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applestar
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Looking ahead to 2021 season

Are you starting to think about what or how you want to plant your garden next year/season? I am. :-()

Anything new? I was thinking about Sugarcane ... but I probably can’t grow that here in NJ. Apparently Sorghum is a better choice in terms of seasonal climate. Has anyone tried growing it before?


Since I effectively took a break this year, there’s going to be a LOT of prep work. Not particularly looking forward to it, but I guess I got the chance to *test* the “letting a field go fallow to help rejuvenate/restore the health of the soil" concept. I’ll dig up the link when I get the chance.

PaulF
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I always look forward to next year...hoping it not be the last one. All the prep work is done, soil testing results have come back. Outside a new melon or two and a new to me pumpkin it is going to be the same old same old. I am thinking about doing a '20 redoux, but with all the new tomato variety seeds purchased we shall see.

pepperhead212
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Always thinking about the next year, as with all those new trials, and deciding whether to grow them again, or not. A few keepers, but mostly not, which is normal, but I already have a few new ones I'm going to try. Only a couple new catalogs, so far, and I haven't seen any "new" varieties that looked promising, but I've already got a few in trades.

Vanisle_BC
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Every year recently I've thought I should deliberately cut down on the number of things I try to grow; simplify and concentrate on improving conditions for the things that grow well and that produce really significant harvests. Do I follow through on that thought? Usually not. This year? We'll see :).

Further to that: I grew some lemongrass in a pot this year. It grew better than I expected (I always thought it was an 'exotic'). But what a PITA to harvest! extracting the tiny amount of culinary 'pith' from within each hard stalk is a real chore with little reward. Makes me think of the work that must be involved in harvesting Saffron. Then ther'es the garbanzo beans I tried one year - grew into a tangled mess and then the beans to be shelled were ONE to a pod. Ouch! Instead I can get 5 or 6 broad-bean plants inside a single tomato cage, with 5 or 6 fat beans in every pod, and fun to shell on a sunny afternoon: No more chick peas for me.

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digitS'
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AppleStar, I've grown millet and a couple varieties of broom corn, including Texas Black this year. Wow, when Johnny's said that it would grow up to 12', they weren't kidding. Even in my rocky garden and in a location where the wind keeps the sprinkler water from reaching all too often and where the corn was stunted: it was 12'. No sorghum yet and they will have to come up with a short-season variety for me to try.

VanIsle, don't give up on diversity. It really helps with success. Too many varieties and species will do well for several years and then fail miserably one season.

PaulF, I tried both a new-to-me melon and a pie pumpkin in 2020. I've never had a pie pumpkin in my garden. The great storage life of the Jack o'Lantern pumpkin that I grow and tried keeping on a basement shelf, convinced me that a short-season pie pumpkin should be given a chance. I don't think that it will do as well in my storage as my buttercup and kabocha. And see, there are examples of good seasons with a failure every now and then - those 2 winter squash. One has been around for decades. I'd bet that I grew and had success with the other a half dozen years. One produces a couple and the other failed completely in 2019. A complete surprise -- I'd like to "deepen the bench!" (And, wouldn't you know? All of them did just super in 2020 :D .)

Yes, the seed catalogs ... New varieties show up every year and some are newly listed in the companies where I will buy a number of tried-and-trues. So, I should do as careful in research as I can be. There are likely some varieties that I'm overlooking. Darn shame, don't you think?

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I have ordered some seeds already and I am making lists from other companies. Some are still out of stock. I will ask my friends if they want to piggyback orders to save on the shipping costs.

I have grown sugar cane. It is essentially a giant grass. It was hard to dig out too. If you plant it, put out ant bait, they love it as well as lemon grass and citrus trees.

I gave up my community garden plot this year. I miss it and the people but I can't work that long in the garden anymore. I used to grow the chayote, squash, corn , citrus, and a bartlett pear (pet) there. It will be hard for me to grow a squash at my house since it takes up so much space. I can try to grow butternut squash. I have grown that at the herb garden before. The vines are long but not as heavy as Upo. I am having problems keeping the dragon fruit in check. I can grow corn in summer but it will take up all of the main garden space.

I haven't decided if I am going to soil test this year. I am doing more no till gardening and basically I am lasagna gardening adding new planting media on top of the old. It does keep the weeds down, but I have no idea what it does to the soil nutrition.

