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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

This is a mystery volunteer RL indeterminate that looks like it is producing a cocktail sized beefsteak-shaped fruits in clusters. This first fruit -- maybe 1.75 inches in diameter -- looks like it wants to be white/yellow bi-color with a bit of green shoulder/striping going on. I don't know what variety it could be. According to last year's map, there had been a plant grown from seeds of 2015 Not Mikado White (clear epi yellow/red flesh bi-color) here that didn't grow well and was overwhelmed by weeds and the TKKx pumpkin vine. But it there had been some kind of fruit, this plant might be its off-spring, opening up an exciting possibility that this might possibly be a Not Mikado White PL Bi-color VGSIP'2015 x Champagne Cherry VGSIP'2015

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...when I was positioning to take an overall photo, I noticed the missing foliage at the top-left of the plant and immediately thought HORNWORM! So I started looking after taking the photos, and sure enough! :evil:
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

This one was named "Steelhead" by the breeder after the freshwater fish. Those of you who fish them might recognize the coloring. It's a segregating off-shoot from 2015 seeds and the original line has been advanced so the one I have may or may not be true to type and I might not be correct in calling it by the given name. It was bred from a cross between a Brandywine he has been saving seeds and selecting for desirable traits and Ananas Noir. I harvested the fruit a week ago.

What GORGEOUS tomato! Definitely tri-color -- green, red, yellow. Yes, yes, I meant to eat this 2 days ago, but life intruded. So it did develop a (small) bad spot AFTER FULL 1 WEEK -- with scarring and mega-fused fruit like this, there are vulnerabilities -- but perfect fruit would have even better shelf life I think?

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Surprisingly Sweet and Fresh are the two main descriptors that come to mind. Sometimes these qualities are lost when fruits are overripe. Started with Sweet front end -- tomato Sweet, nor sugary, and then not the heavy, salty deep flavor but Fresh and clean flavor with continuing Sweet and satisfying richness, then tangy lingering finish. I think this would please folks who prefer the brighter flavored tomatoes. My DD tomato taster said it was SWEET, NOT TOO STRONG, and VERY GOOD.

I would prefer to eat this one alone or in garden salads I think. Not too much other stuff to clutter up and mask the flavor.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Sunflower House (SFH) dwarf and indeterminate/determinate tomato garden, left to right (west to east):

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Sunflower House Extension (SFHX) cherry and cocktail tomato garden with SFH in the background:

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Some of the notable ripening tomatoes: Dwarf Chocolate Lightning, Ernie's Plump, Wes, Amana Orange, Rebel Yell, Roman Candle
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Ramallet Mallorquin Pequeño Multiflora, Ramallet Pequeñito en Ramos Multiflora
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VGA High Raised Bed of tomatoes, peppers, eggplants... with basil. Chicago Hardy fig planted in front to train as a step over/fence. VGB Bed of indeterminate tomatoes behind it, and the VGB.PSRB (Pallet-sided Raised Bed) of indeterminate tomatoes and balsam in the back ground:

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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Very Impressive, I didn't even know most of these varieties even existed, this is more like an encyclopaedia than a post

Awesome.

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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

:D Thank you! :D
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Allons-y, Dr.X, Big Cheef Stripes, Steelhead-1, Steelhead-2
Image

Wes, Big Cheef Stripes (2), Steelhead-1, Dwarf Chocolate Lightning, Dwarf Orange Cream, Cheste (these 2 look pink... maybe not true)
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Here are the trial varieties from Spain I mentioned earlier:
- Ramallet Mallorquín Pequeño Multiflora (gerardo'Nov2016)
- Ramallet Pequeñito en Ramos Multiflora (gerardo'Nov2016)
- De Colgar Papuo PL (gerardo'Jul2016)
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- Ramallet D’es Figueral (gerardo'Nov 2016)
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Gerardo also sent the seeds for
- Mucha Miel
- Mikhalych (...but I grew the seeds from tillyboris)
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Volunteer tomato seedlings from compost I added to this 2 gal bucket planter - one of them is antho PL ! :shock: .... oh... what to do....? Its already September -- first frost could be as early as mid-October.

Image

This bucket is meant to be for not table-worthy Blueberry culls in case any of the seeds within decide to sprout. In fact I *think* there is one little Blueberry plant growing in here already.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

applestar wrote:This is Uluru Ochre. It's a genetic dwarf -- only 3-4 feet tall, but one of the newer generations that produce really nice sized slicers. And it is VERY productive as well. This one was 9.2 oz I believe and I actually grew it in a 2.5 gallon container.

