Self-sufficiency, what to/can/can't you grow and store?

[pomerinke]

If only the idea of conservation was more widespread in America.

Where I grew up in Missouri, we always had great summers for a garden, though I never much participated except to challenge my sister to see who could eat more hot peppers. Mostly my parents grew tomatoes, cucumbers, peppers. We never canned or preserved, though. Sometimes my mom would put the peppers in the windows to dry, but that was it.
I always lived close enough to woods to hunt, but I never did. I'm a decent shot, and could do it if necessary, but it wasn't something that our family really was into. I did (and still do) love fishing. If I had to start from scratch to provide food, that's where I would start.

As for electricity, the biggest use would be heat, and keeping clean. If we're considering the type of occurrence that would cause this type of societal regression, then the majority of your electrical needs would disappear overnight. Consider TV, Internet, and cable/satellite would be useless.

Where I'm at now, in Okinawa, the weather seems to be warm enough to grow all year. (I haven't had a plant through the winter yet, because I've just recently started gardening) Of course, being a small tropical island, fish is in abundance as well. And again, fishing would be the first place I would start if I needed to provide my own source of sustenance. Gardening would be my number 2 because I'm so limited on space.

Slightly off topic is the sustainability of the different cultures. In Japan for example, they are almost ultra conservative when it comes do daily life. Everyone recycles. They have booths set up at festivals with people staffing them to help everyone separate their trash into the right bins! Most people even turn off the shower water when they are lathering, as to not waste it. When me and my wife moved in together, her electric bill more than doubled. She had a computer she hadn't used in at least two years, and she had just cancelled her internet a few months before I met her. She only had a small tv and her cell phone. At that apartment, we had a dryer, but I only saw her use it during a typhoon that lasted more than 2 days. Otherwise we dried clothes outside.

I guess the point I'm making is a lot of people don't realize how much stuff they have is actually unnecessary. I think in a self-sufficiency test, most people would surprise themselves with the things they can go without. Humans are adaptable creatures, which is why we're still here.

One of our next foot print reducing steps will be a tankless on-demand water heater

These are standard fare where I'm at. And I have a love hate relationship with them. Electricity is expensive here, so most use natural gas to heat. My biggest problem is I have to run the bathroom sink on hot or the trip switch will cut off while I'm still in the shower. So while I'm enjoying my nice warm shower, it'll suddenly get bone cold. After a few seconds the heater turns back on when it detects the temperature drop, but I can't imagine most people understand how infuriating that could be. It's not nearly as bad during the summer, and the ground and building actually get warm enough I don't even use hot water for my showers during the hottest months of the year.

[ButterflyLady29]

In some areas the new technology is wonderful and very helpful. I would love to have an inline water heater but that's not in the budget just yet. We're still using our 25 year old fiberglass Marathon water heater. The new spray on foam insulation would be very helpful in the attic and crawlspace.

The advances in solar technology alone are amazing compared to what was available even 20 years ago. Unfortunately we live in a heavily wooded area and are lucky to have half day sun in the summer. The only reason the passive solar works is because the trees aren't blocking the low winter sunlight. It's also an area where there is no city water or gas lines. The hand pump for the well is our next big purchase because I don't want to carry buckets of questionable creek water up the hill when the power goes out. While new wood stoves are more efficient I'm stuck with the one that came with the house and is the only thing that fits in the current space. I want one of the heat induction fans that set on top of the stove and circulates faster according to the temperature.

Old technology like clothes lines and reel type mowers are still viable options. Sun drying herbs and smoking meat over a fire are also very old school methods that work just as well today as they did thousands of years ago. But I sure don't need a dryer that connects to the internet or a fridge that tracks my leftovers and calls me when the cold cuts are past their prime. On the other hand, flashlights and battery powered lanterns are so much safer than oil lamps and open flame candles. Yes, a blending of both old and new technology is currently the best way to try minimizing our footprint.

I would like to see more solar powered light options and ones that are more reliable than what is currently available. We use flashlights very frequently and are always buying batteries. The current solar lights have batteries that can't withstand cold temperatures and don't last very long. We use them to light the walkway to the house but they are useful only in the warmer months.

Have you seen the new LED strip lights? We bought some to install in the basement and crawlspace to replace the florescent shop lights. While they may not be bright enough for plant growth (haven't experimented in that area yet) they provide more than enough light for nearly any indoor task. I can't say if they really made an impact on our electric bill but they don't have that constant hum and are easy on the eyes.

[pomerinke]

The LED strip lights are great. I would like to have some of them in my home, but being in an apartment prevents any kind of home improvement.

I would expect them to use quite a bit less electricity based on what I've read.

[ButterflyLady29]

I will admit I'm not really seeing a difference in my bill. I pay less than 12 cents per kwh so it would take a lot of kilowatts before I would notice a real difference. Not running the dryer for a couple loads of laundry saves me much more money. Replacing the old freezer in the basement would save even more. It's on the list, but it needs to be emptied first and it's crammed full of food. Right now I'm in the process of making jam and jelly out of last summers harvest of grapes and berries. I've already made 15 jars of blackberry/currant jelly. The grapes and some farm market cherries are next. Hubby won't need to buy jelly later this year.

