Chad-K
Full Member
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2005 2:16 am
Location: Wild and Wonderful West Virginia

F1 Hybrid seeds? Violas

So, I finally found a good selection of viola seeds, offered by Thompson and Morgan.

I made a list of the ones I would love to try and grow, not all in one year of course. I may try and grow about 2 or 3 new ones a year. Not just because of cost, but because of limited space and time in my garden. I only have so much space and I devote much of my time to morning glories and a few other flowers. I have 11 on my must-grow-list. 6 of which are F1 hybrids. I read about F1 hybrids, and I think I understand it for the most part.

If you grow F1 flowers, I understand that if you collect the seeds they will not grow true to form and will revert to the parent or grandparent flower. However, since most violas are considered perennial, and some F1's are considered to be very tough, as long as the plants root system survives the winter, the flower will come back true to the F1 form, right? And I can always try to grow some in containers indoors during the winter, possibly?

Anyway, I think Im gonna start with the violas that are not listed as F1 hybrids and stick with the ones that Im certain will come back as the way they were when I first grew them. And besides, how exactly do you collect seeds from violas?

Thanks for any help and thanks for welcoming my questions and concerns.

CK

The Helpful Gardener
Mod
Posts: 7493
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:17 am
Location: Colchester, CT

Hey Chad,

Considering all the naturized species, both native and non-native, getting true seed would be a big challenge. Reversion is the tendency of nature, so even the chance of perennial clones staying true is somewhat limited. This is a wild species that we harness like rodeo horses, but all you can really hope for is the 8 second ride... :lol:

I like and grow species type like V. labradorica and V. pedata; I love the hardy scambling style of the first (and the foliage color) and the tidy sweet nature of the other, and they stay true blue and regular...

Scott

opabinia51
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 4659
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Hi Chad,

F1 just means that the Violas are the first outcrossing by two of the same species but different phenotype (for lack of a better description... the way they look).

Scott is exactly correct that the seeds from hybrids will most likely revert back to the wild type phenotype. The reason for this is because you have say the genome of Yy and Yy in your F1 hybrid and when they cross with eachother you get.... (a short calculation here) a 1:2:1 ratio YY : Yy : yy in the next generation. However, if the F1 generation were Yy x yy (only one plant having the dominant trait) then the result of the cross will be 100 percent hybrids in the next generation. Finally if the F1 generation were crossed like this: Yy x yy then the F2 generation would have a genotypic ratio of: 1:1 that is Yy : yy.

Anyway, what this has to do with reversion to the wildtype strain depends on whether or not the phenotype you want is dominant or recessive. Most likely it is recessive that is "y".

So, if you start off with an F1 generation of plants that are yy and they are crossed at all with any Y_ plants, there is reversion to the wildtype phenotype. If there is codominance influencing phenotype here (ie. the genotype is XY and the result is a mixed phenotype of X and Y) then well, it gets a little more complicated.

The Helpful Gardener
Mod
Posts: 7493
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:17 am
Location: Colchester, CT

It gets MORE complicated?! :!: :?: :shock:

HG

opabinia51
Super Green Thumb
Posts: 4659
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Oh, that's just the very tip of the ice berg. I took a whole course (that lasted 4 months) on this stuff. It's really fun to play with in your garden though.

Just think back to Gregor Mendl at his monstary. Of course, that was with peas (or was it beans?) and we are talking about Violas here. (one of my favourite flowers)

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