Let the 2016 Games Begin

[Allyn]

I cleared most of the flowers out from under the lights and they're outside in hanging baskets. That freed up the seed trays for four varieties of tomatoes, four varieties of lettuce (leaf and head), parsley, two varieties of beans and two varieties of peppers. Also something called Par-Cel which is supposed to look like parsley but have a celery taste. The beans sprouted almost immediately and are growing so fast, I can literally watch them grow (and I do mean literally, not figuratively.) The beans are going to be ready for the SiPs lickity-split but the tomatoes I started last fall are still using them. The tomatoes are putting out new blossoms so it looks like they're still going strong. I'm thinking about planting the beans with them and give them their own string to climb..

[lakngulf]

... Also something called Par-Cel which is supposed to look like parsley but have a celery taste. The beans sprouted almost immediately and are growing so fast, I can literally watch them grow (and I do mean literally, not figuratively.) The beans are going to be ready for the SiPs lickity-split but the tomatoes I started last fall are still using them. The tomatoes are putting out new blossoms so it looks like they're still going strong. I'm thinking about planting the beans with them and give them their own string to climb..

I have never heard of Par-Cel. Interested in how that turns out.
What are SiPs?

I agree with you totally on how fast the beans can take off! I planted these primarily to test germination, but they look too good to throw out.

[imafan26]

I grew par-cel. It is more like parsley with a celery flavor. You would grow it like parsley. I actually did not get too many to germinate and in the end I got cutting celery which is easier to grow. Cutting celery was more warm tolerant and it has a very strong celery taste. It is not good for eating celery sticks but good for using in soups, sofrito, or mirepoix for building a flavor base.

I transplanted a few more seedlings of Thai tiger eggplant, long purple eggplant, chervil, fennel, curly parsley, Early Girl tomato, Beefsteak tomato, and more yellow bells. I ran out of media and I have to see if I can get more. I still have more seedlings to pot up.

My seedlings of superchili were diseased so I had to cull them. I checked my mother plants and they all had white flies so I pulled them too. I will have to grow new chili mamas for super chili, Hawaiian chili, Bhut jolokia, and Trinidad scorpion. In the meantime I will have to find more clean seeds.

[Allyn]

...What are SiPs?

sub-irrigation planters.
https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/vi ... 21&t=60946

So far, I'm with imafan on the Par-Cel. It sounds like an interesting idea, but I'm not having much luck getting any to sprout.

[imafan26]

The parcel was like parsley it took up to 28 days to sprout, the media needed to stay moist and the seedlings were relished by slugs. I get better luck with the parsley family when I soak the seeds overnight in warm water first to soften them. I plant in compots so I use a 4 or six inch pot with premoistened potting soil. I put the seeds on the top of the medial and I just sprinkle a light layer of potting soil on them. I get a paper towel and water through the paper towel. I keep the towel moist or damp. after a couple of weeks, I will start to peek under the towel and see if anything has sprouted, when the sprouts show up, I remove the paper towel and bottom water until the sprouts can stand up on their own.

[lakngulf]

I keep the towel moist or damp. after a couple of weeks, I will start to peek under the towel and see if anything has sprouted, when the sprouts show up, I remove the paper towel and bottom water until the sprouts can stand up on their own.

I wonder if that trick, along with soaking the seed overnight, would help with pepper and eggplant germination? I have a flat of pepper seed (a) under grow lights (b) on a heat mat and (c) under a dome. I noticed this morning that a couple of sprouts are showing, but flat has been seeded for quite some time.

[catgrass]

Lake-I find that both peppers and eggplant take much longer to germinate than tomatoes. Usually a week -10 days later. Both like good warmth to germinate. I usually don't start my eggplant seeds until first of Feb, because they like it warmer in the garden.

[lakngulf]

Lake-I find that both peppers and eggplant take much longer to germinate than tomatoes. Usually a week -10 days later. Both like good warmth to germinate. I usually don't start my eggplant seeds until first of Feb, because they like it warmer in the garden.

