Well, I live in a small HI-RISE downtown - mid Canada. Winters are just bloody well - BRUTAL. However, we do manage to get a crack at all four seasons. ... and some of the summer months are HOT!
That being said, I am doing a community gardening effort to help with the cash flow seeing as how the $$$ of GAS has gone ballistic!
Suggestions please: I want to grow the standard garden-variety (is there such a thing") LOL - of veggies.
I have turned the ground over. Now --- I have laid out --pretty much where I want what,
What I don't know, is, ??? pretty much where to start so that I have some short season vegetables available throught the summer/fall rather than bust my hump all season and be overwhelmed all at once in the fall.
When I say "standard" -- I mean a few rows of Corn at the back of the lot, (Oh, by the way --- 1500 sq ft)
and as I think of it a couple of different corn varieties, squashes, pumpkins, cukes, etc.
Q) Can I have a variety of spuds all in the same general area?
Some rads, lettuce - iceberg, romaine;
----------------
What kind of space is generally left between rows?
Shucks the list of questions could go on. but enough for now.
Any and all feedback is MOST welcome.
marwen
Suggestions for an Urban Vegetable Garden
Last edited by marwen on Sun May 04, 2008 9:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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LikeMarigold
- Full Member
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 9:10 pm
- Location: Newark, NJ
Hi, Marwen
My expertise falls more on the side of tomatoes, herbs, and lettuces, but I can give some of this a shot.
Every plant likes different spacing, but if you plant seedlings 6-8 inches apart for lettuces and herbs, you'll usually be fine. Tomatoes and other viney plants (peppers, eggplants, cukes) should be at least a foot apart, or even eighteen inches. If plants are too close, they can choke each other, or block each other's access to light and nutrients. Read up on each type separately and try to take all into account. Squashes and pumpkins need TONS of space, and will squash whatever they want to as they spread. You can arrange the vines as they grow, but they're going to want to spread out big time, so leave'em a bunch of space.
You can sow seeds for lettuces and other light, leafy, shallow-root veggies throughout the season. In this way, plants that have a 60-day lifespan can overlap and serve you from June to September.
Plants like corn and squashes have a long, slow growing season and harvest all at once. Some plant varieties have been bred to bear fruit (and veggies) all season. Strawberry varietals called "everbearing" offer fruits over the whole summer, rather than all at one time. Choose your varieties carefully, and you'll be able to stagger your harvest.
Talk to your gardening supply guru (probably the middle-aged, wiry lady with spectacles at the local garden center who is being trailed by six or seven confused-looking people waving lists and products at her). As you go, clarify your plans, and throw yourself at her mercy. She'll help you out!!
My expertise falls more on the side of tomatoes, herbs, and lettuces, but I can give some of this a shot.
Every plant likes different spacing, but if you plant seedlings 6-8 inches apart for lettuces and herbs, you'll usually be fine. Tomatoes and other viney plants (peppers, eggplants, cukes) should be at least a foot apart, or even eighteen inches. If plants are too close, they can choke each other, or block each other's access to light and nutrients. Read up on each type separately and try to take all into account. Squashes and pumpkins need TONS of space, and will squash whatever they want to as they spread. You can arrange the vines as they grow, but they're going to want to spread out big time, so leave'em a bunch of space. You can sow seeds for lettuces and other light, leafy, shallow-root veggies throughout the season. In this way, plants that have a 60-day lifespan can overlap and serve you from June to September. Plants like corn and squashes have a long, slow growing season and harvest all at once. Some plant varieties have been bred to bear fruit (and veggies) all season. Strawberry varietals called "everbearing" offer fruits over the whole summer, rather than all at one time. Choose your varieties carefully, and you'll be able to stagger your harvest. Talk to your gardening supply guru (probably the middle-aged, wiry lady with spectacles at the local garden center who is being trailed by six or seven confused-looking people waving lists and products at her). As you go, clarify your plans, and throw yourself at her mercy. She'll help you out!!
Is this in in full sun all the time? You can go wide row, that's about 3 ft, so you can reach the middle of the bed more easily to weed, harvest etc.
When you do wide rows, you do "patches" it's basically square foot gardening on a larger scale. Use radishes as row markers, not only do they taste great, because they germinate so fast you can see where you planted last. And they are great as a trap crop for bean, squash and tater beetles. You just pull up the disease and damaged radishes and discard. Then plant some more!
