Toxic1979, Veg Garden 2016

[Toxic1979]

I'll ask everyone to help me as much as possible! I'm fairly new to the gardening hobby. I started about 2 years ago, with a few seedling potatoes from a coworker. This has grown into a full time job some days. Such an enjoyable and rewarding hobby!

A lot of my plants will be started indoors, and then transplanted outside when the weather here permits. I recently built my seedlings shelf in order to accommodate custom spacing for my seed trays. I just finished installing 3 new Agrobrite grow lights (6 bulb T5's, 4'long). So far I'm loving them. I'll post some pics of the seedling set up this weekend, once I get a chance. I'm looking onward to advice and criticism from the member here.

I've listed a few things I'll be planting this summer. A to of my seedlings are already started, and this year I'm recording my germinate time and success %. I'll post that also, in case anyone is interested in knowing some of the results I've had this year.

Beans:
-Improved Tendergreen
-Romano Gold
-French Dwarf
-Royal Burgundy
-Labrador Bush

Broccoli
-Green Magic Hybrid
-Packman Hybrid
-Everest

Cabbage
-Danish Bullhead
-Early Copenhagen
-Mozard F1
-Farao
-Charest

Cauliflower
-Seoul F1

Cucumber
- Bush Champion

Onions, from seed
-Evergreen Bunching
-Onions (Norstar)
-Onions (Red Zeppelin)
-Onions (Talon)
-Shallot (Ambition)

Onions, from Sets
-Red Karmen
-Sturon

Peppers
-Peruvian Lemon Drop
-California Wonder
-Right on Red Hybrid
-Hungarian Cheese Blend
-Red Habanero
-Gypsy
-F1 Sweet Sunshine
-Chilli F1 Cheyenne

Potato
-Yukon Gold
-Russet
-Norland

Tomato
-Patio Hybrid
-Red Alert
-Sun Peach
-Jasper
-F1 Tomatoberry
-Lemon Boy Hybrid
-Marmande
-Applause
-San Marzano 2
-100's & 1000's

Turnip & Rutabaga
-Snowball turnip
-Early purple top turnip
-Laurentian Rut.

Carrots
-Napoli
-Bolero
-Neptune

Greens
-Arugula (Dragons Tongue)
-Chard (Bright Lights) & (Orange Fantasia)
-Mustard (Green Wave)
-Lettuce (Rosberg Sweet hybrid)
-Turnip Greens

Corn
-Welcome

Eggplant
-Fairy Tale

Zucchini
-Tarminofi Hybrid
-Sure Thing

[rainbowgardener]

HI and welcome! Sorry you didn't get a response.

That is a big long list.... how big is your garden space?

You listed those all as will be planted this summer, but it is a mixed bag of cool weather and warm weather crops.

Broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower I usually start indoors under lights something like ten weeks ahead of my average last frost date; plan to have them hardened off and ready to go in the garden a month ahead of my last frost date.

Seeds of greens and carrots and sprouted potatoes go directly in the ground "as soon as the ground can be worked," usually for me about a month ahead of average last frost date.

Tomato and pepper seeds I start indoors, peppers first as they are slower. Tomato seed I plant indoors 6 to 8 weeks ahead of last frost date, pepper seeds 10-12 weeks ahead. Then the transplants go in the ground after all danger of frost is past and nights are staying at least in the mid 40's if not warmer (especially for the peppers).

Corn, cucumber, and zucchini seed can go directly in the ground, corn first. Zucchini, cucumber, and eggplant are warmest of warm weather crops and need the soil well warmed first.

Onions are very slow from seed. I usually plant them in the ground in fall. They sprout and then winter over and are ready the following summer.

All of this is just what worked for me when I was a zone 6 gardener. Over time you will figure out what works best for you in your climate, this is just a sample.

Love to see pictures of your seed starting set up!

[j3707]

Hey Toxic, look forward to seeing your progress. Do you garden in-ground or raised bed?

[Toxic1979]

Thanks for the comments.

Now keep in mind I'm fairly NEW to Gardening, and I'm trying most of this stuff as a learning experience, to see what works best here for me, or if it even works at all... lol. I don't mind posting it was a failed attempt or not. No shame in sharing knowledge, and learning from others! lol

Our area usually gets a mixed bag of climates. I can usually move plants into the garden around the first week of June, and our summer is usually good until about the last week of Sept. As of right now, our days are about 10 celsius, and our evenings are still 0 celsius, so its a no go on most of this. Not to mention, we still have some ground frost pushing out.

j3707... I use mostly raised beds. But I also have a greenhouse that I plant most of my tomatoes and peppers in. This year I'm trying a few tomatoes and peppers in the raised beds. Last year I tried this and the both tomatoes and peppers did well, but not a huge harvest, and most of the tomatoes were still green. But this year I have hoop houses made for all these raised beds, along with greenhouse plastic to cover them. I will try them in the hoop houses this year and see if it makes much of a difference.

