

Thanks for clearing that up. What, in your opinion, is the best light rating to use for this application? Would I want to go to a lower number so the light is more cool, or would that be considered more white and less cool? Should I possibly go higher (I have yet to purchase the bulbs)?

Also, could I grow the large bell peppers up here (zone5-6)? I've never known anyone who has grown these; only the long banana type.

Looking at your avatar, I'd suspect that you know a thing or two about growing peppers. Thanks for your advice.

[BrianSkilton]

Here's a quick pic of the calvin scale. I would go with 6500k bulbs or 7000 if you can find it.

[img]https://www.3drender.com/glossary/colortemp.jpg[/img]

What I did is just pickup a cheap t-8 fluorescent tube holder ($10) at walmart or hardware store would probably have it. They are usually very cheap. Then you could just pickup two t-8 fluorescent tubes with a color temp of 6500k. Let me know what you think of that.

Oh, and about the large peppers like the Italian Marconi pepper, you could easily grow these. In-fact there's not much you couldn't grow. Anyway, you could try Poblano to if you like a little spicy. Try the early Bell I just mentioned (yellow belle) its super early. Hope that helps

[Ozark Lady]

I am farther south than you, and I bought transplants, since, I decided to go ahead and grow a garden, a bit late to start my own.
However, I did have good luck with peppers.
We had such a cool August that it was too chilly to swim. Which is odd for us.
We had several frosts in October and November. And the day after... Thanksgiving, I harvested tomatoes, peppers and tobacco.... this was after some frosts... I had to get them out of the garden, we were facing a week of daytime highs below freezing.

But, my point is, peppers are tougher than you think, they can actually ride out the first few frosts, if they are healthy to begin with, and if you help them out on really cold nights, just cover them up....
I extended my harvest over a month with covering them at night.

And you can use cloches to get an early start, before the ground has even warmed up properly... just use the cloche to warm it some... then put your peppers in.
Go ahead, plant some extras.... try putting them in early... a bottomless milk jug, just set over them... you can even add more milk jugs, filled with water to help keep them warm at night.

Bend the rules, sometimes you win. But, keep some reserve plants,,, just in case the rules bend back... ha ha

[garden5]

Thanks, Brian and Ozark Lady!

Brian, you've just described exactly what I was planning on doing . Your post and chart was really enlightening. It looks like I was right on with 6000k to 7000k.

Thanks for letting me know about the peppers. I had grown some banana from seed last year and they went in super small and never got more than 7 or so in. tall and only yielded about two or three peppers each. I, at the time, thought that it would be impossible for me to get a large bell pepper. Now, I'm sure that by starting my plants earlier and using lights I'll be able to not only grow large bell peppers, but a good amount of them too! Especially with the early varieties you mentioned and that I found for you.

Oh, and thanks to Ozark Lady for the tips about setting the plants out early. I noticed that they weathered the frost well this past fall.

[BrianSkilton]

No problem Garden5. Be sure to harden them off about 2 or so weeks before your ready to plant as well. Hardening off is simply getting them gradually use to being outside (the wind, the hot sun etc). Under those lights the peppers tend to grow very paper thin leaves. Basically all your doing is toughing them up slowly so you don't kill them. For example place them outside for a few minutes one day then place them for a longer time, lets say an hour. just keep increasing. You can do a quick google search on hardening off plants, for a better explanation then I can give.

Also, I'm going to try to get them out, as much as a month early. I'm going to be using Wall o' water, (hope it works).

[garden5]

No problem Garden5. Be sure to harden them off about 2 or so weeks before your ready to plant as well. Hardening off is simply getting them gradually use to being outside (the wind, the hot sun etc). Under those lights the peppers tend to grow very paper thin leaves. Basically all your doing is toughing them up slowly so you don't kill them. For example place them outside for a few minutes one day then place them for a longer time, lets say an hour. just keep increasing. You can do a quick google search on hardening off plants, for a better explanation then I can give.

Also, I'm going to try to get them out, as much as a month early. I'm going to be using Wall o' water, (hope it works).

I've heard of Wall O' Waters, but I don't know much about them (more to research ). I think these are what Ozark Lady meant by clotches.