With wide rows, you can over plant your root veggies and then thin them, that's the hard part for beginners. You sow heavily and then thin them with an iron tooth rake, going several different directions when you thin. Those seedlings are edible,
But the minute holes they leave behind allows more light and water to penetrate the ground and helps the remaining plants to get bigger.
You need to remember that squash, cukes and melons sprawl, you can train the vines but if you can build some cheap sturdy trellis, got that way. PVC pipe works wonderfully, just rough it a bit with some sandpaper, so the vine can grab. Use old knee highs or pantyhose to "sling" the fruit. It's really important that the trellis be very sturdy, the vines and fruit get really heavy. And can pull down a trellis. If you set it up right that could be reusable You need to pick the smaller melons and pumpkins for that btw. It's much easier to harvest off a trellis and you have fewer problems with disease and insects.
I'm trying to figure out how to tell you to compost, since that's heavy and hard to transport, but you could do it in 5 gal bucket from your place if you live where you can do a bin. Great fertilizer, you could make compost tea for all that. You can buy bagged compost or cow poo, just make sure it's organic. Get yourself some cheesecloth, it's about .69 a yard, double or triple it over or a burlap bag. A couple of good size shovel fulls of compost or poo in the material. Tie it tightly shut and stick in a 5 gal bucket of water and steep your "tea". Just use it as a side dressing for your growing veggies.
Goodness, I didn't mean to write a novel, but I get so excited seeing you young people that are interested in doing this. It's my way of paying it forward to thank the experienced gardeners who helped us when we had no clue........LOL
When you do wide rows, you do "patches" it's basically square foot gardening on a larger scale. Use radishes as row markers, not only do they taste great, because they germinate so fast you can see where you planted last. And they are great as a trap crop for bean, squash and tater beetles. You just pull up the disease and damaged radishes and discard. Then plant some more!
With wide rows, you can over plant your root veggies and then thin them, that's the hard part for beginners. You sow heavily and then thin them with an iron tooth rake, going several different directions when you thin. Those seedlings are edible,
But the minute holes they leave behind allows more light and water to penetrate the ground and helps the remaining plants to get bigger. You need to remember that squash, cukes and melons sprawl, you can train the vines but if you can build some cheap sturdy trellis, got that way. PVC pipe works wonderfully, just rough it a bit with some sandpaper, so the vine can grab. Use old knee highs or pantyhose to "sling" the fruit. It's really important that the trellis be very sturdy, the vines and fruit get really heavy. And can pull down a trellis. If you set it up right that could be reusable
You need to pick the smaller melons and pumpkins for that btw. It's much easier to harvest off a trellis and you have fewer problems with disease and insects. I'm trying to figure out how to tell you to compost, since that's heavy and hard to transport, but you could do it in 5 gal bucket from your place if you live where you can do a bin. Great fertilizer, you could make compost tea for all that. You can buy bagged compost or cow poo, just make sure it's organic. Get yourself some cheesecloth, it's about .69 a yard, double or triple it over or a burlap bag. A couple of good size shovel fulls of compost or poo in the material. Tie it tightly shut and stick in a 5 gal bucket of water and steep your "tea". Just use it as a side dressing for your growing veggies.
Goodness, I didn't mean to write a novel, but I get so excited seeing you young people that are interested in doing this. It's my way of paying it forward to thank the experienced gardeners who helped us when we had no clue........LOL
hey there
I am from the interior of bc and have a friends who just moved here from winnipeg--they tell me that our growing seasons are very similar.
If you grow tomatoes make sure that you "pinch" any suckers off (small shoots will start in between a'branch" and the stem, just pinch them off. Also once you have tomatoes on your plant you can cut off any leaves that are beneath the fruit.
You really have to watch the radishes because they are really loved by worms and won't last long on the ground if you leave them too long because the worms will bore right into them.
Spinach is really great because it grows fast and pretty much constantly, it does go to seed and so does lettuce.
Not sure what else you are planning on growing but in my town I grow tomatoes, lettuce, spinach, potatoes, cukes, beans, swiss chard, broccoli, califlower, carrots, peas, I had luck only once with a spagehtti squash.
Oh ya you questioned potatoes, from my experience you can plant them in the same area but I don't inter mix the varieties. One spot will have all nova scotia blues and another spot beside them will have something else.
Which now reminds me to tell you if you have more than one varitey of cukes don't plant them beside eachother, you won't get nearly as many cukes as if you keep them seperated.
