Which (tasty!) tomatoes yield most?

[Vanisle_BC]

I habitually grow too many tomato varieties; usually about 20 plants total, of 12 or more types. This year I want to reduce the no of plants, growing more high-yielders and fewer of the others. Not looking to get huge fruits but good weight of flavourful produce. My records are very incomplete but to date my highest yields seem to have come from:

Ailsa Craig
Camp Joy
Longkeeper

What other very productive candidates might I consider?

[applestar]

I probably can’t help with answers because I only grow heirlooms and stabilized OP varieties and many of them are not great producers to downright stingy. And the ones that seem more and most productive within the category probably still can’t compete with hybrid varieties that were developed for production.

But I will help with your question — aside from simply numbers, tomato productivity can be described in several other ways such as size and total fruit weight per plant as well as harvest all at once like determinate varieties vs. total harvest over the course of a season (this would also involve disease and heat resistance).

Once those details are cleared up, it would help to indicate what you use the tomatoes for — eating fresh? Salad? Sandwich? Salsa?, cooked into sauce? Pizza topping? ...etc.

[jal_ut]

Sweet Baby Girl
Early Girl
Celebrity
Better Boy

https://www.andersonseedandgarden.com/c ... omato+seed

[Gary350]

My best flavor and best producer is Big Beef. Summer 2017 I grew about 550 lbs of potatoes from 18 plants. I never heard of the 3 tomatoes you listed, you might be in the same boat as me and can only buy what the stores in your area sells unless you start plants from seeds. Big Beef is an excellent slicing tomato for sandwiches, salads, salsa and great flavor for cooking, stew, soup, sauce, pizza. Tomatoes are about the size of tennis balls. 65 days after planting we start harvesting tomatoes and usually have 60 pints and 10 quarts in mason jars in 2 weeks. 100 degree weather kills plants last of July if they don't die they suffer until late Sept then make more tomatoes. Cool Canada weather is an advantage for you I bet you get tomatoes all summer. Big Beef is not low acid or high acid its more in the medium acid range with a very good flavor. German Johnson and Brandywine are hydrids with about same flavor at Big Beef & produce about 75% less tomatoes than Big Beef.

I always grow a few other varieties of tomatoes too, no matter what the crazy weather does some do better than others and some may die. We like to have 2 tomatoes to eat on the kitchen table all summer until Christmas day.

My trick to good tomatoes, dig a 10" flower pot size holes 18" apart, throw in about 1/4 cup of 15/15/15 fertilizer, 1/4 cup pellet lime, 1/3 cup of wood ash or potassium, fill hole with water, wait until water soaks in, put 2" soil in bottom of hole, plant the tomato plant deep. Stake plants they will be 6 ft tall by July 15.

[PaulF]

I also only plant heirlooms and OP tomatoes. So far I have grown just above 500 different varieties and 75% have yielded superb tasting fruits. 50% have been good yielders, maybe 10% gave excellent production. Just to check, over the years I have tried or grown for others hybrids just to stay in the loop (I am actually a tomato snob) and none have ever been both tasty and productive. It seems to me ...and this is only my opinion and very subjective...production and flavor are not related so far as hybrids are concerned.

I have heard some say there are efforts to create hybrids that actually taste good so I will continue to keep an open mind...sort of. Good luck with your search.

[Vanisle_BC]

Now I see I should have been more specific (as the man was told, when he said he'd always wanted to be somebody.) Meantime thanks for all your suggestions & comments.

By yield I mean harvested weight over the full season, not the size or number of tomatoes.

Each year I grow - from seed, in raised beds - only 2-3 plants of each variety. Most are indeterminate vining types. I save seed, so with one exception they are open pollinated. The hybrid exception is sungold, for its incredible sweetness. If I need to buy seed I can get most varieties locally; otherwise mail-order.

We have a garden not a farm, and don't grow much more than enough for our 2 selves plus some for family & neighbours. We use tomatoes for fresh eating, cooking, sun-drying (in the sun ) and canning; just about everything you can do with them I guess. Really big ones hold no special attraction. I may even be prejudiced against them; suspect they'll trade size for flavour.

