JPIXI
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Location: France, Paris

Transplanting in new location

Dear All,

I have a new rose (Queen Elizabeth) that is about one year old.

I wish to shift its present location to another, may I know when is the best moment to do it?

Any tips of doing a good transplanting job are most welcome.

Thanks

grandpasrose
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Hi There!!!
Queen Elizabeth is a good old standby rose! Can't go wrong choosing that one. :)
The ideal time to transplant is the early spring (middle of March to the beginning of April). You can also transplant in the fall - near the end of October. I have transplanted roses here at other times of the year, out of necessity.
If you transplant in the spring, the rose is practically dormant and so shock to the plant is less. You will also have the growing season for a good establishment of the rose.
If you transplant in the fall, you need to pick time when the soil is still reasonably warm for the rose to reestablish itself before the winter arrives.
Transplanting the rose is the same as planting any rose.
Dig your hole larger than required for the plant.
Mix bone meal, compost, manure, leafmold, kelp, epsom salt, etc. into the soil.
I put plenty of water in the hole at this point to ensure that the rose has plenty of deep water where it needs it. It will create a kind of slurry, and helps prevent shocking the rose.
I am not sure what your winters are like in France, but if they are cold, and get alot of freeze and thaw, like mine, you need to place your rose with the bud union several inches (mine are at least 4, often 6) below ground level. (this does not hurt your rose, and gives it additional protection, in conjunction with mulches, etc. against winter freeze).
Sprinkle and fill in the hole around the root system with prepared soil. Pour more water in. Allow it to settle, bonding the roots with soil, and carefully press on the soil to eliminate air pockets.
I also build a dish of soil around my rose to help hold some of the water in around the rose when it is watered.
Hope this all helps! Enjoy Queen Elizabeth! :wink:
VAL (Grandpa's Rose)

JPIXI
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Posts: 213
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 7:54 am
Location: France, Paris

Thanks Grandpa!

I hesitate to transplant it. My housemate asked me to move the Queen Elizabeth to the corner, to cover a hole in the fence, which I am reluctant to do so. She is growing fabulously well at the present location, so why to shift it just to mend a hole...

I think I am going to get another thorny and bushy rose species to do my house mate "brocolage" job to cover the hole.

All my roses in the garden are tall and leggy species. Especially ANNAPURNA, I love it like crazy, the flower itself is as big as my hand, sizing 14cm. If you are interested to have a look, pls tell me how I can upload the picture for you? It makes everyone's heart melt like ice cream.

Thanks again grandpa!

grandpasrose
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No problem JPIXI! :D
I'm with you - I wouldn't move a rose unless I had to - they are not partial to being moved.
Why not take the opportunity to have even more roses and get another to plant in the spot? 8)
I have not seen this rose, and although I have found it on-line, it is not in any of my rose books. It is also known as "Dorblan", and "Neige Parfum". If you have a picture that isn't to large to send, it would be great to see it! :D
How many roses do you have? I am curious, what kind of climate does France have?
Have a wonderful time enjoying your roses! :wink:
VAL (Grandpa's Rose)

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The French climate would just make you jealous, Val...

And the rose growers, some of the world's finest and at it a long time too...

'Queen Elizabeth' is the very first floribunda ever introduced (in her coronation year; '53, right?). And you are very correct, Val. Great old rose...

S

grandpasrose
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I'm jealous of almost anyone else's climate!! :lol:
Sometimes it amazes me how old the breeding is on some of these roses, and many of them are from France.

Queen Elizabeth is actually the very first grandiflora, and was bred in the states in 1954, even though the Queen ascended the throne in 1952. It has won many awards, and has been named to the Roses Hall of Fame.
It also has one the very few AARS rating above 9. (For those who care! Personally, I follow my own rating - if I like it, it stays!) :wink:
VAL

JPIXI
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Location: France, Paris

Hi VAL, Scott,

I had propogated my Queen Elizabeth a few days ago, as I wish to have more of this fabulous species in another part of my garden.

I wonder if it is okay to transplant the newly propogated rose sterm measuring about 15cm into new location in 6 to 8 weeks? Winter don't really arrive untill late December and it sheldom snow here.

If I pot it, I wonder will it affect the growth of the new plant?

Hope to hear from you guys soon.

Cheers,
Pixi

JPIXI
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Location: France, Paris

Hi VAL, Scott,

In case you guys are interested to see the Queen Eliabeth you guys had helped to save, below is a photo of her.

[img]https://img296.imageshack.us/img296/4690/dsc0008edited4aw.jpg[/img]

Merci encore!

Cheers,
Pixi

grandpasrose
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Bonjour Pixi! You're really moving along with your rose education aren't you! That's great! 8)

Did you take soft wood cuttings or hard wood cuttings? You can do either, although I find soft wood cuttings take easier for some reason.
Once your cuttings have roots, and show sign that they have taken, you can probably plant them out if it hasn't gotten too cold yet. My concern would be shocking them. If you have left them outside all along, they should be okay, but if you have had them protected and then put them outside, there is more possibility of shock.