It's also one of the "new" color tomatoes. I had such a difficult time trying to get the photo to turn out the right color. The whole fruit could be a little lighter yellow-orange color, which puts it in the "YELLOW" tomato category in tomato parlance. But it has green shoulders, which you may have heard is an old-fashioned trait bred out of modern solid red tomatoes which actually has great flavor genes linked to it. It also retains chlorophyll in the flesh and gel that give it that really icky greenish.brownish cast to it that give you a pause. When I first saw photos, I thought "how UGLY!"

But seriously, this is an absolutely delicious tomato. If you like black/brown tomatoes, I think you will like this one, too. You HAVE to try it to believe it.
I will have to try that now, apple, due to your recommendation! This was one of the dwarfs I had in a list of "ones to try", when I was researching them before this season. Didn't get any of them, but I am definitely going to try some next season. I am looking for something indeterminate (I notice many are indeterminate, but most determinate), and something 4-5 feet, not something very small. Any suggestions? I think what got me thinking about the dwarfs again was when that nylon trellis of mine collapsed, because all of those tomato plants got so huge in those SIPs! Funny thing - none of them died, and they are still growing on the ground! From now on, all tomatoes only go on metal trellis - CRW!

Have you had any problems with splitting this season, with all this rain? Even in the SIPs, I have been having major splitting, with some varieties having almost every fruit split after some of those worst rainfalls. Fortunately, cherries recover quickly!
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Ohhh, I have some good ones for you to try, including Uluru Ochre! I'm in the process of weeding out the "mild" flavored ones which are not my/our favorites. Even good ones that are not fully counter ripened have been pronounced not good enough here -- yes have had some issues with overwatered/rain-soaked splitting, though not a whole lot ...most of this year's selections have been split-proof, though many have had stem-end cracking that reduced but not prohibited storage/keeping longevity.

DH and I like full-ripe, rich strong/complex front end flavors with building middle salt/umami, then good tangy finish, some with lingering acid afterburn as long as there is sweetness up through the the middle flavors. DD will also sometimes prefer richer flavored ones over sweeter but weak middle/finish varieties.

What kind of tomato flavors do you like? I'm guessing you might favor ones with good acid kick at the end which are typically great for Southeast Asian/Indian cuisine.

Try to be specific -- I can put together a list. Dwarf Chocolate Lightning is another one on ours. :wink:
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

This is an overwintered 2nd year Gochu Garu yong Gochu 고추 가루 용 고추 (Pepper for chili powder) -- bought as started seedlings last year at Hmart -- being very productive in the Earthbox on the patio. :D
Image

...yes I have to take the isolation net bag off of the fruit growing inside of it :>
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

You guessed right, apple. I prefer tomatoes with a stronger, tangy flavor, with that long finish, and mild tomatoes just don't hack it, for me. It seems that the juicier tomatoes always have more flavor. I like sunsugar, for a sweet tomato, but that's more for snacking on, and they make a delicious dried tomato, again, for snacking.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Impressive and since you look like you've grown every tomato known lol. I have a question, what would you recommend to replace a Cherokee purple with, I love the tomato but it splits way before it even starts to ripen, they're way to finicky for me, any ideas on a good replacement. Its a shame because I absolutely love the tomato.

I'm hoping to find a decent slicing tomato, it don't have to be a beefsteak but something decent for slicing.
For next year I plan on Brandywine Reds, Celebrity, Box Car Willie, Sprite, and Matts Wild cherry.

Here are a few that I am interested in.
Pierce's Pride'
Dawson's Black Zebra
Maui Purple

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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Ooh OK. Let me think about yours as well SQWIB. Had a rough day today and my brains are fried :roll: so I will try to work on this tomorrow. :wink:
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

SQWIB I know where you're comin' from with the splitting problem. The only year I grew Cherokees, I got barely any usable fruits, and this season, with a Cherokee/Carbon cross, I had a huge number of tomatoes, but most were split, due to the excessive rain we've had. Even the ones in the SIPs were splitting, and those usually keep the wetness fairly constant. The Big Beef and Amish Gold Slicer had some splitting on their shoulders, but those were split all the way around.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

You know how you sometimes let a volunteer tomato grow "just because"? I had one that grew between the bricks of the patio, right by the back door. It grew into a rampant rambling monster -- obviously a cherry variety and I thought very likely Matt's Wild Cherry or Coyote. It got so bad I couldn't get under the vines to clean up my junk
( :wink: )