We get temps high 90s to 100F. Plants don't die in it although we almost do. I've not been observant enough to say whether it slows them down but we can harvest right into October.

I grew Brandywine once because of its reputation and was really disappointed; got very big pink fruits that were quite tasteless. I don't know whether the seed was mislabelled or local growing conditions didn't suit the variety, or what. Never tried them again. As I say huge tomatoes hold no particular appeal.

I'll keep growing a few that are less-productive but otherwise special - like Latah, which fruits early but is determinate; or sweetie because it's the first sweet cherry we grew and has sentimental(!) associations. (I feel disloyal planting sungold.)

Gary, interesting that you grow on 18" centres. Mine are 2 ft apart and I've been told that's not enough. YMMV.

[lakngulf]

I have narrowed my tomato plants down to Cherokee Purple and Gary O'Sena ( which is a purple variety). I grow them here at Lake Martin (down by the water) and at the farm where I grew up. I am able to get good compost soil from the barns as a cattle farmer still runs a herd on the farm. I call my tomatoes "Barnyard Heirlooms"
These tomatoes taste great but it may be the rich soil they are grown in. When my Mom was still alive she always wanted some Better Boy as well. They produced well and were tasty.

[digitS']

I don't weigh the tomatoes that are carried from the gardens so my ideas are not based on any empirical evidence, VanIsle.

Having ripe tomatoes off the vines is important to me but they are sometimes very limited because of a not very tomato-friendly gardening environment. Some plants have provided only a single ripe tomato and others on the vine, and there may be few, had to be harvested green. I don't like making decisions from a single season's experience but those varieties just failed too completely.

Taste is subjective but, like Gary, I have been happy with Big Beef's flavor. Certainly it's production has put it right at the top of the list for me since the 1990's.

If size isn't important, Bloody Butcher is a dandy small-size tomato in my garden. By comparison to many other small-size varieties, it really stands out. Healthy plants and good production, I don't really care that Bloody Butcher is only a couple of ounces larger than a cherry. I like diced tomatoes in sandwiches and salads. After growing it for nearly 10 years, I'm learning to live with the name ...


VanIsle, it's interesting that you grow Latah. I lived for several years in Latah County and grew some of the University of Idaho releases way back when they were first available. I'm not very much of a fan of determinants, probably mostly because I don't grow paste tomatoes and don't do any canning. Kootenai was another of those smaller tomatoes and both Latah and Kootenai are better choices for fresh salads than processing. They are probably good choices for open-pollinated varieties that produce well by the square foot but I don't know for sure.

Steve

[Taiji]

Last year for the first time I grew Abraham Lincoln because I asked a greenhouse guy in the U.P. what would be a prolific variety. I thought it was very productive and seemed to be disease resistant.

My last post in my thread "Gardening in the Upper Peninsula 2018" talks about this and I have a photo of the plant. I will try these again (I saved seeds), but it sounds like Big Beef might be a good thing for me to try too!

[pepperhead212]

Another thumbs up here for Big Beef! And several times, it has rated tops in the yearly side by side taste test I have, beating out many heirlooms. I always have new ones, but always have this and some cherries to fall back on.

Last year I had a new one, which I am planting more of this season - Burracker's Favorite. A red OP variety, with large fruits - many over 16 oz. Fairly productive, and split resistant in that super wet summer - only that circular top splitting, that healed quickly. And, surprisingly, it was one of the last ones to come down with any disease - some I pulled out before they even produced a dozen fruits.

[Gary350]

These 1" cherry tomatoes taste like Big Beef. They grow very well in our hot 100 degrees summer weather. I have been saving seeds and replanting them every year for 3 years. I don't remember the name of these tomatoes. No one around here sold 1" cherry tomatoes this summer I was looking just to see if I could find more 1" of the same to plant then I would know the name if they taste the same. These plants are very big produces about 30 tomatoes every day.

[Vanisle_BC]

These plants are very big produces about 30 tomatoes every day.

Wow, from how many plants, Gary?

[Gary350]

These plants are very big produces about 30 tomatoes every day.

Wow, from how many plants, Gary?