When planting them, plant as any normal rose, dig your hole, add soil amendments like bone meal, manure, compost, shredded leaves, kelp, etc.. Then place your rose with the soil level at the same level as it is in the medium you started it in. Because you have created an own root rose by doing this, you will not have to worry about protecting a bud union.
Replace the soil around it, watering it in well.

I would then mulch it in well for the winter, covering it with leaves, straw, or sawdust. If it freezes very hard there, then I would also add a plastic covering like a tarp or something over top of that so that you don't get any more dampness in. The major killer of roses through winter is the freeze and thaw pattern. If you can keep you roses dry after their fall drink, they don't seem to freeze as bad.

If you have taken several cuttings, and it were me, I would be tempted to keep a couple in pots inside, just because I would want to make sure they came through! But that is just my cautious nature coming through!! :roll:

The picture of your recovered Queen Elizabeth looks very healthy and gorgeous! You did a fine job of doctoring! :D

Vous etes tres bienvenu Pixi!!!
Il est merveilleux pour rencontrer quelqu'un qui est aussi enthousiaste au sujet des roses que moi!
Ayez un jour splendide! :wink:
VAL

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Much as we appreciate the nod, you did all the work...

Great job gettting that one back to great health!

Scott

JPIXI
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Thanks a bunch VAL!

I had did an air layering for my Queen Elizabeth on soft sterms(of this spring). I hope I can see them root before mid autumn to ground them.

Both my Queen Elizabeth and Anna Purna are blooming like crazy after I applied alfalfa compost tea and Epsom salt. I suspected, it must be years of starving that delays their flowering before. I really love these old roses a lot, they are so strong and healthy with huge deep green leaf now.

Today, at a very discrete corner, I discovered a bush of rose with a tag marked "Reine d'Anjou"". The rose bush has been covered by climbers. I wonder can I cut back the weak sterm drastically? Will new shoots grow easy from this species of rose?

Hope to hear from you soon.

Cheers,
Pixi

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Val, I know 'Reines De Violette' but not this one. Another old fashioned rose?

grandpasrose
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Gee Pixi, I wish I could just walk outside my door and find a new different rose all the time! It's like a treasure hunt!

Yes, Scott this is an oldie!!!! I really had to go diggin' in my books for this one! :lol: The name of the rose is actually "Rene D'Anjou" and was named for the son of Louis II, Duke of Anjou and Provence. Rene was born in 1409 in Angers, France and later became King of Naples.
There's your history lesson!

The rose itself was bred by M. Robert in France, in 1853. It is a Gallicane Moss Rose by classification, meaning it is among the earliest of european hybridization of roses.
The 3 inch flower is supposed to be a medium to deep pink, fading to lilac. It is a double, very fragrant rose, whose petals are arranged in a muddled swirling shape, once opening from buds covered in brownish green moss (hence Moss Rose). It blooms in clusters of 3-7 flowers, and does not rebloom again in the season.
The bush itself is vigorous, open, but bushy, with leaves that start bronze and turn to bright green. It is supposed to grow to about 6 feet high and 4 feet around.

I would definitely prune this bush back to sturdier stocks and clean it up to a nicer looking shape. As it has been sitting for a while without attention, I would add some ammendments to the soil around it as well. It has probably depleted whatever was there before. Add some compost, well rotted manure, alfalfa meal, epsom salt, shredded leaves, etc. You could even give it a watering with compost or manure tea (made by putting a couple of shovelfuls of matter into a large bucket filled with water and letting it steep for a few days - stir it every day or so.) When you water with this dilute it first.

I would highly doubt that you will see any sign of a bloom this year this late in the season, but you should certainly see the bush pick up and have some new growth. It certainly must be a hardy bush to have lasted with out any care at all! I am sure it will love all the care you can give it!

I'm so glad that I have been able to help you make a difference in your roses, and given you something that you can always take with you! :D

Bonne journée, mon français s'est levé! :wink:
VAL

JPIXI
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Thanks VAL! Thanks for your advices and time taken to do the research, very impressive!

I will certainly follow your instructions and if it blooms again, I will certainly send you photo of it.

The soil condition of Rene d'Anjou seems to be very good, black, fine soil. The humidity is just perfect too, not too wet nor dry. Perhaps this is why this old bush can survive over these years without any attention at all. She is about 6 feet tall, but leggy. I will use air proprogation to ensure the cut back wont make this species disappear forever in my garden. Guess, it isnt easy to get this species these days easily.

It is strange that I have never seen this rose in Angers before when I studied french there. Angers is an very old town with many fruits and flowery insitutions, if you guys visit France, take a TGV (90mins) to this peaceful, wonderful town. It is nothing like Paris at all, very clean, polite and lovable town.

Scott, I have attached a picture of this rose for you to have a look, as it isnt easy to find on internet.

