JohnnyB60
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:59 pm
Location: Southern CA High Desert

Desert sun is killing my squash and zucchini

It has been really hot here lately usually around 110 deg F and it's solid sun all day long. I haven't been able to grow much of anything so I narrowed it it down to 3 squash plants only. No tomatoes, peppers or anything else and I can't even get this small garden to grow.

I have a large Patio Umbrella shading it right now, but I can’t move it throughout the day and it only takes a ½ hour of full sun to welt it up. I have been able to get it back up with water and shade, but I believe the cycle is stunting the growth and I don’t think it will ever produce anything at this pace.

Anyway I bought two 4x8 wood lattice panels to cover more area and I was just wondering if it will work because the sun still goes through the holes in the lattice. My question is will lattice be enough or should I had some shade fabric?

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Gary350
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Location: TN. 50 years of gardening experience.

When I lived in Phoenix I was very surprised to learn my zucchini and yellow squash both did much better when it got very hot 115 degrees. AZ soil and water are both 8 ph but squash does good anyway. 15 hours of AZ sun is not the same as 15 hours of TN sun, TN has clouds so 15 hours of TN sun might really be 5 hours of full blistering hot sun after lunch. I have been growing a garden for 50 years my first year in AZ was a learning experience, I learned squash does better in AZ than TN. Food value of AZ soil is just about ZERO but squash does not care it grows good anyway. Only problem I had was BER on, melons, squash, tomatoes, peppers, with a soil of 8 ph I would never guess soil needs lime. Garden supplies are hard to find best thing that worked in place of lime was, wood ash or cement $2 per bag at Lowes. When it gets hot in TN squash does better until it rains too much then they get root rot and leaf mildew rot and die in the heat. I am guessing 110 degrees in not your problem, 15 hours of blistering SUN in big sky country is the problem. I bought a 10'x15' black sun shade at Lowes to shade my garden and everything in my garden did much better in July to Sept. Black sun shade tarps looks like a black tarp with tiny screen wire holes it blocks about 80% of the sun. Since I was in big sky country I had full sun from 5:30 am to 8:30 pm so I pulled the tarp over the garden in a way to allow the garden to get morning sun until 11 am then shade until dark. I had the tarp set up with tent poles and ropes 6 feet high so I could walk under it. My garden did much better. My 3rd year in AZ I learned to plant the first garden Nov 1 and plants the second garden March 1. My AZ garden required an irrigation system to keep the soil wet it came on automatic at 9 pm every night for 30 minutes.

People in AZ believe the only time you can water plants is early morning. Mother nature waters in the evening and after dark. If it rains in the middle of the day it gets cloudy. I learned in college never water in the hot sun, plants do all their growing after dark. I had several neighbors their yard was brown and crisp the more they watered every morning the worse it got it was 95 degrees and hot at 8 am. LOL.

How does CA growing conditions compare to AZ?

JohnnyB60
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:59 pm
Location: Southern CA High Desert

Thanks Gary, it sounds like AZ is the same as here, but I think AZ may get a little more ran than here because we see a lot of storm clouds pass right by us along the mountains and them we hear about flooding in AZ. I have never been in AZ when it rained so I can't really comment on rain comparison.

I don't know what my pH is although it may have changed from my watering. I have been watering from barrels or rain water that I've collected from previous rains during the winter months. I water 1gal twice a day per plant, now it seems that they may need more water that they've grown some and the its a lot hotter here since I first planted them.

Years ago before we went into mandatory water rationing due to the drought, my squash and zucchini would grow out of control chocking out most of my other plants and I think I was watering about the same if I remember correctly.

Anyway I have some other plants as ground cover over my desert tortoises burrow that is supposed to have full sun and it is also dying from the sun. Right now everything is covered from ash form a very large wildfire that is still burning and I don't know if that ash will help the pH or not.

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rainbowgardener
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If you look it up, sites will tell you optimum pH for squashes is 5.5 - 6.8, I.e. slightly acid to neutral, although they will tolerate slightly basic.

I am having somewhat similar issues as you, though with a bit less heat and more humidity. Still we had almost two months with no daily high temperature below 90 and some days in the high 90's and very little rain (yesterday and today are below 90!). My squashes have been baking out there and wilt severely every afternoon. I am putting an amazing amount of water on them. But sometimes they perk up in the evening when the shade comes back on them, even without water.

I have been watering in the afternoon, since it seems like that's when they need it most. And I have been watering the leaves, which is ordinarily a no-no. But baking in the sun like that they don't get fungus and I feel like (without really knowing) it gives the leaves some evaporative cooling. Also it waters the leaf nodes where it can root into the soil, so hopefully helps it root, which would help it get more moisture.

With lots of water, they keep hanging in there, despite daily wilting. And they are still growing squashes (winter squash).

Yes if you are putting up lattice I would throw some shade cloth over it.

JohnnyB60
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Posts: 125
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:59 pm
Location: Southern CA High Desert

Thanks rainbowgardener, I guess I should look into checking the pH. Honestly I don’t even now what a pH checker for soil looks like so I’ll have to google that.