My garden does not get any time off so it is almost continually planted at least until July. Then it isn't worth planting again until September. At that time if I do anything it would be to solarize the soil.

These are the seeds on my long list. I am still looking for more seeds before I make the cuts for the short list. My main garden is small 8x16 ft oval. I plant most of the perennial and large crops in pots.

Soarer cucumber, borage, Hibiscus sabdariffa, yerbe matte, Santo or Leisure cilantro, Ajvarsk sweet pepper, lipstick pepper, Carolina Reaper, Jamaican scotch bonnet, Trinidad scorpion, Bhut Jolokia, shishito, yellow monster, Table King acorn squash (bush), Toy choi (Pak choy), Long green eggplant, heat tolerant lettuce varieties including buttercrunch, lollo rosso, oakleaf, grand rapids, and manoa. The peppers, eggplant, tomatoes, beans, bitter melon, snow peas, and citrus are gown in pots. Most of the peppers are in pots but some are in the ground (actually they went to ground all by themselves.)

I am still looking for seeds for pineapple sage. I haven't seen any plants at the nursery in months.

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TomatoNut95
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Next month I put up the greenhouse. I've already been asking family to save their plastic and foam egg cartons. I'm not quite sure exactly which varieties I want to plant just yet. I do want to plant my Hog brain and Holstein peas for the summer.

Oops, I forgot to plant radishes!!

As for tomatoes, I'll probably start off with Tiny Tim's and work my way up. Never got to plant my Mystery Tomato G2 seeds this year, so I gotta try and shoot for this year for sure. Want to get my hands on an orange tomato!!
As for peppers: perhaps 1 sweet banana and my usual bells and jalapenos.

I want to make an order from Bunny Hop and Baker Creek, but I just haven't done it yet. Been busy Christmas shopping, plus am waiting for those places to get everything restocked.

imafan26
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I saw a small greenhouse for sale at home depot. It made me laugh. They are very suitable for cold climates when you want to extend your season. Two things that are really unnecessary in a tropical climate. One is a glass house the other is a plastic covered greenhouse. Both of those things are designed to capture light and heat. A shade house makes more sense than those. It is still hot inside a shade or hoop house.

I make long lists and have to pare them every year. I have culled my old seeds so it takes up half the space now. I actually ran out of some seeds this year and could not find them. I am still not able to get some seeds since they are still out of stock at some of the companies. I try to add some new varieties, but when I find something that works well, I keep planting the same ones as long as I can find the seeds.

Although, I can grow year round, if there are no plant sales at the garden, I can only grow so much at my house, so every year, I have to decide which seeds I really want and need and which seeds I can wait on. Some seeds like the marigolds, I am saving, and some plants can be propagated. Some things like ginger and araimo seem to need more pots every year. I still end up getting more seeds than I can plant in a year. Especially, since unlike most of you, I am not starting with a blank slate. I always will have something growing in the garden or in pots, so space is limited.

Its is great that you are recycling egg cartons for seedlings. I don't use plug trays and plant in community pots and I have hundreds if not thousands of pots that I reuse. I actually have to cull more of them, because I will reuse them until they can't hold any soil anymore. I give the paper egg cartons to the worms.

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digitS'
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Tomatoes are sometimes difficult with my usual, up and down temperatures. Days to Maturity can't be trusted - at all.
  • Jaune Flamme is sometimes listed as an "early" and is a very nice small orange tomato. It wasn't anywhere near "early" and not real productive in my garden. I suppose that I stopped growing it more out of hurt feelings than anything else.
  • Earl of Edgecombe may have been the same experience. After a couple of years and getting like one ripe fruit off of each plant, harvesting the others green, it wasn't grown again. It was such a nice, meaty beefsteak :? .
  • Orange Minsk was probably in my garden longer than these others. I was fairly happy with it but, I guess, I stopped growing it because of cracking problems.
  • Azoychka did just fine for ripening but was a rambling, difficult to control vine that I decided not to grow it every year.
Of course, I grow the golden cherries and one yellow grape each year. I wouldn't really call those orange but there's no problem with them ripening. No. I don't have a good idea for my garden - I'd like a nice, orange plum :wink: .