As for garden space... lots. I have an 12' x 12' greenhouse for some of my plants also.

My raised Beds are as follows:

5 - 8' x 12' (split with an 18" walkway down the middle, for access to the plants.)
4- 4' x 6'
3- 4' x 4'
2- 4' x 8'
3- 2' x 6'
3- 6' x 8'

With all of that, I still have to mow too much grass in the garden!

I also made a circular raised rock garden area out of all the large rocks I dug up from the garden when removing the grass for the raised beds. Planted my strawberries there. And I planted my raspberries directly into the ground, and they are doing well.

I started with a 8 x 10 potato bed three years ago.... been hooked ever since. Me and my wife loved going out to dig up fresh home grown potatoes each night.

I'm the kind of person that does something 110%... usually end up over doing it if you ask my wife! lol

I post some pics soon. I don't expect everything to make it or to be successful, but at least I'll be able to say that I tried. I know cabbage and broccoli, potatoes, carrots, turnips, beets, and all the greens will do well here. Had tons of it last year. I followed some square foot gardening advice last year, and everything was too close together. This year I'll be expanding my spacing, between some plants. Tomatoes, peppers are a bit trickier here. Need a lot of attention, and take up lots of space. Just trying the Cucumber and eggplant this year in the Greenhouse and hoop houses as a trial.

Zucchini did well last year in the greenhouse. When I got sick trying to walk around them (huge plant) I just ate all the flowers. Love Zucchini Fritters! I will be trying a few of them in the hoop houses this year also to see how well they do.

Its always nice to get advice from some friends south of the border, as your weather is usually much better and earlier than mine.

I definitely have a new appreciation for the art of farming, and the intense amount of work that goes into it!

[imafan26]

For someone who only started gardening a couple of years ago, you have quite a large set up and diverse garden. Load pictures please.

[rainbowgardener]

Wow.... that's roughly 900 sq ft of garden space! Quite a big garden.....

Do keep us updated on your progress! (Second the motion for pictures! )

[Toxic1979]

A quick pic from 2015 after I removed the grass sods laid out the (4) 8 x 12, and (3) 4 x 6, and my mini rock garden for strawberries

[Toxic1979]

Another view of the rock garden, with a few strawberries plants placed in it. I thought it was a good use of the large rocks in the ground! LOL

[Toxic1979]

I placed 1 inch crushed and washed stone between all the raised beds when I finished. It helped reduce mud while walking through the areas. I also have split the middles of the 8 x 12 with a small walkway at the end of the year.

[Toxic1979]

Pic of two of the 4 x 8 beds, and the 1 of the 4 x4 beds. I put my turnip greens in these and some lettuce, turnips, beets, and chard.

[Toxic1979]

A few grow bags I placed on the deck and tried some potatoes late in the season. Got some nice nice small taters out of these.

This was a pic after I finished spreading the stone between the beds, and tilled the soil, and planted the potatoes. And after I erected the greenhouse, and finished placing the stone inside. I surrounded it with cedar mulch just to make it look a bit better. LOL. This was from last year, around June.

Oh its a 8 x 12... not a 12 x 12 greenhouse.

Once the snow is all gone here, and the ground is workable and I get my garden in decent looking shape, Ill post a few pics of the rest of the garden. I had to finish it at the end of the year. This year I'll be installing some hoop houses, and plastic covering on most of the beds I want to trial some tomatoes and peppers in.

My trusty gas can always finds a way into my garden pics, as seen above! LOL

This is about 1/4 of my backyard.

A few grow bags I placed on the deck and tried some potatoes late in the season. Got some nice nice small taters out of these.

[Toxic1979]

You can see a boat in the above pics... thats where I expanded at the end of the season, and also planted my 14 raspberry bushes. Its also where I've piling my snow all winter. Once its presentable, I'll show you the rest. I wish I had a few before and after pics..... basically the before pics had bad looking grass where everything for my garden is.

Like I said, its a fun hobby. I really enjoyed getting into it! Looking forward to trying some new things this year.