After having peppers and egg plant over a heat mat and under a dome, I finally got some germination on banana and bell peppers. Tiny, tiny, but it's a start

[imafan26]

This year has been warmer than usual. I have started peppers and eggplant. I am waiting on the really hot peppers though, they just like the temperature to be really warm at least 70 degrees consistently. Bhut Jolokia germinated better close to 80 degrees.

[lakngulf]

This year has been warmer than usual. I have started peppers and eggplant. I am waiting on the really hot peppers though, they just like the temperature to be really warm at least 70 degrees consistently. Bhut Jolokia germinated better close to 80 degrees.

We have had some great temps the last three or four days, highs in the 70s. Fantastic. Would have been great to get some of my plants outdoors for a brief time, but logistics would not work, so they all stayed put in South window.

Our average last freeze is mid March, and the soil temps in the garden are not up until later. So my early plants will have to be up-potted to avoid getting "leggy". Peppers, on the other hand, should be just right.

[catgrass]

My tomatoes are twice as high as my peppers-and it appears all 8 of my peppers have come up. Will start eggplant this weekend.

[lakngulf]

I don't think I have ever gotten 100% germination on peppers, but happy with what I get.

Don't these tomatoes look good. They first popped out on Dec 27. When I transplanted to 4in pots I put them as low as possible so I get more soil around the stem as they grew. Also, I keep them pretty close to the lights, and in the south window. I may have burned a couple of plants with the closeness of the lights.

This picture is from the outside looking in. It is a prettier site than the picture will show. I see I got a lot of the screen.

[Taiji]

Those are nice looking plants. I'll second the use of a heat mat. I always had terrible pepper germination until I finally started using a heat mat. Then I couldn't believe my eyes at how fast they sprouted! I'm still a few weeks away from starting anything, but I'm gettin' ready!

[jal_ut]

Too early for me to start tomatoes. I had to plant something though so planted some hot pepper seeds. They take longer to get going. So far just two have germinated. Give it some time..............

[lakngulf]

Too early for me to start tomatoes. I had to plant something though so planted some hot pepper seeds. They take longer to get going. So far just two have germinated. Give it some time..............

Truth be known, it is TOO EARLY for me to, but I couldn't help it!

[applestar]

[lakngulf]

Oh my, look at these temps predicted for our area over the next few days. I had a flat of Butter Crunch lettuce that was sprouting in the greenhouse, but I have now moved it to the heated side room. Many of those plants that had begun to bud during our unseasonably warm days will take a hit this week. I know for many of you these are get outside and play temps, but for us this is pretty cold.

[lakngulf]

The Good and the Not So Good

Here is a picture of a couple of flats I have in the "grow window" this morning. Some good, some not so:



On the left are some great starts of Butter Crunch lettuce. I had some seed in the frig from years back and decided to give it a try. Was please with germination and the little seedlings are taking off. Get a little past these February COLD temps and I will put some outside. Butter Crunch makes a great leaf for sandwiches and salads.

On the right is an experiment, kinda working. I normally use Miracle Gro potting soil for starting seed. This year from the farm I hauled in a couple trailer loads of "compost" which is soil piled up around the hay feeding area from a couple years back. I pile up the soil with my tractor front end loader and allow it to "mature". These loads of dirt still had some straw structures, etc that made it look a lot like the potting soil I buy (I have often complained that some potting soil looks like potting sticks). So I decided to try it for some tomato seeds.

As you can see I have some good tomato seedlings, but I also have LOTS of unwanted sprouting. Could be rye grass, but most likely sticker weeds. Soil is rich so the seedlings should do well but way too many weeds. I remember that my Mom used to bake the compost to kill the seeds.

[Peter1142]

I have Leeks and Onions growing. Starting artichokes and hot peppers tomorrow! I have a full journal blog going this year, link in my signature.

Just when I thought the mild winter would let my figs and artichokes survive, it is brutal out there this weekend. High like 15F, Low -7F. Ugh. At least it will provide a good kill to pathogens.