This summer I had 4 of the 1" cherry tomato plants. When plants first start producing its about 10 per day for all 4 plants then 20, 30, 40, 45, per day for about 2 weeks then they slow down, average about 30 per day for 4 plants, then August no rain very hot they slow down more. When cool weather comes late Sept plants do better again. August hot weather usually kills several of the other 18 tomatoes plants. Best and biggest harvest here is July for all 18 tomato plants. Plants that live through August make good tomatoes again Oct. You probably won't have the hot weather problem in Canada you won't need 18 plants like I do.

[Vanisle_BC]

In tomato ads & tastings, what do you believe is meant by 'real old-fashioned' or 'hierloom' or 'old time tomato' taste? Flavourful, obviously - but what kind of flavour - are these generally tangy/sharp, acid types?

[digitS']

That's a difficult question, VanIsle.

It would depend on the tastes of the reviewer, his or her experience, and choice of words. I certainly don't think an acidic grade makes it an old-fashion taste.

Just to take that second factor, experience, into consideration: Sunset magazine once told us that Early Girl is the most popular tomato variety in the US. I was a little surprised at the time but now realize that northern gardeners may have short frost-free growing seasons but southern gardeners may need short-season varieties because tomatoes burn up in mid-summer heat!

Anyway, I think many people grew up with Early Girls in their backyards and associate its flavor with garden freshness. Nothing wrong with that, in my opinion. Early Girl is okay flavorwise. Now if you want more flavor -- or you want to put a U in flavour, since you are in Canada -- (put me in there, too!) You may want something else.

It's not very common to have quick-maturity and much flavor to come in the same package. I'm not much for tartness so I'll be looking for sweetness but that's me. I have refused to grow healthy, productive varieties that have neither sweetness nor much flavor. And yet .... "mild" isn't bad. Let's call it a variety with "subtle" flavor. Many of the yellows and pinks that I enjoy would be reviewed that way, I suppose.

Steve

[jal_ut]

Yer makin my mouth water with pics of those nice tomatoes. Here today 20 degrees, sunny with six inches of snow on the lot. The only thing growing is ice. Have fun!

[imafan26]

I also like big beef. It has been productive and had good fruit quality. I had very good brandywine, but there are all kinds of tomatoes labeled "brandywine" The Sudduth and Landis strains were very good, but brandywine is a fussy plant very big but big fruits = fewer total fruit and the plants required regular fungal sprays, it does not have good disease resistance.

For production, adaptability and flavor it is much easier to grow cherry varieties. Sungold has excellent sweet flavor but cracks when it is ripe and it is not sweet unless it is ripe. Sunsugar, suncherry, and sweetie were also good. Sweet millions and sweet 100 were not the sweetest cherries but made up for it in production and disease resistance. The sweetest tomatoes are the currents.

I have yet to find the perfect tomato that has high yield, disease resistance and a flavor profile that I like. I only can grow three tomatoes at a time, unless the birds drop more cherries in the yard. I have the additional problem of tomato yellow leaf curl virus which now limits what I can grow. I found that the bird's choices are usually the best. Birds will only go after the best fruit.

[applestar]

Hmmm I was starting to be persuaded to try Big Beef but I can’t get over my resistance to growing hybrids.

I might try this —
Big Beef Tomato Seeds-TomatoFest Organic
https://www.tomatofest.com/Big_Beef_Tom ... f-0053.htm
This is a de-hybridized version of an American favorite.

[digitS']

AppleStar! You hybridize tomatoes.

... I found that the bird's choices are usually the best. Birds will only go after the best fruit.

Funny. You have a crew working in the neighborhood!

Steve

[Vanisle_BC]

..... but I can’t get over my resistance to growing hybrids.

AppleStar! You hybridize tomatoes.

Yes that's kind of funny. Funnier still was my one & only attempt to do that myself; I believe following apllestar's posted details. I don't know how it could be accomplished without a microscope and a very fine watchmaker's toolkit. Not for my aged eyesight & so-called dexterity!!

[digitS']

I'll add one more impediment: having fresh blooms at the same time but ...