[Toxic1979]

A veggie pics I found on my phone from last year.

A zucchini from last year. Grown in the greenhouse.

A few more zucchinis from last year in the greenhouse. A bit awkwardly shaped, but still delicious!

My wife hand over the broccoli we grew last year directly in the raised bed garden, from seedling.

bowl of cherry tomatoes from the greenhouse last year.

A small feed of Russian Blue taters from last years harvest.

[Toxic1979]

2016 Seedling Set-Up

This is a pic of this years seedling set up in my shed. I built the wooden rack and shelving, and stained it this spring. I purchased 3 Agrobrite T5 Hanging Grow Lights, and mounted them on adjustable ratchet rope systems, to lower and raise them. There a 6 bulbs in each lamp system, and they are 4 foot long. My shelves are approximately 2 wide, 4.5 long.

I also placed a heat mat on the bottom shelf the help with those seedlings, most are peppers and tomatoes. All the seedling pots in the trays are 3.5 inch width, aside from the small green ones that look like plug trays. I'm just starting a few herbs in those.

Shed is fully insulated, has NO windows, and and large 4 x 6 insulated garage door. It also has a 1200 watt fan force heater, and a 5000 watt hanging heater. Never had to turn on the 5000 watt... but like I said before, I am know for over-kill on everything I do! LOL. But at least this year none of this is in my house! LOL

I try to keep the temp regulated in here at about 20 celsius (sometimes spike to 30 celsius). Plants seem to enjoy 20 celsius the most. Since this pic, I placed two fans in here as well.

Ill post a few pics of my seedlings tomorrow. This pic was from April 25, 2016.

Lights are raised in this pic, just for the pic. Usually have them a few inches above the tallest plants.

2016 seedling start up

[applestar]

Nice set up! I like the shelves -- very well thought out.

[Toxic1979]

This past weekend I did a little experiment on some on my tomatoes. A couple of the 3.5 inch seedling pots had two plants growing in them. Everyone tells me that tomatoes are very sensitive, especially the root systems. So instead of thinning the plants I literally removed them from the pots, crumbled the soil gently around the roots, and separated the root systems by gently pulling them apart... a few roots pulled apart in the process, but for the most part the root system didn't receive too much damage. I then replanted them into separate 3.5 inch seedling pots. They looked a little bit wilted.... almost like transplant shock!

I watered them in good, and placed them under the grow lights. I also use a popsicle stick to assist with the stem stability. Overall I replanted 9 tomato plants. As of today the plants do not need any support and the wilting is completely gone. They seem healthy. I performed the separations on Friday evening. Roughly 4 days.

Soooooo... I tried the same thing tonight with my gypsy peppers, hungarian chese peppers, and california wonder peppers. They did not show any signs of wilting right away like the tomatoes did. I'm trying it to see if it works. Seems to have worked on my tomatoes, so why not right? Maybe peppers are more sensitive?

Most people I speak with just do thinning. I planted about an extra three plants of everything I wanted to grow, just in case some did not make it. Now I have too many, so I decided to experiment a little.

Can you post videos on here? I can video what I did, and get some healthy criticism from members here. Maybe others have done this and there is a right a way of doing it? LOL

I show a few pics tomorrow night.... waiting to see if the peppers look any worse tomorrow morning? LOL

[Toxic1979]

Learnings so far:
- Marinade tomatoes are a little hard to manage as seedlings.... not sure why but a few of mine germinated and grew well, and then just started looking wilted and loosing color. I figured maybe too much water?

- Danish Ballhead Cabbage takes a while to germinate (7-12 days), and the seed germination success rate is fairly poor compared to the other cabbage. The Charmant and the Farao had 100% success even with multiple seeds in the pots, and germinated very quickly (Charmant 2-3 days). The Danish Ballhead was about 60% success rate.

- The hotter the pepper plant.... the harder it is to get growing. My Peruvian Lemon Drops did not grow at all. Kept them on heat mats and watered for about 4 weeks.... and got nothing. Ive given up on them. Next year, or maybe even starting over the summer I may try to get some advice on growing hot peppers from one the pepper experts on here.... ahem, feel free to offer that advice anytime! LOL

- My Red Habaneros on the other hand grew well. It did take about 14 days to start, and they are slow growing, but they look healthy! I got about 50% success on the planted seeds for the red habaneros. These I may just thin, as opposed to separating them as I do not have any extras planted.