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Vanisle_BC
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Two tomatoes we won't grow next year:
Purple Russian
Black Vernissage.
For us these were poor indoor keepers and ripeners; many rotted.

What tomatoes will we plant?
Latah - to enjoy early
Ailsa Craig
Camp Joy AKA Chadwick's Cherry
Sweetie
Sungold
Jaune Flamme (Flammée?)
Longkeeper - to enjoy late

Jaune Flamme may be 'iffy' - on our endangered list. This was a poor tomato year and we didn't get enough crop for a real evaluation. Sungold's an anomaly here; a non-'heritage' hybrid. But it performs so well and is incredibly sweet. Can't resist!

Vanisle_BC
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A few other things I won't try this year:
Celery - never had any luck with it
Scorzonera - ditto
Lemongrass (already mentioned elsewhere)
Oh, and carrots in tubes. They grew well but were impossible to extract.
And maybe broccoli Romanesco, which has made a huge, handsome, healthy plant but no head. ??

ETA: Things I may repeat include broadcast beds of lettuce & tomatoes.

In the non-veggie garden: wish I'd never planted St John's Wort!

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TomatoNut95
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I have tons of pots I reuse as well. But to start little seeds I use the egg cartons. Then transplant later into packs or the little black square thingys.

I know what I WONT be growing next year and that is that yucky white cherrry tomato. They look and tasted like yellow grapes. Too out of taste for tomatoes for me. Micro Tom was also nasty, that's another 'no way' on my list. Also no more San Marzanos either. Romas are better.

Something I do want to grow is the Marglobe and Pink Belgian tomato seeds my cousin sent me. I'd like to try oxheart again.

I'm growing Romanseco broccoli this winter, can't wait to see what it does. Probably get frostbit. 😆

Gotta get back to my broccoli and rice casserole. I experimented and put celery in it. If nobody likes it, that's tough!! 😂

Vanisle_BC
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Tomatonut, what's the Romanesco variety you're growing - when planted, and what stage is it at? Mine is 'Natalino' started early April in soil blocks; planted out early June.

imafan26
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Things I won't be planting:
Any tomato that is not resistant to TYLC virus. Or Sweet basil because it is not resistant to Downy mildew and the resistant cultivars don't taste the same.

I will plant Charger, sweet pea currant (actually it grows wild, I don't have to plant it).
I have not had luck with Camaro, but it is TYLCV and I still have seeds left so I will give it another try.
I will definitely grow more peppers. There are still a lot of varieties that I haven't tried yet.
Soarer, Summer Dance and Suyo cucmber grow the best for me. I like Diva too. I think I don't need to look for any others.
Pak choi, Shanghai baby bok, Komatsuna (my new favorite veg), perpetual spinach, chard, Lacinato kale, Curly Vates kale, Raggedy Jack kale, long green eggplant (stays softer on the bush longer than purple ones), Hon Tsai tai, Choi sum, Jicama,

Vanisle_BC
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@Tomatonut95 , I posted asking about your Romanesco broccoli. Maybe you didn't see that. I'm curious about when you planted, whether it makes a head, and how long it takes for that to happen.

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applestar
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Not TomatoNut, but I’ve been trying to grow Romanesco Types off and on. Sometimes they are described as cauliflower. They tend to take longer to mature — this is my problem because I don’t have nice lengthy cool period — our spring and fall are too short. I think last variety I tried was "Veronica" — a hybrid that I’m pretty sure I chose because it matures more reliably earlier. Even then, the listed DTM ranges from 78 days to 98 days (Fedco). I tried "Early Romanesco" prior to that and didn’t succeed.

Depending on how I grew them, I did find that some of them that didn’t form heads by the time it got hot managed to endure the summer season unlike some of the other brassicas, and headed up in the fall. Trick is protecting them from pests and animal marauders through the summer. (In my case, I failed to fertilize them sufficiently towards the end)

P.S. Westcoast Seeds lists "Matures in 90 days" for Natalino.

Vanisle_BC
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Thanks @applestar. My Natalino seed is from WCS (Westcoast Seeds). I tried it because of the unusual, pretty shape & color in the catalog photos. But if it's difficult to get it to that stage, l'lI likely grow something more reliable in its place next year. I"m quite negligent about feeding my plants; I use slow release mixes of organic meals like alfalfa, bone, kelp etc. Generally I want to avoid "chemical" fertilizers. How would you feed your broccoli and other groups?