In the past week, it has been ripening one fruit at a time from this truss -- and the fruits are Coyote/Matt's Wild sized 1/2-sized small cherry and PINK! :-() I didn't even hesitate, I popped the first one in my mouth and was delighted to taste the sweet-fruity flavor-burst reminiscent of Coyote. :D

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I want to call this "Coyote Rosa Bébé"
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Are you going to save seeds, apple, even though it seems to be a hybrid?
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

I'm going to treat it like my other crosses -- it's likely to be one of the Maglia Rosa x Coyote segregates anyway -- save seeds, grow out a few, and hope same traits pop back up. The clear epi is a good sign since that's a recessive trait and locked in. The location makes it somewhat isolated from other tomatoes, too.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Subject: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)
pepperhead212 wrote:
applestar wrote:This is Uluru Ochre. It's a genetic dwarf -- only 3-4 feet tall, but one of the newer generations that produce really nice sized slicers. And it is VERY productive as well. This one was 9.2 oz I believe and I actually grew it in a 2.5 gallon container.

It's also one of the "new" color tomatoes. I had such a difficult time trying to get the photo to turn out the right color. The whole fruit could be a little lighter yellow-orange color, which puts it in the "YELLOW" tomato category in tomato parlance. But it has green shoulders, which you may have heard is an old-fashioned trait bred out of modern solid red tomatoes which actually has great flavor genes linked to it. It also retains chlorophyll in the flesh and gel that give it that really icky greenish.brownish cast to it that give you a pause. When I first saw photos, I thought "how UGLY!"

But seriously, this is an absolutely delicious tomato. If you like black/brown tomatoes, I think you will like this one, too. You HAVE to try it to believe it.
I will have to try that now, apple, due to your recommendation! This was one of the dwarfs I had in a list of "ones to try", when I was researching them before this season. Didn't get any of them, but I am definitely going to try some next season. I am looking for something indeterminate (I notice many are indeterminate, but most determinate), and something 4-5 feet, not something very small. Any suggestions? I think what got me thinking about the dwarfs again was when that nylon trellis of mine collapsed, because all of those tomato plants got so huge in those SIPs! Funny thing - none of them died, and they are still growing on the ground! From now on, all tomatoes only go on metal trellis - CRW!

Have you had any problems with splitting this season, with all this rain? Even in the SIPs, I have been having major splitting, with some varieties having almost every fruit split after some of those worst rainfalls. Fortunately, cherries recover quickly!
Subject: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)
pepperhead212 wrote:You guessed right, apple. I prefer tomatoes with a stronger, tangy flavor, with that long finish, and mild tomatoes just don't hack it, for me. It seems that the juicier tomatoes always have more flavor. I like sunsugar, for a sweet tomato, but that's more for snacking on, and they make a delicious dried tomato, again, for snacking.
4-5 feet, strong/tangy/lingering finish indeterminate.... OK Pepperhead, I'm going to start you off with these recommendations. Maybe we could meet at TJ's again sometime this fall, are you pruning your curry plant soon? (Hint, hint :wink: )

Definitely shorter/dwarf
- (Dwarf) Uluru Ochre
- Dwarf Chocolate Lightning
- Dwarf Blazing Beauty

These were not dwarfs but didn't grow crazy tall either
- Lucky Cross
- Royal Hillbilly
- Prudens Purple
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Thanks apple! And yes, I do have to trim that curry tree soon, as I want to root prune it , as well, and repot it. I just did this with my small kaffir lime tree, and have to trim the large one, as well. Do you need lime leaves, as well, or are yours supplying enough?

Looking at your list, some sound familiar, and two of the non dwarfs I have grown. Prudens Purple and Royal Hillbilly I grew years ago. The Royal Hillbilly was disease prone that year, so I never grew it again, though it may have just been a bad year for all, I don't recall. And Prudens Purple was very good, but low production. I have considered growing it a number of times, esp. since I have grown in SIPs, since it was very flavorful, despite being a low juice tomato - something that doesn't happen often. And I had a number of tomatoes well over a lb. - I think just under 24 oz being the largest.

Here is the list I made that looked like promising varieties of dwarf or compact tomatoes. Do any of the others, that you didn't list sound familiar from past growings? The Blazing Beauty was one I had looked at closely (partly because it did well for somebody down in Florida!), but one source listed it is determinate, while another has it as indeterminate, which is why it wasn't on the list. Which is it, in your experience? I don't do determinates, as a rule, as I like a longer production, not all at once, then none.

