Revenantwing
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Starting with a Bonsai!

I don't have a bonsai tree yet but I am planning on getting one very soon. Are there any particular bonsai trees that I should avoid and any tips I may need for starters.

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froggy
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Well, congrats to stopping by before you had a dying tree ;)

I'd suggest reading through the learning forum and also the bonsai section on helpfulgardener.com

Then, you should have a thought or two about where you are going to keep the tree.
Indoors or out? Can you provide a cool place for dormancy? Do you have an unheated garage or greenhouse where you could keep a tree that cannot get too cold?
How much light have you got indoors? Are you willing to set up extra lighting?
What is the climate like where you live? Thoughts about bonsai species that are native to your area?
All this will help you find a tree you can actually provide the right environment for...

For indoors, ficus and schefflera are quite popular - as tropical trees they don really need a dormant period with reduced temperature. They might like a stay outside over summer, but it is not essential.

Outdoors you have junipers and Chinese elm as probably the two most popular trees - but you can also look into native species.

If you leg us know where & how you are going to keep the tree, I am sure there will be more suggestions :)

kdodds
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Excellent advice given so far. The last piece I would offer is this: do NOT buy a bonsai from a mall, supermarket, home superstore, etc. Buy one from a specialized bonsai nursery or a trusted online seller (I'm sure there are quite a few people here who can reccommend sellers). Oh, and one more thing... you'll find a HUGE price difference between "starter trees" and "finished bonsai". You will not find a well started, trained (I won't say "finished" because a bonsai never is) tree in a bonsai pot for under $60. If it's less than than, it's either mass-produced, or a start in a bonsai pot. For the money, you can't beat Weigert's. His "starts" ship in 6", 8", or larger, already shallow pots. The "starts" are VERY well started and, most of the time, truly ready for potting up into a bonsai pot. I can highly recommend them for indoor trees.

Revenantwing
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Indoors or out? Indoors
Can you provide a cool place for dormancy? yep
Do you have an unheated garage or greenhouse where you could keep a tree that cannot get too cold? no D:
How much light have you got indoors?I have a desk light that I use to shine over my aquarium which I can happily turn to my bonsai
Are you willing to set up extra lighting? sure as long as its not too much
What is the climate like where you live? I live in NYC where its really hot in the summer and REALLY cold in the winter.
Thoughts about bonsai species that are native to your area? I'm not sure about the species.

Revenantwing
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So I should get a starter bonsai tree? can I have an example please? thanks :D

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Wort
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Revenantwing wrote:Indoors or out? Indoors
Can you provide a cool place for dormancy? yep
Do you have an unheated garage or greenhouse where you could keep a tree that cannot get too cold? no D:
How much light have you got indoors?I have a desk light that I use to shine over my aquarium which I can happily turn to my bonsai
Are you willing to set up extra lighting? sure as long as its not too much
What is the climate like where you live? I live in NYC where its really hot in the summer and REALLY cold in the winter.
Thoughts about bonsai species that are native to your area? I'm not sure about the species.
I'm not so sure a desk light would be sufficient but I'm not an expert

Revenantwing
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its CFL 5000k 14w light bulb. I use it to grow the low light plants in my aquarium.

kdodds
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You'll want to look at a Ficus, or possibly Schefflera then.

Take a look here: https://www.wigertsbonsai.com/

Revenantwing
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I only see ficus. Do I keep my light on it 24/7? and also do those come in anything smaller? 8 inch pots are quite big

kdodds
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Is this tree ONLY going to get a 13W CF conversion bulb? If it's going to get just that, and no natural light at all, you'll probably be better off going with something artificial. You would have to contact Wigert's to see if they have anything smaller, I don't know their stock, but I do know their quality. Frankly, if an 8" pot is too much for you, I don't really know what you're looking for at all. Anything smaller than that is going to start approaching mame size, or seedling/start size and not be a "real" bonsai. Smaller Shohin and larger Mame sizes are more difficult to take care of than larger Shohin or full sized trees. AND, trees grow. A 6" tree will not stay 6", not unless you want to keep chopping it down to a leafless stump every few years. Perhaps you should concentrate on buying or borrowing some books on indoor bonsai cultivation first?

Revenantwing
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of course its going to my on my window sill!

kdodds
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What direction does this window face?

linlaoboo
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I have a different take on this. If it's your 1st time trying bonsai, do not spend hundreds of bucks on something that may not survive a few months later. Do consider tropical trees found in Ikeas and local supermarkets if there's no nursery that specializes in bonsai in your area. Trees that are mass produced don't mean it's bad, most times you will have to look into replacing the soil with a better bonsai mix after you get it. Replacing the soil is done every 2 to 3 years anyways. Mass produced trees are grown in the ground in places like Central America or Southern China. They often come trained already and have the look of an aged tree due to optimal growing conditions in the ground. The lower labor rates from where they're produced means we get more bang for the buck here.