You have explained my experience well, VanIsle!

clumsy digitS'

[applestar]

It does take a bit of practice. What worked for me was practicing on my “Winter Indoor Tomatoes” — I could position the plants so the blossom I was “operating on” was EXACTLY where I needed it, while SITTING DOWN at the table under bright lights. No wayward breezes or bugs to get in the way. And I did ruin a lot of blossoms and tried different tools before discovering what to hold and how.

In the summer garden, I have to practice on bigger flowered varieties before I can try smaller more delicate ones — mega blooms are easier, for example.

...I’m still not good enough to work on micro dwarf varieties or peppers.


::: intentionally crossing them is only the first step — then you have to keep saving seeds from each next generation until the characteristics you want to keep have stabilized.... THEN, THEY ARE NOT HYBRIDS ANYMORE, ...still working at this. It’s fun though

[digitS']

Several Years Ago: What I had hoped to gain was some hybrid vigor over self-pollinated inbred varieties.

So ... I imagined that I could cross two similar varieties, both with characteristics that I appreciated, at least well enough that if they showed up in the offspring, I wouldn't be disappointed.

Example: Variety A and Variety B have good cool temperature performance to grow well during our weeks of cloudy, cool spring weather. They both ripen fruit early. Fruit from both is flavorful.

Offspring AB: Characteristics could be from either parent and be satisfactory. Outcrossing would result in that "hybrid vigor" we learned about as kids in biology class. The seed from the parent can be collected and stored easily. BINGO, vigorous, healthy, productive hybrid plants

digitS'

[Taiji]

Hmmm I was starting to be persuaded to try Big Beef but I can’t get over my resistance to growing hybrids.

I might try this —
Big Beef Tomato Seeds-TomatoFest Organic
https://www.tomatofest.com/Big_Beef_Tom ... f-0053.htm
This is a de-hybridized version of an American favorite.

Hah! Funny you should post this site. I did a little online research myself and was just going to post the link to this company. I thought I might try one of the packets of seeds. They're kind of pricey, but if they really are open pollinated you'd have seeds for life!

I suppose I should try some hybrid Big Beef too, for comparison since I've never grown them.

[PaulF]

OK,OK,OK I just couldn't stay away from this thread. Some may know how anal I am about growing tomatoes; if not, know that every tomato from my garden gets counted and weighed and this strange habit has been going on for more than twenty years. I only plant 32 tomato plants yearly and all but one or two each year are heirloom/OPs. I grow tomatoes primarily for taste and that is a whole 'nuther story from production, but let it be known that no hybrid has ever won the flavor contest (my wife and I are the sole judges so the contest is very objective...)

Going through records beginning with1996...no records kept before that so that is the date I went loopy, I guess...these are the top three producers of good tasting tomatoes not including cherries or salad sizes (I'm not that crazy).

By total weight in ounces from a single plant: Mexican Rose-827oz., Marianna's Peace-818 oz., Neve's Azorean Red-800 oz

By total number of tomatoes from a single plant: Black Brandywine-138, Big Cheef-133, India-127.

At freeze there may have been greenies left on plants but those get tossed and not counted.

So there!

[pepperhead212]

Awwww, and I was looking forward to the numbers on cherries, paulf!

[digitS']

DW liked Neves Azorean real well but it took the entire season in two different years to have one vine-ripen. Marianna's Peace was a very nice tomato, tasty and wasn't too late! I only grew that in a recent year before downsizing the tomato patch. It ( we ) really deserve more than a single year. It wasn't thought of as much of a sure-fire thing like some others.

DW and I have somewhat different tastes -- I may not be as discriminating as she (but she thought all tomatoes should be cherries before I came along and has "matured" from the experience ) Still, I have to limit varieties to less-than 80 day ratings.

VanIsle is likely to have some of the same problems with seeing production through to vine-ripening.

