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jal_ut
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Squash? Revisited......

"The sad fact of the matter is: Those "Organic" plants are no better in any way than any others.

(Now watch me get beat up for saying it.) :)"

Above a quote from the topic "Squash?"

What did I say? It was a good topic too, got a lot of comments, ......... oh well........ Now its locked. Funny it was not deleted?
Don't mess with those "Organic" people. Its a religion. You can't say squat about a person's religion. O:)

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applestar
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Oops. That wasn't the intention. That was such a great discussion with lots of relevant information that it was made into a sticky for easy reference. The topic was locked to prevent comments from being added that would muddy the usefulness of the thread as a reference. :D

A discussion about whether organic squash or plants are better or not would be off topic too, right? :wink:

I do agree that some people are very adamant about organic vs. not, and an ensuing discussion, if it becomes unfriendly, may need to be moderated to conform to the posting guidelines.

gumbo2176
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Applestar, you and I seem to be kindred spirits in a way. I see you post all hours of the day-------and night so is it safe to assume you also suffer from a form of insomnia? I usually get by on about 4 to 5 hours of sleep a day, and broken sleep at that. If so, fun isn't it?

imafan26
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Actually except for the difference in price, I haven't noticed much difference in taste between organic and conventional squash of the same variety. I have noticed more bugs and damage on the organic ones though.

I am growing upo gourds. It is not organic because it is from saved seeds and conventional fertilizer was used to grow that squash as well as compost. The squash I am growing now has not been sprayed with anything to control pests, however roundup was used previously within 20 feet of the place where the vines were planted within the last three years. I still add compost every time I plant and my pH was higher than the last time at 7.8. So, instead of the usual compost, I added peat moss and sulfur. Sulfur is an inorganic substance that is allowed under NOP standards. I still use conventional fertilizer. I just started picking the squash. The first one was on the ground and it rotted. The rest are on the fence and so far I have harvested six gourds about one to two feet long. They get bigger but they taste better when they are younger and the seeds are still undeveloped. I will probably get 20 or more from the one vine and that is normal for this squash. I made chicken and squash soup and it was delicious.
"Organic is a labeling term that indicates that the food or other agricultural product has been produced through approved methods. The organic standards describe the specific requirements that must be verified by a USDA-accredited certifying agent before products can be labeled USDA organic."
https://www.ams.usda.gov/grades-standar ... -standards

To be organic and call it certified organic
Organic methods must be used for three years, including, using organic seeds, and organic inputs
There needs to be a buffer zone between organic and conventional crops. I think it is a 25 ft buffer zone for my state. Nothing in the buffer zone can be inorganic an the zone must be maintained to prevent runoff from the inorganic fields from contaminating the organic ones. Plants in the buffer zones can be trees, grass or a crop, that can be managed organically but cannot be sold as organic so it must be separated from an organic crop.
No inorganic fertilizers or pesticides can be used.
Certification requires all of the above be documented and organic methods be maintained to meet certified organic standards and certification is granted before you can label a product as organic.

Organic farms are allowed to used pesticides but they are limited or OMRI listed and NOP approved products.
Some inorganic substances are allowed for organic use by the NOP. So even organic farms are allowed to use some inorganic substances and still be legally organic. Some of the listed organic pesticides can still be very toxic like neem and pyrethrins. Just because it is a substance naturally found in nature does not mean it is safe. Neem and pyrethrins are plant based extracts but they are concentrated many more times than they would be found in nature. Both neem and pyrethrins are toxic to bees and fish.

https://npic.orst.edu/reg/organic.html
https://www.ctahr.hawaii.edu/oc/freepubs/pdf/FST-56.pdf

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jal_ut
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From Webster: organic: of food : grown or made without the use of artificial chemicals

Well OK. I do not use artificial chemicals on my garden. I fertilize with manure, leaves and grass clippings. I treat for some bugs with diatomaceous Earth. I water with water from the reservoir. Does this mean my produce is "Organic"??? by definition?

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!potatoes!
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it fits mine. organic but not certified.

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jal_ut
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Perhaps it fits, but I refuse to use that word (organic) to describe my produce. Too much legal and government junk attached to it.

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applestar
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gumbo2176 wrote:Applestar, you and I seem to be kindred spirits in a way. I see you post all hours of the day-------and night so is it safe to assume you also suffer from a form of insomnia? I usually get by on about 4 to 5 hours of sleep a day, and broken sleep at that. If so, fun isn't it?
Haha. That's me 4-5 hrs and I'm awake, and if I can't turn my brain off, too many ideas start flooding the neurons and I can't go back to sleep. :roll:

I also managed to overtire myself in the garden and went to bed early one day, and poof! My sleep cycle shifted and I'm up between 3 and 4 am. Sometimes I take a Nap then oh boy I can't fall asleep after waking up no matter what I do. :lol: :>

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Gary350
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Growing up no one in the family grew much squash, no one knew what to do with it. My grandmother and mother use to, slice, bread and fry it in the skillet. I don't grow much squash either zucchini and yellow crook neck, only thing I know is what I learned from my mother. Alice makes squash casserole sometimes, not my favorite. A few nights ago she sliced and fried squash in the skillet with onions and garlic it was good so we had it again 3 nights in a row. I made zucchini bread 3 days ago it was the best but I need to watch my sugar these days. I want to make a zucchini yogurt smoothie it sounds good. I don't know what else to do with squash there are so many different kinds which one is best?

I know what you mean about talking organic being a religion. I hate to call my garden is organic but I guess it is I never put toxic cancer causing poison on my plants. I don't do compose anymore too much work for what little I get, it is much easier to burn it with brush, wood, tree limbs, etc., then use the wood ash in the garden to prevent BER in, tomatoes, squash, melons, peppers. If I need compose a truck load is $15 at the Amish garden center. My 15 bird houses keep away bugs. Rusty water is good for blight I have 5 gallon water buckets full of metal to make rusty water. My grandfather use to burn old lumber for the ash and rusty nails he put about 20 rusty nails in the hole when he planted tomatoes for blight, iron is good to kill, mold, mildew, fungi, blight. I fertilize plants with 40 lbs bags of cow manure. I make my own nitrogen. At home about the best you can make is low grade home made fertilizer. Factory made fertilizer is nothing more than a higher concentrated form of pure NPK about as organic as it gets but you can not convince the organic left wing radicals it is not toxic poison. The organic people put Epsom salt on their garden like it is not a factory made product. Talk about organic dirt is funny, is there any dirt that is not organic.

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jal_ut
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Dirt? you mean soil?

Topsoil is mostly clay, silt and sand. Nothing organic about it. Its mineral.



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