Anyway hope some of this helped...good luck with the garden
I am from the interior of bc and have a friends who just moved here from winnipeg--they tell me that our growing seasons are very similar.
If you grow tomatoes make sure that you "pinch" any suckers off (small shoots will start in between a'branch" and the stem, just pinch them off. Also once you have tomatoes on your plant you can cut off any leaves that are beneath the fruit.
You really have to watch the radishes because they are really loved by worms and won't last long on the ground if you leave them too long because the worms will bore right into them.
Spinach is really great because it grows fast and pretty much constantly, it does go to seed and so does lettuce.
Not sure what else you are planning on growing but in my town I grow tomatoes, lettuce, spinach, potatoes, cukes, beans, swiss chard, broccoli, califlower, carrots, peas, I had luck only once with a spagehtti squash.
Oh ya you questioned potatoes, from my experience you can plant them in the same area but I don't inter mix the varieties. One spot will have all nova scotia blues and another spot beside them will have something else.
Which now reminds me to tell you if you have more than one varitey of cukes don't plant them beside eachother, you won't get nearly as many cukes as if you keep them seperated.
Anyway hope some of this helped...good luck with the garden
Those are "wire" worms eating your radishes, Canuck. You can clean a lot of them out by planting the old fashioned type of Marigolds allowing them to bloom and then turn them under in the fall.
Plant your tater on the ground guys, it's so much easier on your back and you get a much bigger yield. Just cover with straw or leaves as they grow. You can also use tires or trash cans as well.
You do not want to remove too many leaves from your mature tomatoes, they are such heavy feeders they need the leaves to get good photosynthesis's. But you can spray them with epsom salts water to get good blossom set, works well for squash and peppers as well.
1 tablespoon of Epsom Salts in 1 gallon of warm water. Mix throughly and soak your plants. The veggies love the extra boost of magnesium in the epsom salts and will really take off!
Plant your tater on the ground guys, it's so much easier on your back and you get a much bigger yield. Just cover with straw or leaves as they grow. You can also use tires or trash cans as well.
You do not want to remove too many leaves from your mature tomatoes, they are such heavy feeders they need the leaves to get good photosynthesis's. But you can spray them with epsom salts water to get good blossom set, works well for squash and peppers as well.
1 tablespoon of Epsom Salts in 1 gallon of warm water. Mix throughly and soak your plants. The veggies love the extra boost of magnesium in the epsom salts and will really take off!
doccat -- Oh my goodness, I havn't been called that in a few decades
THANK YOU! THANK YOU ! THANK YOU! LOL
Well, now that we've got that outa the way -- chuckle, chuckle. --- Retired -- 68 in mid July -- live in a hirise in downtown The Peg. For years now, all I've been able to do is plant a really small -- hang over the railing -- flower troughs. A few large pots manage to sprout some corn but they never get large enough to produce.
A couple of years ago, a buddy and I went out to the woods and dug up some 36" evergreens in sxome sandy soil. They lasted two seasons 'cause they got so big and choked themselves in a "pot"
I just managed to rent some land that the city fathers designated to is citizens back after the GREAT WAR (WWI) so they could grow essential vegetables.
As time has gone on for the past few decades, they have managed to save that acerage and gleen a very affordable price for both the 1500 sq ft. & the 3000 sq ft plots. (about 25" x 32") I think they are asking about $16 & $30 (respectively) for the entire season. Water included.
Personally, I think that's a GREAT deal!
YEARS ago -- like grade 5 -- 11 years old, the city of Hamilton, ON sponsored grade school kids to have a 10' x 10' sq garden plot. I LOVED IT.
I remember doing the weeding and when my grandmother came out to the "patch" to give me some constructive critisism, I was crushed when laughed at the fact that I dug up the onions too.
The most positive thing that I remember from that time was the DUTCH HOE. Oh YEA! any day!
What I didn't learn though, was how and when to fertilize.
Within a couple of years after that, the family moved out to the country. WOW! A trip from Hamilton to Burlington, was about 25 minutes. At that point in life, that was a LONG drive. We bought 5/8 of an acre. I think I recall the prop. was about 75feet wide by about 365 feet deep.
Half of it was front grass, house, backyard grass then about 50feet away we started our "GARDEN" Oh my --- I was in hog heaven.
I recall that there was forever, a spot at the rear of the prop. for a huge compost heap. Havn't got a clue what grandma did with it though.