Barossa Fest Dwarf
Chocolate Lightning Dwarf
Coorong Pink
Kelly Green Dwarf
Sweet Sue Dwarf
Summer Sunrise
Uluru Ochre Dwarf
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Dwarf Blazing Beauty - Tatiana's TOMATOBase
http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Dwarf_Blazing_Beauty

Vigorous potato leaf indeterminate dwarf plants. The fruit are medium size, oblate and a deep orange in and out. 3-8 oz. Delicious flavor with plenty of sweetness and an acidic bite. (15 seeds / packet)
I've heard good things about Dwarf Sweet Sue -- that one is on my wishlist. Maybe Summer Sunrise, too.... and Dwarf Orange Cream was very productive for me and I liked it -- I think Dwarf Blazing Beauty tasted just a tad better/stronger and would pick DBB over DOC if I had to choose one or the other? DOC was earlier though. Go with both if you can. :wink:

Two others I've heard good things and am trying to like ...with difficulty because they have not grown well for me so far... are Dwarf Wherokowahi and Dwarf Brandy Fred. So so can't recommend them but let me know how they do for you in the SIP if you try them.

Remember that genetic dwarfs typically are slower to get growing as seedlings and should be started a week or two earlier than the main tomato seed starts. I start them as soon as I finish getting the peppers started.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Subject: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)
SQWIB wrote:Impressive and since you look like you've grown every tomato known lol. I have a question, what would you recommend to replace a Cherokee purple with, I love the tomato but it splits way before it even starts to ripen, they're way to finicky for me, any ideas on a good replacement. Its a shame because I absolutely love the tomato.

I'm hoping to find a decent slicing tomato, it don't have to be a beefsteak but something decent for slicing.
For next year I plan on Brandywine Reds, Celebrity, Box Car Willie, Sprite, and Matts Wild cherry.

Here are a few that I am interested in.
Pierce's Pride'
Dawson's Black Zebra
Maui Purple
I remember Prudens Purple as being productive but not as productive as Royal Hillbilly.

SQWIB, I gave up on Cherokee Purple as well. These two are good purple alternatives to Cherokee Purple.

Another one I could recommend -- pink though -- is Soldacki. Terhune and Wes are our family faves. Terhune is not very productive though. And Lucky Cross is a gorgeous bicolor with great flavor and production.

These are all indeterminate and have vigorous growth habits.

I have heard that if you are going to grow a red one, Brandywine OTV is superior. I have one fruit ready to taste, but gave away the other two fruits to my Mom. That was all my one plant produced, but it was planted very late as a neglected, stunted seedling.

I haven't tried those last three you mentioned. I'm going to try Big Cheef (correct spelling) next year.

Zebra series typically are later maturing than the Cherokee series. Oh yeah, I liked Cherokee Green. I've heard Cherokee Lime is better. They didn't have the splitting issues, but the Lime wasn't planted in a good place or something and didn't grow well that year. I need to try that one again.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

When I grew Prudens purple, it was more of a dark pink, for me. This was back when I first saw it in catalogs - in the 90s sometime - before we were really seeing black/purple tomatoes, as a rule. Has it changed, and gotten darker?

I loved green zebras, back when I grew them. As you said, they're a bit late, and the other zebras, which I tried, since I liked the greens so much, didn't do nearly as well, and the reds were aphid magnets! I stopped the greens mainly due to splitting.

Good to know about the dwarfs needing more time as seedlings.
Dave

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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

I have an interesting unknown/un-ID’d late volunteer — cherry tomato:

Image

They fruit clusters look multifloral or maybe not quite but segregating into one, the shape is a complete surprise, and it appears to be ripening to a “brown” color.

I tried eating the first ripest one this morning, and it is firm-ish, not crunchy really, sweet front end with I guess fruity overtones — not the TOMATO flavor — what you might call mild without the tangy-ness, and little to no lingering acid, maybe a bit of a tangy sensation finally coming through after mouth is empty except the somewhat thick skin, still retaining that sweet initial flavor.

If anyone recognizes this variety or the description reminds you of one even if not completely the same, please let me know.
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Re: Applestar's 2017 Tomatoes (and peppers and eggplants)

Started digging up the pepper plants to be overwintered. Got the Brazilian starfish, Aji Pineapple, Jalapeño, Numex Lemon Spice, Jalamundo, and .. I think .. Giant Marconi out of the SFHX bed. Popped in doubled grocery bags and clustered on the patio for now.
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