[img]https://img375.imageshack.us/img375/1372/renedanjou6mu.jpg[/img]

Cheers and thanks guys!
Pixi

grandpasrose
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Isn't it a pretty rose! Good idea to propogate some of the trimmings when you prune it - you're thinking!! 8)

Even though the soil looks nice and black, doesn't mean it has everything it needs. I would still consider adding some amendments to it - can't hurt and it'll give it a boost.

I think my chances of getting to France are pretty slim - I will have to see it vicariously through you. It sounds very beautiful. One thing that you all have over in Europe is such an old sense of history all around you, whereas over here, especially in the west, our history is very recent comparatively. I would love that! I am a geneologist, with my family traced back to 1150. I collect antique china from the late 1800's, and we collect antique cameras - some as far back as 1880. So you can see history is big for me!

Let me know how it is going with your latest find, and I hope your propogating attempts are successful! :D

Jusqu'à plus tard, mon ami rose! :wink:
VAL

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What a gorgeous rose Pixi! Tres bon!

Yes you had best be careful with that; while it might be easier for you to put your hands on than us, I can assure you that a lot of those antiques are IMPOSSIBLE to find. So while you can get the rest we've discussed at the local garden center, this one would necessitate a real treasure hunt to replace...

Bon chance, mon ami, although if antique roses just pop up like that in your backyard, you are already very lucky... :lol:

Scott

grandpasrose
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Isn't she though? Can you just imagine walking out into the yard out back and coming upon these beauties? I would be sooooo excited! 8)
VAL

JPIXI
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Location: France, Paris

Hi VAL Hi Scott,

Thanks for the compliments.

I suppose my luck is repaid by my bravery to buy over this old apartment with a virgin wild forest, unattended over years...

I afraid that I had already cut off some antiques without even notice they are roses before coming to this forum. It seems the previous owner was a rose addict, collecting many precious species. I had a few roses that is going to bloom, I am anxious to see if they are nice and worth keeping. If you guys are interested I will post some pictures of them when they bloom?

Guys, I did some air layering of these roses, I wonder if I keep the layering over autumn to wait for roots, and forgo the chance to trim them, will it affect next year growth?

Let me show you guys an invention that keep my air layering packets moist all the time. It is an air pressure water pump that is transform by turning an old mechanical pencil into it. I use this invention like an injection needle to inject water into the packets to keep the soil wet.


[img]https://img352.imageshack.us/img352/1693/dsc00010rs.jpg[/img]

Lastly, can you guys give me some advices? I intend to get a machine that cut branches into smaller bits. I wonder is it useful for compose usage? Any side effects?

Have a good day ahead guys!

Cheers,
Pixi

grandpasrose
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Wow Pixi, you sure are creative with your solutions!!

I would love to see pictures of your re-discovered roses when they come into bloom! 8) Even though you may have cut some off before realizing that you had something special there, watch for them to come back, as they may rejuvenate themselves from your drastic trimming!

I don't think that if you leave your air layering on through the autumn that it will effect your next year's growth. You can always trim them after your airlayering is complete, if it is not too cold yet, or wait until spring and give them a pruning then.

I love your invention with the mechanical pencil as an injection needle to keep your packets moist! You have a very inventive mind! 8)

Certainly use a chipper/mulching machine for building compost! We do it here all the time. Just ensure that you don't add too much wood material at one time to your compost without any other additions like kitchen waste, grass clippings, manure, soil, etc. The material that you end up with after chipping branches can also be used as a mulch around your shrubs and trees and things.

Vous faites un travail merveilleux Pixi, le gardez vers le haut et votre forêt envahie sera bientôt glorieuse!

Jour splendide à vous aussi! :wink:
VAL

JPIXI
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Location: France, Paris

Thanks VAL for your compliments. I will keep in mind to show you my other roses which are not bloom yet.

As for the Rene d'anjou, I guess Scott had mistaken. The rose tree that I had had not bloom yet, the picture I display was from a site to show you guys how it will be when it blooms, but I believe it is Rene d'Anjou as there was a tag nearly it. I will certainly show you guys next year if she blooms.

Guys, I wonder is picking the access flower bulb to have larger flower better by hand or scissors? Someone told me that I should even hand pick the leaf instead of scissor to promote more nturients to the flower. Is our hands better than scissor?

Looking forward to your advices guys!

Bonne journee et à trés bientôt.

Pixi

grandpasrose
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Hi Pixi! Removing extra buds from your rose bush promotes larger flowers. If you want to do this, you remove the secondary buds on the stem of the flower you are wanting to be larger. You can do this, or you can leave all your buds on, and get more flowers, that are just a little smaller, it is what you prefer.
You are better to remove excess buds from your bush to get larger flowers with sharp, clean pruners. If you use your hand, you are likely to tear the stem, leaving a wound on your branch. Using scissors, although better than your hand, is not the best either, as they are not as sharp, nor shaped for cutting stems.
When you use pruners, be sure to always thoroughly clean them between each use to prevent spreading any bacteria or disease between your plants. :wink:

Jour heureux et heureux!
VAL



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