Now that pH has been brought up I think I may have done some damage a few days ago. I utilized water from my small fish pond while cleaning the filters to water the plants and save water. The water from the filters was black and I did not check it beforehand.

I have a fabric shade cover over my fish pond that works pretty well, but the sun here is very damaging not to mention the winds. We get up to 40mph winds at times and I’ve had to retrieve the shade a few different times from the neighbor’s yard. I originally put up the fabric shade to keep the neighbors pine needles and cones out of the pond.

Anyway I already bought the lattice panels so I’m going to temporally install them by tying them down with rope just to see they help at all before buying the shade cloth.

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Gary350
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Location: TN. 50 years of gardening experience.

I bought a pack of PH paper on ebay for 99 cents with free postage. Use distilled water to check your soil with the ph paper.

It only rains a few times per year in AZ. July is the big rain month, when it rains it is a big one. East valley, Mesa, Queen Creek and Apache Junction are all low elevation no matter how small the rain is in other places it runs down hill and sooner or later it travels through Mesa, Queen Creek and Apache Junction. There are several big mountains in the valley and the valley is in the center of a donut shape of mountains rock is like the roof of a house it soaks up no water all that water comes down the mountain 5 miles later at the bottom it is 20 feet deep. Summer rain is usually a 15 minute flash flood type rain water at the bottom of the mountain runs off into the wash, wash is a dry river. Lots of roads are built through the wash and some places they have bridges. When it rains, then roads flood for about 1 hour, water is gone a few hours after the rain stops. TV News always makes out like it is a big deal but we see it every year at the same time it is not as amazing as the claim. The towns feel like it is a waste of money to build a bridge that will only get used for 6 hours 1 time a year.

The biggest screw up is I-40 through down town Phoenix going west towards Avondale for 20 miles. They bull dozed the desert dirt up on all side so the interstate is flat and level but lower than the land so all the highway traffic noise is reflected up out of the funnel shape land into the sky but all the funnel shape land acts like the roof of a house when it rains all the water goes onto the interstate and I-40 is flooded with 6 feet of water for 20 miles. There is a drainage system for I-40 but it can not deal with all that sudden rain it talks about 12 hours for the 6 feet of water to drain off into all the irrigation ditches.

AZ soil is strange it looks like sand on the surface but below the course sand is an extremely fine soil about like kitchen flour. When that extremely fine soil gets wet it seals shut then it acts like a sheet of plastic water runs off and very little soaks in.

I lived at 12345 W Sheridan St Avondale AZ for 3 years look at it on Google Map. There is a wash about 2 blocks east of the house. The wash is 1 mile wide, 30 feet deep. Use google map to follow the wash up in the mountains it ends at a lake. When it rains 100 miles to the north water comes down those rock mountains funnels into the lake and the lake over flows then flows south. If it rains anywhere along that wash it all flows into the wash too. Several times in July the wash 2 blocks from the house had 25 feet of water 1 mile wide flowing south at about 40 to 45 mph. Wow it was scary being only 2 blocks from that if the levee would break it would wash the houses away for 30 miles.

When a person thinks of the desert being sand they think it is like beach sand in Florida or a Childs sand box water should soak up fast but it does not.

The only other time it rains in AZ is winter and you very seldom see it or know it rained. It will sprinkle a little after dark and be dried up with no trace of water by the time the sun comes up.

I had to keep levees around all my garden rows so when the irrigation system came on it would hold the water like a pond then it had no choice but to soak in. AZ gardening was a challenge until I learned about the soil and weather conditions. It is no wander most people in AZ will tell you, you can not have a garden here. Well, you can, you just have to learn how.

Check out the flash flood videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDtBby7lJX0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhGgnr44SVI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPxdAzp6eJ0

JohnnyB60
Senior Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:59 pm
Location: Southern CA High Desert

Wow Gary that’s great info because I was planning on retiring in AZ. I’m now thinking about NV because of the no income tax, but my wife doesn’t want to move there. My family wants me to move to PA where they all have fantastic gardens only I don’t think I can handle the cold winters and humidity.

Your house in AZ is almost exactly like mine in Southern CA except I have a 2-story. My neighbor across the street has a great garden with a surrounding block wall protecting it. She is not conserving water at all and jokes that she maybe hauled off to jail at any time.

I on the other hand am taking huge steps to conserve water. I fill 5gal buckets of cold water from the sink and shower until the water is hot instead of wasting it down the drain. I then use that to water my plants.

Thanks for the video links, they are incredible and really is a wake up call for looking for property.

JohnnyB60
Senior Member
Posts: 125
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:59 pm
Location: Southern CA High Desert

Well the lattice did not shade as much as I thought so I guess I need to order the fabric and take back the lattice panels. :(

It was 110 deg F here today with a very low humidity. Half of the plant which was shaded by the umbrella did OK, but not that shaded by the lattice.

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