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digitS'
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I tried something "really strange," in 2020: compost tea.

And, not just any compost. In fact, it was more of a long-aged tea since mint plants went into buckets of cold water fresh and stayed in there for, at least, a week.

Years ago, I'd tried tea from compost and it smelled horrible! Why would I want something like that on my vegetables? The idea was to repel pests and feed the plants. #3 was to have something that didn't smell horrible. Didn't quite succeed with #3 but it wasn't too awfully bad.

Anyway, 2020 must have been just about my best cabbage and broccoli year. More broccoli than I knew what to do with and nice, big heads of cabbage. Pests (aphids) were late and not troublesome on the cabbage and almost nonexistent on the broccoli. Not sure about the technique - only 1 year, but ...

Steve

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TomatoNut95
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Vanisle_BC wrote:
Fri Nov 27, 2020 11:55 am
Thanks @applestar. My Natalino seed is from WCS (Westcoast Seeds). I tried it because of the unusual, pretty shape & color in the catalog photos. But if it's difficult to get it to that stage, l'lI likely grow something more reliable in its place next year. I"m quite negligent about feeding my plants; I use slow release mixes of organic meals like alfalfa, bone, kelp etc. Generally I want to avoid "chemical" fertiliezers. How would you feed your broccoli and other groups?
Vanisle, I deeply apologize for not seeing your question!! So sorry! If it's not too late, here's what I know about Romanseco broccoli: nothing. This is the first time I'm growing it. I purchased seeds in Lowes. Ferry Morse Sow Easy seeds. Heads are supposed to be lime green colored and look pointy. I only have a few plants and they're not very big. It's rainy and yucky outside right now so my connection isn't strong enough to post pictures. I'll try to get some posted...

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TomatoNut95
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Vanisle, again I apologize for not seeing your post. Here's some pics if that helps. Had to crop them down so they'd upload better...
I planted the seed....back in October I think. In the picture is my biggest plant. According to packet, it says 75-100 days til harvest. But like I said, I've never grown it before, and if it gets frostbitten, I won't grow it again. 😆
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TomatoNut95
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My 2021 Baker Creek catalogue came today and my eyes bugged out at the sight of this okra!! Heavy Hitter! Look how loaded that plant is!! I placed an order immediately, hoping to get to stuff before everyone else grabs up everything.

This afternoon I wrote up my 2021 'To Plant' list. Came out rather long, and most of it was tomatoes... 😆 Mainly because I have stuff that I need to refreshen the seed stock and test out varieties I didn't have room for this year and probably won't have room for next year.
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imafan26
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I have ordered my seeds from Kitazawa, High Mowing, Baker Creek, Ferry Morse, and Tomato Growers Supply. I am looking at the Territorial catalog, but right now there isn't enough to make an order worthwhile. I am getting fewer seeds, and some packages, like the eggplant will have more seed than I need. I have culled my seeds at home, but I still have plenty left and less growing space now that I don't have the community garden plot and plant sales next year are iffy. I did propagate more mint, but I will actually discard them. I don't need that many and it costs me space, water and media, so I will just keep dividing the mother plant so it can stay in the same pot. I do have lemon grass that is in need of dividing. I might be able to find homes for a few divisions but I only need one plant. Lemon grass is really not hard to harvest. The main part used in the lower end of the stalk. Just peel it and smash or grind it in a mortar and pestle. I usually smash it. A whole stalk, including the green part of the leaf is placed inside the cavity of a roasting chicken to get rid of the poultry smell. The smashed stalk can be used in lemon chicken or lemon grass soup or tea.

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TomatoNut95
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I tried to make an order from Bunny Hop, but something is wrong with their mailing information, when I typed in my address and tried to check out it said cannot mail to default address. I contacted Ellie, she said her and her staff will look into the matter. Unfortunately, not all the stuff I want from her is in stock but I tried to get Sweet Splash Electra, Helsing Junction Blue and Applestar's Shimofuri.
When I ordered from Baker Creek, I completely forgot to get that Habanada heatless Habanaro I wanted. I got some Bells of Ireland, Saliva, a giant Hawaiian marigold, peppercress and Berkley Tie Dye Green tomato. Oh and some green beans. The Pinto Mix of coleus I wanted wasn't in yet I guess, said out of stock. Hope people don't grab up everything like last time. Also I saw a picture of some extremely odd Orange Accordion tomato in the catalog but wasn't listed for sale, and couldn't find it on their website either.