I am expanding the vineyard. One vine is producing some already and we planted 6 more in the fall. I can't wait to experiment with juice and jelly from 3 different varieties. The blueberry bushes are growing, they would do better if I would fence the rabbits out. I also planted a staghorn sumac shrub. I've heard how you can make a lemonade type drink from the seed heads and am really anxious to try that. Also scheduled for spring is revamping the berry patches. I want to expand the blackberry patch and make new raspberry patches. Right now the raspberries are a weedy overgrown mess which is very difficult to harvest. In a few years I might be able to sell some jelly and make a little $$.

[ID jit]

The LED strip lights are great. I would like to have some of them in my home, but being in an apartment prevents any kind of home improvement.

I would expect them to use quite a bit less electricity based on what I've read.

Solar battery recharger + 12 volt battery + LED strips light or auxiliary LED auxiliary driving light for cars + fuse + wire + switch = almost free light.

Put lights in my shed with left over stuff in the garage this way.... progressed to desk lamps and all kinds of things. Will probably canabalize the shed lights to make a compost tea brewer this summer. Have a DC air pump from moving aquariums.

[pomerinke]

Solar battery recharger + 12 volt battery + LED strips light or auxiliary LED auxiliary driving light for cars + fuse + wire + switch = almost free light.

Great idea! I'll definitely try something like that once I move.

ButterflyLady, I'm extremely jealous you can grow blueberries. I've always wanted to. Do you make wine? I've tried a few different blueberry wines, and I think they're better than most others.

[ID jit]

Have been trying to find a way to get full spectrum sun light out of LED's ....

If they can grow bananas in Iceland with geothermic heat and electricity, don't see why I can't figure out how to use a solar furnace with heat sink and PV panels + batteries + capacitors to create a fake New England June in a small green house. (Think this is especially true with the way the climate is headed.)

[ButterflyLady29]

So far (3 years) the blueberry bushes haven't produced anything. I had one that produced a few berries but I covered it with a curtain to keep the birds out and the bush died. I now have wildlife netting which keeps birds out without overheating the plants.

I've never tested the pH of my soil. I know it should be tested but so far everything is growing well enough to keep the rabbits well fed. I add a lot of leaf mulch every year and now I've been putting coffee grounds around the bushes. I spread pine sawdust with rabbit manure and urine over the ground under the bushes too.

[sweetiepie]

Answering the thread's question. I can almost anything, milk, meat, garden produce, etc. I would love a way to store lettuce. I just don't have a good place in the house to raise lettuce indoors and freezing and canning are out.

[digitS']

Sufficient seed in your self-sufficiency and sprouts plus microgreens should be a possibility.

Probably, most vegetable gardeners are hungry for salad greens along about ..

. mid-January.

Steve

[applestar]

I'm so enjoying the discussion here. You've all gone and are thinking way beyond anything I had contemplated and I'm just taking notes.

BTW re LED lighting, have you seen the gmc sierra commercial? If they can do high beams with LED lights, it should be possible to have plant grow lights, too, right?

[imafan26]

From what I read the regular LED lights do not have the full spectrum of light. They do make LED grow lights but they are very expensive. Maybe in time the price will come down. The good thing about LED is that they should last a long time, but flourescents do too.

[ID jit]

I'm so enjoying the discussion here. You've all gone and are thinking way beyond anything I had contemplated and I'm just taking notes.

BTW re LED lighting, have you seen the gmc sierra commercial? If they can do high beams with LED lights, it should be possible to have plant grow lights, too, right?

I haven't found any grow lights that are reasonable.
Have found UV and IR LEDs though. Building LED arrays isn't hard, just a lot of soldering and a little, pretty simple math. Materials are all relitively cheap to build LED arrays, but it is time consuming.

What I haven't been able to find is a breakdown of full sunlight in a form I can use....
something like __% light in this wavelength + __% light in this wavelength ....

Do know that strawberry plants will live under "day light" LED bulbs. Kind of hard for me to sya how well they don because I have been playing with mixes and wasn't as patient and gentle through the runner rooting process as I should have been.

[digitS']

What do we eat?

This is a "Per capita consumption of major food commodities" Table from the USDA. It is just a part of a larger table including more years. There wasn't a great deal of difference over these 20 years and it was easier for me to copy this part off the pdf file, so here it is :

I hope it is legible. It's from https://www.ers.usda.gov and the 711 pounds per capita consumption of fruits and vegetables must be most relevant to this discussion. Of course, the ~200# of flour and cereal products might be included and it's all, potentially, within the scope of a homesteader : 109# red meat, 14# fish, 64# poultry, 30# eggs, 567# dairy, 64# fats & oils, even the 22# of "other," I suppose.

It would be no small feat for a couple adults but imagine doing this for a large family ... our ancestors were an accomplished and admirable people!

Steve