I just found some good reviews of them [url=https://www.amazon.com/Wall-Water-Gardening-Teepees-3-Pack/dp/B0006IH400]here[/url]. However, [url=https://www.amazon.com/Wall-Water-Gardening-Teepees-3-Pack/product-reviews/B0006IH400/ref=cm_cr_dp_synop?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending#R9QQDE25CHSMU]here[/url] is a word of caution to anyone who will be using them on peppers (read the first review). Here is a person who seems to have had some [url=https://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/tomato/msg0102521810750.html]good luck[/url] with them.

At the price , I think it would be way cheaper for me to use milk jugs.

I've heard before that the plants will grow weakly under the lights. I plan on brushing the tops of them with my hand about daily. This is supposed to work well for tomatoes, making them stockier and stronger, so why not peppers? Of course, I could be totally wrong too
.

I'm thinking I might try some early starting techniques this year, too. Thanks for the heads-up on hardening-off and good luck with the Wall O' Waters.

[rainbowgardener]

No wall of water isn't the same as cloche. Cloche is just a glass or plastic mini-greenhouse that you put over one plant (or a couple teeny ones). Wall of water is plastic tubes that you fill with water. I haven't used them, but the idea is that the water heats up during the day and gives back the heat during the night. Much more protected environment inside of one of those than inside the cloche, which loses the heat it gained in the day MUCH faster.

Since I don't spend a lot of $$ on my garden, I use gallon plastic water jugs as cloches. Cut the bottom off and put it over the plant. Works great, even has the lid, so you can open it up on nice days to vent and put the lid back on in the evening. Besides protection from wind, cold etc, it also helps protect the seedlings from all the critters. Sometimes without it, baby seedlings, even if no one wants to eat them, can get trampled.

[garden5]

No wall of water isn't the same as cloche. Cloche is just a glass or plastic mini-greenhouse that you put over one plant (or a couple teeny ones). Wall of water is plastic tubes that you fill with water. I haven't used them, but the idea is that the water heats up during the day and gives back the heat during the night. Much more protected environment inside of one of those than inside the cloche, which loses the heat it gained in the day MUCH faster.

Since I don't spend a lot of $$ on my garden, I use gallon plastic water jugs as cloches. Cut the bottom off and put it over the plant. Works great, even has the lid, so you can open it up on nice days to vent and put the lid back on in the evening. Besides protection from wind, cold etc, it also helps protect the seedlings from all the critters. Sometimes without it, baby seedlings, even if no one wants to eat them, can get trampled.

Thanks for informing me on the cloches. The terminology threw me off since I know these types of things as cold-frames and hot-caps.

On the milk jugs, will they allow me to plant earlier? Will they protect against a frost or do they simply warm the soil?

I guess even if they just warm the soil, it would be a step toward better plants.

[Ozark Lady]

I use water jugs (same as milk jugs) and simply remove the bottoms.
I use them at all times of the year.
I just reviewed photos, no idea how to post them here, but I even had cloches over my tobacco in July, when the weather is hot.

The water jug setting over the plants (oh by the way, I don't use the lids) create a small greenhouse effect. I place them immediately, always.
I check under them from time to time. And usually, when the plant is lifting the jug, or coming out the top, I remove it.

I also, turn some upside down, still bottomless, and fill it with compost and water through it to deliver the compost tea down closer to the root zone. You do need to keep your distance, and add the lids with holes punched in them to keep roots from growing into these.

When I start early and I am concerned of early frosts, I take some water jugs, and simply fill them with water, and set these as a hedge around the outside of the plant that is inside the cloche (water jug).

When I am transplanting in hot soil, I have a terrible time hardening plants off. So, I cheat, I simply pick the cool of the evening and plant my transplant, water it well, and then I add a cloche... the water jug cloche protects my new transplant from the sun also, and lets it get used to the soil more gradually. I do often remove the cloches for awhile, while I am in the garden working and can watch the plants for stress.
I just got tired of carrying plants to sun and back to shade. So, I simply uncover and recover and leave plants where they are.

If I have a whole bed of new transplants, I simply add my tunnel, and cover it over so that my transplants are protected. I gradually give them more and more sun. For me, at least, it is easier to throw a cover over a bed, and remove it, than it is to carry a bunch of plants from place to place.

[rainbowgardener]

On the milk jugs, will they allow me to plant earlier? Will they protect against a frost or do they simply warm the soil?

I guess even if they just warm the soil, it would be a step toward better plants.

A bit earlier... it does help warm the soil and it does provide some protection against frost. But it's not a greenhouse. If it is killer frost, like 25 degrees or less, your cloche won't matter, it's still killer frost. Protects against light frost. Also protects from wind, baking sun, etc.