Today I counted 32 tomato varieties in my seed stock but I got rid of the San Marzano. Kept 2 seeds of it, but got rid of the rest.

imafan26
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Some things have not been restocked from the time they ran out in June. There have been a few crop failures as well. There were a few things I wanted that was still out. Burpee though did send me an email that the nemagone I wanted is back in stock. Some places allowed back ordering, but others only will send email notices when their stock comes in and you can't back order. It is why I am ordering my seeds earlier than usual.

I would like a few of the things they did not have, but I actually have ordered enough variety so that if I don't get it early in the year, I still have plenty to plant and I still will have left overs. I am also growing seeds saved from the peppers, basil, fennel, and green onions. I may get seed from culantro as well.

The fulva daylily will be grown from keiki on the stems and many of the herbs will grow from cuttings or divisions. The only things I must get seeds for are the hybrids.

Today, I made cuttings of one of my roses. It is a tea rose and I am not as successful with those, but I have plenty of cuttings to experiment with. The cuttings from Moorcap (red cascade) are taking, but those are easy. Red Simplicity cuttings are still alive. I have not successfully rooted those, maybe I will get lucky this time.

I have a bunch of Thai dragon peppers to pot up. Although peppers can cross, they rarely cross naturally for me despite being right next to each other. I do have pepper volunteers popping up all over the place. I won't know what they are until they start to fruit.

I could do more bay leaves, but I don't need any more now. It seems a waste to just trash the cuttings, but they get too tall otherwise.

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@TomatoNut95 Was this going to be your first season planting Habanada? If so, let me warn you - if what you are looking for is a habanero flavor, this won't have it. In fact, when I grew it several years ago, I was wondering if it really was a chinense pepper, since it had almost no habanero flavor. I will say, It did produce a large number of peppers.

My favorite habanero with almost no heat is the aji dulce. Looks like a regular habanero, that ripens red, and has a fantastic habanero flavor, fresh or dried, with only 500 or less heat units.

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Gary350
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I am thinking I will plant, 2 apple trees, 2 peach trees, 2 pecan trees, 2 blue berry bushes. Last time I planted grapes birds ate all the ripe grapes in 1 hour so I am not planting grapes. If we don't eat it or not eat much of it I'm not planting it. I am cutting back on trying new things and concentrate on food for the table, corn, tomatoes, beans, potatoes, peppers, garlic, onions, carrots.

No more melons, no squash, no herbs, no sweet potatoes, no okra.

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TomatoNut95
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@Pepperhead, yep, this would've been the first growing Habanada. But now after what you told me about the variety, perhaps I am glad I forgot to order it. I probably won't have room for it now anyway.
Ellie and I couldn't correct the problem I was having with ordering from her website, so embarrassingly I had to ask my Aunt to order what I wanted. Since my aunt uses her computer to order online stuff, she had no trouble at all.
With all the tomato varieties I plan to grow next year, I'm going to run out of room very quick. I want to grow more okra, but perhaps for the spring and not the fall. That way, the seed pods will have longer to dry. The three pods I did save molded. But it wasn't my fault I had to pick them still green. They took too long to dry before the first frost hit.