The other day I saw a Youtube video of Weigerts showing their spring arrival of Ficus, Fujian Teas and Chinese elms they ordered from China, all shipped in corregated boxes bare rooted. They then soak them in superthrive before potting them up for sale 6 weeks later. So don't be against products from overseas or discount stores. Some shrubs from home improvement stores can be trained into bonsai if you know how. I do buy starters from bonsai nurseries also. It hurts me to see people posting on here with their dead or dying tree telling us they spend $100 euro for it when there's lower cost alternatives for a beginner to learn the basic bonsai care on 1st. With ficus, a good indoor beginner tree, you can easily root the cuttings and make as many starter trees as you want for free.
kdodds wrote:Excellent advice given so far. The last piece I would offer is this: do NOT buy a bonsai from a mall, supermarket, home superstore, etc. Buy one from a specialized bonsai nursery or a trusted online seller (I'm sure there are quite a few people here who can reccommend sellers). Oh, and one more thing... you'll find a HUGE price difference between "starter trees" and "finished bonsai". You will not find a well started, trained (I won't say "finished" because a bonsai never is) tree in a bonsai pot for under $60. If it's less than than, it's either mass-produced, or a start in a bonsai pot. For the money, you can't beat Weigert's. His "starts" ship in 6", 8", or larger, already shallow pots. The "starts" are VERY well started and, most of the time, truly ready for potting up into a bonsai pot. I can highly recommend them for indoor trees.

Revenantwing
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One pointing north and another west.
Last edited by Revenantwing on Wed May 04, 2011 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Revenantwing
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I'm not sure about this bonsai tree near my house. It has big leaves but I am not sure if its the ficus. How do I determine if the tree is a ficus?

kdodds
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West is okay, north is bad.

There are no Ficus growing outdoors in NYC that would be suitable for bonsai indoors. In fact, the only Ficus I have ever seen in NY growing up were F. carica growing in backyards. Even these need sheltering in the winter.

Revenantwing
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so ill get them from https://www.wigertsbonsai.com/
whats a pre-bonsai?

would this be good for me?
https://wigertsbonsai.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=66&products_id=246

kdodds
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You don't necessarily need to buy from them. I offered their site because you'll get the most bang for your buck in terms of pre-bonsai material. Okay, now that you know what a pre-bonsai looks like, check out some other sites. You'll see images of little whips, barely seedlings, with no real pre-bonsai styling sold as "finished" bonsai for $30 or $40 or more. I would not necessarily go with that particular species as a first tree because they're slower growing than most other ficus (like F. benjamina and its cultivars). Shop around, just don't jump in and buy something because someone recommeded it. Read. THEN, make an educated choice. The trees in the 8" pots you see on Wigert's contain trees that, depotted, pruned, and repotted into 6" pots will look like some very, very well matured bonsai right off the bat. Also check e-bay, there are quite a few sellers there as well. I can tell you for sure, from looking last night that anything matured as well is going for $50+, many over $100. HOWEVER, many, many, first time bonsai enthusiasts DO go with commercial "bonsai". It's not that it's a truly horrible route to go. You CAN get a "bonsai" from, say, a home superstore for $20 or $30, already in cheap bonsai pots. And, this may work for you if you don't mind a tree that's not really been styled, or, at most, chopped off at the knees last year and allowed to sprout before sale, or one that is more of an artificially twisted I-don't-know-what than a bonsai in any traditional style. Just don't buy anything that's got rocks glued on top of the soil, nor anything that isn't already growing well. I have to also stress, again, that all you need to know about bonsai isn't going to be learned in this thread. Your first step, pre-purchase of a tree, should be a decent book.

Revenantwing
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Getting the complete guide to bonsai then.

linlaoboo
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u ever make it out to Ikea of Elizabeth, there are ficus and Fukien Teas thre. Check out their pricing and avail at https://www.ikea.com/us/en/search/?query=bonsai

They bought me a Fukien Tea aka Carmona which I didn't take because I have killed 2 of them already.

Ever make it out to Exton, PA a place called Waterloo Gardens has a good selection of mature and starter bonsais for a good price. I've bought 4" starters from them 2 years ago and all are living without problems.

kdodds
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Are you in Manhattan? I've been racking my brains trying to remember if there are any actual bonsai shops in the city. I know there are a few out on Long Island and I think there's MAYBE one just below mid-town, in the 20's. I think I remember there being one there. Living Sculpture, something like that. I have no idea what they have or how much they charge, tho.

Revenantwing
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Nope I'm in queens and I don't see flower shops in my area. The one right next door to me has pretty much a stand with a bunch of flowers and plants.

Revenantwing
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I'm just looking at my options.
Would these be okay indoors?
https://www.amazon.com/Brussels-Golden-Gate-Ficus-Bonsai/dp/B0000DGF9V/ref=sr_1_3?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1304652414&sr=1-3

if not then ill probably get the microcarpa

kdodds
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There was ONE nursey in Queens I found, but that was 20 years ago, and they still only had the generic stuff you'd be getting from Amazon. Yes, Golden Gate is a fine beginner's indoor tree.

linlaoboo
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Try google up Jackie's bonsai in flushing on College Point Blvd.

In Central Jersey ther's a good Bonsai Nursery near the corner of Rt 27 and CR529

linlaoboo
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Price is a little steep but you pay for the convenience of shipping to your door I guess. Seller is Amazon so you have the extra protection of their return policy. Might wanna find out if it comes with real bonsai pot as pictured.

I was at the Brooklyn Bontanical Garden last weekend for the Cherry Blossom Festival and saw a few similar ficuses along with Junipers on the shelf in their garden shop with no price tags. Just FYI.

Btw, not sure if you know that place has a room with a good collection of developed bonsais of all kinds on display.
Revenantwing wrote:I'm just looking at my options.
Would these be okay indoors?
https://www.amazon.com/Brussels-Golden-Gate-Ficus-Bonsai/dp/B0000DGF9V/ref=sr_1_3?s=home-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1304652414&sr=1-3

if not then ill probably get the microcarpa

Revenantwing
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https://wigertsbonsai.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=66&products_id=248

is that a good bonsai?

kdodds
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Yup, and you won't find better developed tree at that price anywhere. You'll need a pot, but I prefer to know the tree first anyway before potting it.



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