[imafan26]

We just had our first sale of the year yesterday. I put out almost 700 3.5 inch vegetable and herb starts (28 trays). It was an exhausting day, but a good one. I have room again on the bench so I can start planting more seeds again. I also have to up pot some of the peppers, onions, and eggplant.

[lakngulf]

Wow, 700 starts. Did they all sell?

[imafan26]

No, but I sold close to 500.

I gave away someThai eggplant because I had a lot of them and they are not that easy to sell. They are mostly for Indian and Vietnamese and Thai curries. The vegetables sold (tomatoes, cucumbers) and they were the ones that would not keep. Most of the herbs will keep, some peppers, onions, and eggplant need to be potted up. Some of the plants will be planted out in the gardens. Some of the papaya will go out into the orchard and I will plant some of the fennel, sunflowers, parsley, and peppers out into the herb garden.

I will have to rehome some Kale and I have already found a home for the bok choy that got too big to sell and I put the beets that matured too early into my garden.

I have already started planning and planting for next month. Our sales are on the second Saturday from 9-12 Feb-October, and I get about a months respite before I have to start planning for the next sale. I started planting for the February sale on Dec 12, 2015. From now on, I will be planting one or two months ahead of the sale. Around September or October, I really reduce what I grow and just try to clear off the benches so they can get their annual bleaching.

[jal_ut]

Here it 35 degrees today and a foot of snow on the ground. Be a while before planting outdoors. You folks are getting me fired up to try something in a tray though. I don't have a green house, so whatever I plant will go in the living room window. The wife lets me do a few things without a big fuss, but I don't want to turn the living room into a greenhouse.

[lakngulf]

Here it 35 degrees today and a foot of snow on the ground.

While you are checking out the cold temps and beautiful white mountains, what do you think about this?

I read an article in the Birmingham News that tried to dispel some Tomato Growing Myths. Basically the guy said


1. don't plant deep
2. don't mulch too early
3. epson salt does nothing
4. do not prune
5. don't go by Good Firday as plant date.

[sweetiepie]

I agree with jal-ut. It is hard to sit on ones hands. You guys sound like you are doing great and make it sound like so much fun. But I too have a foot of snow/ice on the ground still, maybe more and still getting below zero temps except this weekend is suppose to be 30's and freezing rain.

I think I will start some hot peppers next week, last year they were really slow and were just getting going well and the hard freeze came in the fall.

As far as this, I think it really depends on where you are located. So far, for me all those things are true.

1. don't plant deep
2. don't mulch too early
3. epson salt does nothing
4. do not prune
5. don't go by Good Firday as plant date

[applestar]

Here it 35 degrees today and a foot of snow on the ground.

I read an article in the Birmingham News that tried to dispel some Tomato Growing Myths. Basically the guy said...

Oh! OH! MEE!!! MEEE!!! -- can I jump in and answer?

1. don't plant deep

-- in cold, late spring areas, deeper ground soil is not as warmed up by the sun and colder/wetter, but in areas where summer is very hot, [p]lanting deeper could keep the roots dry cooler (which helps to keep the plant cooler -- geothermal effect).
-- in areas with frequent rain and clay soil, planting deep could be disastrous
BUT -- In most cases, planting tomatoes "deeper" by burying some of the stem will help them grow more roots along the stem and a bigger root system, but it doesn't have to be "deeper" but a shallow trench or diagonal hole could work too.

2. don't mulch too early

-- in cold, late spring area, mulching too early can keep the sun from warming up the soil. Even in my area, I don't mulch heavily at least until I hoe down the first bunch of early weeds like chickweed and dead nettle. Then THEY become part of the mulch.

3. epson salt does nothing

-- I think this depends on existing mineral content of the soil. Magnesium Sulfate obviously adds magnesium and sulfur. A couple of benefits I remember off the top of my head -- Magnesium balances the calcium uptake and absorption and Sulfur can lower pH. Epsom Salt also somehow helps Nitrogen absorption (can't remember how) and greens up yellowed seedlings due to nutrient deficiency, exposure to cold, etc. TOO MUCH epsom salt can interfere with osmosis and "burn" the plant.