Steve

[Vanisle_BC]

.... I have to limit varieties to less-than 80 day ratings ....VanIsle is likely to have some of the same problems with seeing production through to vine-ripening.
Steve

Steve, I'm surprised at your comments there. I don't think I've ever had a (healthy) tomato plant that failed to ripen fruit before August. Even Longkeeper, generally listed as 80-90 days to maturity does OK here. I transplant ~ May holiday weekend and am usually harvesting the first fruits about 2 months later. I don't know how 'maturity' is defined - probably not by first ripe fruit. Apart from Longkeeper my varieties - T/P to maturity - are listed between about 55 days (Latah) and 70-80 for most others. I pull the plants at the end of October. I tried Indigo Rose one year and never again because it was very slow to ripen; which is odd because I now see it listed as a 75 day tomato.

I realize that days to maturity listings are just guides but they are useful in comparing varieties - which are early, mid season, late.

We have relatively cool wet springs, but summers that can be hot, often in July and nearly always high 90s in August. Even into Oct can be quite warm & sunny. How different are your conditions?

For flavour/yield balance and especially flavour my favourite is now Ailsa Craig** Followed closely by Camp Joy - AKA Chadwick's Cherry. I guess those would be described as having balanced flavour and that seems to be what we like although my wife likes some more sharp or acid than I do. But mustn't forget to mention my first O/P love, Sweetie, and my concession to the hybrids - Sungold. I do like sweet tomatoes. I don't grow any beefsteak types.

**By the way Ailsa Craig is a Scottish tomato (and place name) and is therefor NOT English, whatever your seed catalogue may say. .

[digitS']

That good news makes me glad that I didn't ramble on too much about summer warmth, VanIsle.

We will leave Ailse Craig right where it belongs and I won't be trying to drag your location into the US. My guess is that you have some sheltering from the Pacific, what some call a "rain shadow" where clouds are broken up by higher elevations.

As you can see by my location listed, my gardening is on a border. Close to but not the Canadian/US border, the Idaho/Washington one. The nearest Idaho town is about 100 miles away on this Weather Service list: Accumulated Growing Degree Days. Spokane Washington is close to my big veggie garden and about the same elevation.

Not as close to your location but in that general direction is Bellingham Washington. Both weather stations are down there in the WA's but this gives us something of an understanding of growing season warmth around the US. The idea is that the calculations are based on the warmth required by corn plants but, although the entire thing amounts to a generalization, this could be applied to other warm-season plants.

If I was to compare my own location to somewhere with a more tomato-friendly environment, I might choose Walla Walla. Quite a difference in growing season warmth between there and Spokane. If I wanted to feel a little better about my "tomato chances," I could look up the list to the CA's and the city of Eureka. That California coastal city is near where I gardened 50 years ago.

All gardening is local. I'm sure that there were some gardens near Eureka where the gardener might exclaim, "Eureka! I have found it." A comfortable growing environment exists for warm-season plants. I was where the waters of the Pacific could be seen from my front yard and had something of a tough time of it. Still do! But, varieties differ and if I was still on that northern Cal coast I trust that I would be okay with seeing, at least, some ripe fruits each year.

The Weather Service list just allows some comparison and the Growing Degree Days (GDD) are used by some seed companies for descriptions of their farm seed. Generalizations.

Steve

[jal_ut]

Too early to plant tomatoes here. It is 32 degrees and snowing.

[Vanisle_BC]

Steve: Thanks for the link to US GDD (growing degree-day) tables. GDD is a subject I've ignored so far. I'm finding it a bit of a chore trying to compare US vs Canadian locations & numbers - ie compare yours with mine (with particular respect to tomatoes.) Think I'll go right back to ignoring GDD.

Apart from the 9/5 diff in 'size' of degrees - F vs C., each table and each crop requires assumptions about the low & high cutoff temperatures; ie degree days to be excluded because the crop does not grow at those temps; all of which has made me give up on trying to compare/convert tables from different websites.

What I'm left with is that some of the details of every gardener’s experience will always be unique to his/her circumstances & methods.

I hope you have - we all have - a good year in the garden (cheer up it's getting warmer.)

[jal_ut]

"What I'm left with is that some of the details of every gardener’s experience will always be unique to his/her circumstances & methods."

Yes, always keep a notebook and write down planting dates, weather patterns, varieties and results. The ol memory banks are good but tend to forget things..... Write it down! Please do plant and enjoy!