[rainbowgardener]

Other people have had the same experience that the hotter the pepper the harder (and slower) to grow.

If you need to pull apart your seedlings, it helps to be sure the potting mix is very moist. Or you can pull the whole thing out of the pot and just float it in a bucket of water. The seedlings will easily separate. Any time you transplant tomatoes, you should bury them deeper than they were before, because tomatoes will root all along the buried stems. This does not apply to peppers and other plants.

I quite understand that as gardeners we like to save every little baby plant. But you have to think about where you will have garden space for all of them, once they are big plants, not cute little babies.

[Toxic1979]

lol... Its funny because I do end feeling that way with the extras that I plant. I keep asking myself where will I plant them. It would be a sin to throw them out...lol.

To be honest, right now the separated plants seem to be doing very well. They are even putting on new growth. This weekend I will separate few more. I'm only doing it because a few other seedling did not make it. So now I'm just replacing what I anticipated to try and grow.

Thanks for the advice on the peppers! I was not aware that the peppers would not grow more roots along the stem if was buried deeper. I knew about the tomatoes already. What about cabbage and broccoli? If its planted a bit deeper will it damage the plant?

[rainbowgardener]

Very few other plants can grow adventitious roots from the stem like tomatoes do.

RE: What about cabbage and broccoli? If its planted a bit deeper will it damage the plant? Yes, planted deeper the stems will just rot.

[applestar]

This is all true, but you don't want to NOT cover up and protect all the roots from drying out. 1/4-1/2 inch extra soil won't hurt them and *generally* speaking most seedleaves and stem up to the base of the first true leaves can be buried with extra sandy mix.

[Lindsaylew82]

Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwow! How nice!!!

[Toxic1979]

Well is it just me, or do cabbage and broccoli tend to become a little leggy than other plants when they first start out?

[applestar]

Are we talking seedlings under lights or outside? They need a lot of light. Cabbage can manage with a little less than broccoli since they are leaf crops and won't be required to try to bloom (we harvest immature broccoli flowerbuds).

Leggy seedlings with excessive stem between seedleaves and true leaves fall over -- remedied by burying seedlings deeper to base of true leaves with sandy potting mix, but watch out for damping off if kept too damp.

[Toxic1979]

Unser the grow lights. I find that they tend to be a bit leggy at first. The leaves are getting very thick and large, and although the stem seems to be thickening, it seems as though it is struggling to support the weight of the plant. Its my first time trying to grow cabbage and broccoli from seed, as in the past my neighbour gave me a few spares that he had to try in my garden.

Can the ambient temperature affect this? The area they are growing tends to venture in the 30 celsius area... maybe its just needs to be cooler for plants?

They have had plenty of close light. I used popsicle sticks for a few of the cabbage to help support them, and they seem to be supporting themselves, but they may become top heavy and flop over. These pics were taken on May 18, 2016.

[Toxic1979]

As a side my eggplants seem to be doing well, and the stems are getting very thick on them this past week.

This pic is from last week. The leaves have grown much larger and the stems much thicker.

[Toxic1979]

Question about fennel...

I planted two for in the greenhouse. They seem to be doing well, and when I cut the leaves, the fragrance is that of liquorice.... mmmmm so delicious! Its the bulbing variety.

This is what they look like right now. When I plant them in larger pots, whats a good size? and do I need to replant it so the bulb (where these three stems meet) is in the ground? I took a pic of what I was trying to say... lol.

[Toxic1979]

A quick note on the leggy cabbage seedlings... I have introduced fans to them for periods of 6 hours a day, just to se if it helps the stems at all.

[applestar]

The cabbage -- it's normal for the stem below the true leaves to be thinner and everything above will be thicker so that the seedling will fall over. (Lettuce does this too) Leggy, yes, but that was back when they first germinated. Brassicas do so much better if you can give them lots of light at first sprouting.

But things happen and you have that extra-length of skinny stem. Best thing to do is to bury the seedlings deeper, burying the seedleaves if they still have them and all the way to the first true leaves. Don't use heavy/moisture holding potting mix -- I find mixing with about 1/3 sand keep the stem from getting damping off fungus and holds the seedling up better. Use your support sticks to prop them steady at first until they can stand up straight on their own.

[imafan26]

I grow seeds in community pots so I am used to pulling them apart. They are easier to transplant if you don't let them get to big and tangled.