4. do not prune

-- don't prune what? Lower leaves that touch the ground or are likely to be splashed up? Suckers below first flower truss? Diseased leaves? Don't prune excessive foliage and vines for better air circulation to prevent fungal disease? don't prune determinate variety tomatoes? (I agree with the last one).

5. don't go by Good Friday as plant date

-- that's plain silly. Good Friday is based on lunar calendar and can occur on widely ranging calendar date. It would be surprising if the seasonal weather cooperated and coincided from year to year. Around here, people talk about Mother's Day and Memorial Day, but those are a little iffy too since they occur on 2nd Sunday and last Monday of May. Pick another holiday.

[lakngulf]

Most of it makes good sense. I plant way before Good Friday, sometimes it works, but those tomatoes like warm soil. I have always planted deep thinking that would help roots, but the guys discussion of the soil being cold in March/April down deep makes a lot of sense. I will plant early tomatoes shallow or laying down

[Peter1142]

Good advice applestar. For tomatoes, you can bend the stem a little and plant horizontal rather than vertical too!

As long as there is no frost, tomatoes are fairy cold tolerant IME, and resilient, and though they may be unhappy for a little while they should survive anything else temperature wise.

[applestar]

For planting shallow, best technique I've tried so far has been to lay the individual containers of seedlings on their sides or at an angle or tilt the tray of seedlings at an angle by leaning it on something for a while before planting.

Since it's best to acclimate them to where they will be planted, easiest way has been to make a V-trench in the bed to position them at a desired angle supported by the soil of the trench or -- this is more typical for me -- to lean them/set them against the side of wide raised rows for the last day and night before planting. The tops of the seedlings will naturally respond to the new gravitational orientation and grow upward and "sideways".

[jal_ut]

"1. don't plant deep
2. don't mulch too early
3. epson salt does nothing
4. do not prune
5. don't go by Good Firday as plant date."

I will agree.

On number 1. if you have tall spindly plants, which sometimes happens if grown with out
sufficient light, you can lay them in a trench to bury some of the stem, but not put the roots
deep.

[jal_ut]

I confess, I do have two tomato plants growing in little pots in the living room. I started them about January 1. They are not doing much, act like they would love some real sunshine. Here with short days and behind glass, they just don't get enough sun. I have put no artificial light on them. They are not liking these conditions. They are spindly and sickly looking. We will see what they do.

[lakngulf]

For planting shallow, best technique I've tried so far has been to lay the individual containers of seedlings on their sides or at an angle or tilt the tray of seedlings at an angle by leaning it on something for a while before planting.

Since it's best to acclimate them to where they will be planted, easiest way has been to make a V-trench in the bed to position them at a desired angle supported by the soil of the trench or -- this is more typical for me -- to lean them/set them against the side of wide raised rows for the last day and night before planting. The tops of the seedlings will naturally respond to the new gravitational orientation and grow upward and "sideways".

Good ideas! I guess I got it from my folks that the deeper I plant the more roots the tomato can form. But if it is too cold down toward China then I guess that defeats the purpose. I will definitely use the horizontal method for my mid March planting. I think I will have some spindly plants that should like that method.

On another note, I have always used wire hoops made of concrete reinforcement wire. Well, my normal procedure is to push the cage down into the soil around the plant, and turn it a few times to get the cage set into the soil. A few years back I had some crazy spindly plants and needed to plant them horizontal, so I did. I grabbed a cage and went about my normal procedure, twisted the cage and cut right through the tomato plant. Have to be careful with that.

[lakngulf]

I confess, I do have two tomato plants growing in little pots in the living room.

OK, so you have beautiful mountain views AND tomato plants! What variety of tomato do you plant?

[jal_ut]

Variety? Better Boy, Celebrity, Sweet Baby Girl. Have also used Early girl. The new one called Celebration Hybrid looks interesting. Have to see if I can find some seed? Here I need to stick with those in the 70 to 72 day maturation date claims.
Even the 72 day tomatoes take closer to 80-85 days in this climate and that is about all the frost free time I have.