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Gary350
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TomatoNut95 wrote:
Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:25 pm
@Pepperhead, yep, this would've been the first growing Habanada. But now after what you told me about the variety, perhaps I am glad I forgot to order it. I probably won't have room for it now anyway.
Ellie and I couldn't correct the problem I was having with ordering from her website, so embarrassingly I had to ask my Aunt to order what I wanted. Since my aunt uses her computer to order online stuff, she had no trouble at all.
With all the tomato varieties I plan to grow next year, I'm going to run out of room very quick. I want to grow more okra, but perhaps for the spring and not the fall. That way, the seed pods will have longer to dry. The three pods I did save molded. But it wasn't my fault I had to pick them still green. They took too long to dry before the first frost hit.
TomatoNut95, I finally decided to grow Habanero peppers only because they are beautiful plants with multi color peppers. It is almost like planting 6 ft tall flowers in the garden. I refused to eat a Habanero all summer then I tried a tiny piece of a pepper in food so food could hide the heat. Habanero does have flavor, very different flavor than I ever tasted in other peppers & I worried it would burn my mouth off but the tiny piece was not bad. I also planted Tabasco peppers these have a very good flavor and fairly spicy hot, yellow & green color. I have Jalapeno peppers too low spicy hot good flavor red & green color. I planted a 4th hot small 1½" long pepper that makes beautiful multi colors too, green, yellow, orange, red, these turned out to be fairly hot also. I need to read my posts for June to find out the name of this 4th pepper. Not knowing what to do with these peppers I decided not to let them go to waste and did several experiments. I sliced & diced the peppers into 4 separate piles then mixed them together in different amounts in 1 pint mason jars then filled all the jars with vinegar. It turned out my best flavor is about 40% Tabasco, about 20% habanero, about 20% Jalapeno, and 20% of the 4th pepper. I used multi colors peppers in the hot pepper relish because each color has a slightly different flavor. After setting in vinegar about 50% of the flavor went into the vinegar. The mixed hot pepper relish is very good on & in many foods it adds an amazing good flavor that is not very spicy hot. It does not take much hot pepper relish to taste the good flavor & the vinegar is good on food also.

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TomatoNut95
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The only reason I grew a Habanero this year was to use the peppers to make spray with. I can't tolerate peppers that are too hot. Whoever invented Carolina Reaper, or Trinidad Scorpion peppers were loco in their cabasa. 😆

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It is hard for me to fathom anyone really liking the taste of habanero. My pepper head friend said they tasted like gasoline. They were too hot for me to discern any taste at all.

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Akhnaten
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Really glad to know this forum is still active. Habañero is great and has an amazing flavour if you can take it and know where to use it, like in mafé (Senegalese peanut) sauce.

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digitS'
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Moving a considerable distance from "dynamic" super hot peppers - I've been making sauerkraut.

For years, I've grown Late Flat Dutch cabbage along with 1 or 2 early varieties of cabbage. Is there a better choice than that one for sauerkraut?

Here's the problem. This is "freezer sauerkraut." The recipe is from a book called "The Joy of Pickling." The thing is that the cabbage doesn't have the benefit of fermenting in a crock. To have the texture anywhere close to what most of us think of as sauerkraut, I have to pare away lots of the coarse parts of the cabbage leaves.

A late variety that is more tender would probably be better, all around. I'd hate to give up Late Flat Dutch storage quantities but several of those can be grown in a future cabbage patch. If DW and I have really acquired a taste for this recipe (now that we are on the 3rd batch), an additional, new-to-us cabbage for 2021 may be well worth a try.

Steve

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Gary350
Super Green Thumb
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Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:59 pm
Location: TN. 50 years of gardening experience.

digitS' wrote:
Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:03 pm
Moving a considerable distance from "dynamic" super hot peppers - I've been making sauerkraut.

For years, I've grown Late Flat Dutch cabbage along with 1 or 2 early varieties of cabbage. Is there a better choice than that one for sauerkraut?

Here's the problem. This is "freezer sauerkraut." The recipe is from a book called "The Joy of Pickling." The thing is that the cabbage doesn't have the benefit of fermenting in a crock. To have the texture anywhere close to what most of us think of as sauerkraut, I have to pare away lots of the coarse parts of the cabbage leaves.

A late variety that is more tender would probably be better, all around. I'd hate to give up Late Flat Dutch storage quantities but several of those can be grown in a future cabbage patch. If DW and I have really acquired a taste for this recipe (now that we are on the 3rd batch), an additional, new-to-us cabbage for 2021 may be well worth a try.

Steve
I like traditionally sauerkraut sometimes maybe 2 or 3 times per year the flavor is a bit too strong for me. I found this recipe for a mild no ferment sauerkraut that is good. It is very easy to make a batch in 30 minute then water bath boil to can in 1 pint mason jars 15 minutes or quarts 20 min. I sometimes open a jar & eat it right out of the jar. Watch this YouTube video for the recipe. This recipe is so easy you can make 1 jar 1 time just to see if you like it. First time I made this I almost threw it in the garbage but then I realized this is actually good. If you want perfect sliced sauerkraut buy a $49 electric meat slicer from Harbor Freight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpRmoit5vNw
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