I know that I want to try asparagus, but I know that it's really big job. I hear their roots go down almost 10 feet.
Talking about a trellis for the melons and cukes, etc. I was watching a kids show with my 9 year old daughter this AM (Emily Yeung)
They were in a setting of a very healthy gardenpatch. What I spotted was an "L" shaped working trellis and the cross members were fabricated by tying up a netting of the old yellow rope to make up 12" sq. areas. Not too bad of an idea.
Please, stop me I'm wrong, but I plan to have about three rows of 25' --corn -- but I don't know what I should -- or shouldn't put in adjacent rows. I'm thinking of 1/4 of a row near the back of the plot then in actuality, turn that three rows of corn into 18' - 20' of that corn.
When I lived out in CALGARY, AB I remember that the TABOR corn was just awesome. I went to a BBQ at a cattle ranch and the corn was all roasted in their husks sitting directly on the coals.
About a couple of weeks ago, the local rip-off grocery store had some nice looing peaches & cream C on the C. I soaked it in water for about 30 minutes and set them DIRECTLY onto my BBQ. -- 6 minutes later there was about the juiciest corn I've had in a long time.
so much for now.
Talk about getting "potty-of-the-mouth"
marwen
THANK YOU! THANK YOU ! THANK YOU! LOL
Well, now that we've got that outa the way -- chuckle, chuckle. --- Retired -- 68 in mid July -- live in a hirise in downtown The Peg. For years now, all I've been able to do is plant a really small -- hang over the railing -- flower troughs. A few large pots manage to sprout some corn but they never get large enough to produce.
A couple of years ago, a buddy and I went out to the woods and dug up some 36" evergreens in sxome sandy soil. They lasted two seasons 'cause they got so big and choked themselves in a "pot"
I just managed to rent some land that the city fathers designated to is citizens back after the GREAT WAR (WWI) so they could grow essential vegetables.
As time has gone on for the past few decades, they have managed to save that acerage and gleen a very affordable price for both the 1500 sq ft. & the 3000 sq ft plots. (about 25" x 32") I think they are asking about $16 & $30 (respectively) for the entire season. Water included.
Personally, I think that's a GREAT deal!
YEARS ago -- like grade 5 -- 11 years old, the city of Hamilton, ON sponsored grade school kids to have a 10' x 10' sq garden plot. I LOVED IT.
I remember doing the weeding and when my grandmother came out to the "patch" to give me some constructive critisism, I was crushed when laughed at the fact that I dug up the onions too.
The most positive thing that I remember from that time was the DUTCH HOE. Oh YEA! any day!
What I didn't learn though, was how and when to fertilize.
Within a couple of years after that, the family moved out to the country. WOW! A trip from Hamilton to Burlington, was about 25 minutes. At that point in life, that was a LONG drive. We bought 5/8 of an acre. I think I recall the prop. was about 75feet wide by about 365 feet deep.
Half of it was front grass, house, backyard grass then about 50feet away we started our "GARDEN" Oh my --- I was in hog heaven.
I recall that there was forever, a spot at the rear of the prop. for a huge compost heap. Havn't got a clue what grandma did with it though.
I know that I want to try asparagus, but I know that it's really big job. I hear their roots go down almost 10 feet.
Talking about a trellis for the melons and cukes, etc. I was watching a kids show with my 9 year old daughter this AM (Emily Yeung)
They were in a setting of a very healthy gardenpatch. What I spotted was an "L" shaped working trellis and the cross members were fabricated by tying up a netting of the old yellow rope to make up 12" sq. areas. Not too bad of an idea.
Please, stop me I'm wrong, but I plan to have about three rows of 25' --corn -- but I don't know what I should -- or shouldn't put in adjacent rows. I'm thinking of 1/4 of a row near the back of the plot then in actuality, turn that three rows of corn into 18' - 20' of that corn.
When I lived out in CALGARY, AB I remember that the TABOR corn was just awesome. I went to a BBQ at a cattle ranch and the corn was all roasted in their husks sitting directly on the coals.
About a couple of weeks ago, the local rip-off grocery store had some nice looing peaches & cream C on the C. I soaked it in water for about 30 minutes and set them DIRECTLY onto my BBQ. -- 6 minutes later there was about the juiciest corn I've had in a long time.
so much for now.
Talk about getting "potty-of-the-mouth"
marwen