[SPierce]

It has been so, so long since I've been able to garden for real, and I haven't into the forums in forever. I should probably reintroduce myself, but oh well. Hi again anyway

After many years of unsuccessfully being able to work my friends not-so-good soil (who owns the house I'm renting a room from) I'm going with all container gardening this year. Found some large 2 foot deep pots at home depot on sale for 9.99 that we drilled holes into on the bottom of for drainage and I've repurposed into planters for my veggies. Plan on buying more this year to accommodate all the plants I'm going to try and grow. Already got a rainwater collection system going, because I've seen the huge difference it makes for my prayer plant and the orchid I have going so I have a feeling things might get a bit crazy

While it's way, way too early for me to even think about tomatoes, squashes, etc I'm starting a few seeds today of the things I have the most trouble with and those that seem to grow the most slowly. Broccoli, Brussels Sprouts and Sweet Peppers. We shall see what happens from here! The rest I'll start near the end of March, when I get home from vacation, and I will probably find an extra large container or two in addition to see if I can manage to grow a pumpkin in a container, even though my chances are slim.

I do have to admit that it feels really, really good to get my hands dirty with soil again. Makes me happy. I'm going to see if I can find some prolific, pretty flowers that can take mostly shade and plant them in the raised beds in the back, so it isn't just empty and sad in the backyard anymore.

[lakngulf]

After many years of unsuccessfully being able to work my friends not-so-good soil (who owns the house I'm renting a room from) I'm going with all container gardening this year.
I do have to admit that it feels really, really good to get my hands dirty with soil again. Makes me happy. I'm going to see if I can find some prolific, pretty flowers that can take mostly shade and plant them in the raised beds in the back, so it isn't just empty and sad in the backyard anymore.

Good luck with the container gardening. I have some large tubs that came from a farm nearby. They were used for a protein lick block. They have worked well, but even, consistent watering is a challenge.

Here is a picture of some pots with tomato plants last summer

[SPierce]

After many years of unsuccessfully being able to work my friends not-so-good soil (who owns the house I'm renting a room from) I'm going with all container gardening this year.
I do have to admit that it feels really, really good to get my hands dirty with soil again. Makes me happy. I'm going to see if I can find some prolific, pretty flowers that can take mostly shade and plant them in the raised beds in the back, so it isn't just empty and sad in the backyard anymore.

Good luck with the container gardening. I have some large tubs that came from a farm nearby. They were used for a protein lick block. They have worked well, but even, consistent watering is a challenge.

Here is a picture of some pots with tomato plants last summer

Looks lovely! A lot nicer than mine (admittedly) is going to look! He doesn't have a lot of landscaping, and neither of us have a lot of time to do yard related things... What size are your containers? I luckily haven't had much of an issue with watering, and the things I've tried to grow in these in the past have never had a problem. More likely to be killed by bugs than water, but how do you water them typically?

[applestar]

Great to see you back @SPierce!
Looking forward to hearing about your garden this year. ...and I know what you mean about playing in the dirt. it's my therapy for sure.

[SPierce]

Great to see you back @SPierce!
Looking forward to hearing about your garden this year. ...and I know what you mean about playing in the dirt. it's my therapy for sure.

Thank you! I will hopefully have something to post about, finally. Typically I start posting, etc. then I end up ashamed at how bad my plants are doing, so I slink away... hope this year will be better and busy! I've had the best luck with the containers out of all the years, so this year I'm going all out. Wish I could really do corn in containers, though, but unless someone does a mini corn hybrid, I don't think it's possible

[applestar]

Haha you might want to look in these threads -- see what you miss when you are away for a year?

Subject: What Can I Grow In a Container?

I had good success in my 1st year with corn.

I fit 11 corn stalks per 30 gallon SIP tote:




I'm gonna do it again this year!

Subject: Self Watering Container and Sub-irrigated Planter

Here are examples of things grown in my 30 gallon SIP totes, without using any plastic cover at all:





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