[Toxic1979]

Applestar... thanks. Thats actually exactly what I was doing, and then I started to get a little worried about burying them that deep. Instead of sand I used a heavier mixture with vermiculite and perlite added in higher quantities to help with drainage near the stem. But is it right understand that they will not grow anymore roots from the stem? Thats too bad! Which other plants besides tomatoes exhibit this property?

As for pulling apart the seedlings- thanks for the info, and for letting me know that I'm not alone in attempting this! LOL. I'm fairly gentle about it, and very quick to get them re-potted. I believe one member also suggested to ensure the roots are very wet when doing it, and to use water to aid in the separation. Unfortunately some of the plants did grow close together, and they proved to be a bit more difficult to pull apart. There was some root damage to these ones. But its been about 10-12 days and they see to be doing well, and putting on new growth. There was probably some beginners luck in there as well! LOL

Anyone have any advice on the fennel pictures and replanting them?

This forum is going to be sick of answering my questions soon! LOL

I do appreciate all the advice I am getting here! So thanks again!

[Blondejeepgirl]

Wow toxic, you are my hero. How did your Royal Burgundy beans do?

I have some that I germinated from seeds and they are about a foot tall and they are producing beans but they're small and not that plentiful. I am doing them in a container as everything that I plant in ground seems to die or get eaten.

[rainbowgardener]

Tomatoes will keep growing new roots from buried stem every time it is buried deeper. In the process of going from seed to ground my tomatoes get transplanted three times, buried deeper each time. They thrive on that.

Tomatoes are fairly unique in being able to do that.

[Toxic1979]

blondejeepgirl.... the royal burgundy beans did well last year. Not as good as my other bean plants, and they did not grow very large, maybe about 12-18 inches in height. They produced well. Maybe about 20-25 beans on each plant. Last year I planted them a little late, and I also planted them very tightly together. This year I planted earlier, and gave each plant about 8 inches of space.

I did find that they needed to be harvested quickly. They fell off the plant fairly early compared to other beans. But they did look very nice in the garden. That blue/ purple colour was a nice contrast to all the green! Tasted yummy. Me and the wife had a great bean salad put together for the family!

[applestar]

I was expecting to see an update

[Toxic1979]

haha... work and gardening have been killing my feet time lately.

Its pouring here today and tomorrow.... Fri, Sat, Sun are suppose good. Ill get a few pics ready of the garden over the weekend for you!

Spoiler...

Potatoes, Cabbage, Cauliflower, Broccoli, strawberries and Greens are coming in well. As are the turnips, and rutabagas.

Tomato and peppers in greenhouse are doing well. The ones outside in the hoop houses are not doing as good as the ones in the greenhouses. But they are still producing fruits.

Carrots seem to be doing well. I usually don't pull any until October anyway.

The onion (Sets- Transplants and Direct Sow, & Transplant from seed) seem to be doing well. Not sure though as I never grew them before.

I also have a few weird things happening in the garden that maybe a few folks on here will be able to comment on. Nothing bad, just not expected!

Update this weekend! Cheers!

Great thing is I already have planned the changes for next years garden. LOL

[Toxic1979]

I never did post pics of the garden with all the snow gone, and cleaned up a little. A few pics of my grow space in the back yard.

I had to fill the raised beds that had no soil in them. I had to remove the sods this year, in order to expand one area of it. Then I placed the raised beds in that area.

I then shovelled crushed stone between the beds. Its about 4-6 inch thick through out the walkways in the garden. 10MTon of ⅜-¾ crushed stone shovelled in the walkways.

Then we screens all the soil in last years raised beds by shovelling it about 20 inch deep from the top of the raised bed, and passing it through a home made Wire mesh Screener on a wheel barrow. Then we amended the soil peat, and compost. The soil seems really good now. We plan on having a few tests done at the end of the year.

We have recently filled the new raised beds with soil, and everything is planted.

We also installed poly-pipe hoop houses over some the raised beds, so that we could experiment with growing tomatoes and peppers outdoors, by covering them in the evening with a plastic wrap. Also built some internal support structures to help support the hoop house in heavy rain, or high winds.

So far its a lot of work! LOL... But its all for good fun and hopefully a good harvest.

Feel free to criticize what I have done, and if you think it may need to be improved. I'm all ears!

[Toxic1979]

This was Cauliflower, Carrots, onion, Rom Lettuce, Chard:

[Toxic1979]

Norland Potato (Right)

Yukon Potato (left)

[Toxic1979]

Russet Potato (Left)
Carrots in the near empty space, a few were popping up through the soil.
Cabbage on the right

Some Beets in the front.