Sweet corn planting

[TareqPhoto]

Here is photos from above to that selected area as a plan, later I will ask about few trees next to the wall so I can remove it if unwanted so I can get little more space.

I went to measure that selected area from the wall to the middle of the front entrance of metal fence, and it is 7m, and then from the front entrance to inside just right before the limit of where my pomegranate tree is and it gives me another 7m.

Let's say I will take gaps or cut from all directions, and I just have 6.5m or even 6m square, 6m is ~20ft, do you think that 20x20ft area isn't enough for anything worthy?

I did read from another site that I need about 4'x4' block for sweet corn for pollination, 4x4' is a small portion of 20x20', and I even asked them if I can take say 20'x 6' area for only sweet corn and leave the rest for another plants including tomatoes, isn't it enough space for sweet corn and anything else? So if you have that 6mx6m [20x20ft] square area part of your garden, and you have list of some plants, what you will choose to plant and how you plant on that specific area?

[applestar]

Well, in that case you could do some creative planting including corn AS LONG AS THE AREA FOR THE CORN GETS FULL DAY SUN (8 hrs or more I think)

Here's one example of a portion of my garden from this past summer (and link to the thread)

Subject: Applestar's 2015 Garden

Finally, FINALLY, finished planting the Sunflower House and Extension
Sowed Pre-germinated melon seeds (didn't wait for them to sprout their seed leaves) and planted SIL's melon seedlings started from store or farmers market bought melon in the "melon" section, and sowed pre-germinated Narcissus F1 gourd which is supposed to be edible like summer squash when picked young. Armenian cucumbers which is actually a melon also went in the melon section.



...all that's left to do is to take down the winter compost pile and use it to mulch and hill the potatoes and corn in the Haybale Row. I may sow some more bush wax beans in the still available/reserved spots where the squash and watermelons will be filling in as they grow.

You'll see that you could plant in "succession" so when one crop is finished, another can take over the same space. Best way to do this is by keeping the best growing temperature and timing in mind.

[applestar]

Here's another thread from 2014 --
Subject: 2014 Spiral Garden Garlic Onion Pea Corn Squash Cuke Beet

It's getting harder to walk the spiral -- I have to push the corn leaves aside and bend my head a bit. The squash and melon vines are growing wild and I have to re-adjust their direction every day. Snowpeas need to be picked daily, and the shell peas are starting to make pods - hopefully! this semi-sun location with plenty of water from the outer spiral path/swale will keep them going through the heat.

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Planted seven hot peppers -- mostly overwintered plants, but one from this year' started seeds -- along the front outer spiral between the onions and garlic.

The squash are really liking the Haybale row:

image.jpg

But the plants on the end NOT in the tunnel are blooming earlier -- more light?

image.jpg

image.jpg

...are these helpful at all?

If you read through them, you may have noticed that I don't intentionally plant tomatoes where I plant corn -- that's because it's generally considered best to keep them separated. There is a moth caterpillar here that will attack both tomato fruits and corn ears -- "tomato fruit worm" and "corn ear worm" -- and when they are planted right next to each other, the moth will find a larger contiguous crop to lay eggs on and, moreover, the caterpillar could actually crawl from one to the other and have tomatoes for breakfast and corn for dinner.

I usually (try to) post about my tomato gardens in a separate thread.

[jal_ut]

I would plant two rows spaced 762 mm and space the seeds 150 mm in the rows. You can expand from there, but these are the recommended spacings. Plant the seed directly where it will grow. No transplanting.

[imafan26]

A 20x20 garden is a good size space. You can plant corn in the sunniest spots but as Apple said it is better not to plant tomatoes next to them. Besides the shared pests, they also are both nutrient hungry.

Corn needs to be planted in a block, a 4x4 block is usually minimum but you can expand on that. I would plant beans as a companion as they do not need as much nitrogen as the corn. You can plant a melon or squash and make it a three sisters garden. Plant the tallest things in the sunniest spot but you want to make sure that short plants are not shaded by them.

[jal_ut]

Pic of one of my past gardens. As you see tomatoes next to the corn. It has not been a problem here. I may not get some of the pests others have mentioned because of my very cold winters?

[applestar]

Possibly, jal_ut. I don't get tomato fruit worms / corn ear worms on regular basis either. My garden seem to fall under attack by those and other, more heat loving -- and not winter hardy -- pests (leaf foots, squash bugs, blister beetles, harlequin bugs, pickleworms, locusts/grasshoppers... Etc.) after remnants of tropical storms and hurricanes sweep up the coast or up from the gulf and up the central states then cut up and across the Appalachians, so I think they are brought here by the weather systems.

If we have a mild winter like we have had a few years ago, we have more of those pests in the following season.

[TareqPhoto]

Ok, then in this case, I should plant tomatoes next to the wall and the corn just next to the front entrance to the garden, and I can plant something in between them, the sun direction from what I see is just parallel to that of the entrance, so it can light both directions when it is in the top middle of the garden, then way all plants will get light, it is just in the early morning or end of the day near the sunset where the sun will light up next the entrance first and that next to the wall will be under shadow, and end of the day by sunset those next to the wall will be the last to see the light, so the corn will get the light first and the tomatoes will have the light last so they can have enough light everyday.

Now the question is, what I will plant in between the tomatoes and the corn? mostly those small plants or say ground-spread type plants such as watermelon, in fact if I plant tomatoes and corn first then I am done and I can think later about anything else, I may use another part of the garden for only watermelon if necessary and keep that area I chose for corps and very important plants for me, watermelon and lettuce aren't in my top list, they are in bottom actually.

jal_ut, I like the idea of planting the seed directly to the ground rather than transplanting, but as long I keep preparing my garden and cleaning it I will waste time and I may miss days or weeks of waiting while if I planted in pots or containers they will be grown enough so can transplant then I don't wait them to be sprouting, but if transplanting may kill the plant or slowing the growth very much then it will be like not a safe side then, also I am not sure what I will plant completely I my garden, so I start with many plants out of garden and then choose carefully the most what I need, and to test the environment o each plant in pots/containers so I know what to avoid and what to choose, wish if the garden was ready totally now then I will definitely plant the seeds in the ground.

[jal_ut]

Plant your corn seed in the ground where it will grow. Do not transplant it. Two or three rows spaced 30 inches works much better than a single row.

[TareqPhoto]

Plant your corn seed in the ground where it will grow. Do not transplant it. Two or three rows spaced 30 inches works much better than a single row.

Well, I was thinking that as long I have enough space then I can take 2 or 3 rows for sweet corns, but I decided to give it only 2 rows with long line for one row and the second is just the copy, so I will have 2 rows long, this will give maybe more chances for pollination than smaller block, I wanted to give another space for tomatoes too, and there will be space for both plants in one selected area, so I better plant my seeds directly in the ground than transplanting, ok, I will give this a go once I am done with my garden selected area cleaning/preparation.

Nice corn you posted, but I didn't like this yellow/white type, I like if I can get the full yellow corn for each stick.

[imafan26]

If you are going to plant corn it is better to have 4 rows and a block instead of a long row. Take your two long rows and make a block of 4 rows. Corn yields poorly only 1 or two ears per plant. The corn ears on the outside of the row will yield the least the corn on the inside of the block will yield the most.

Mulch holds down weeds. You can use straw as mulch. You would buy it as a bale from a farm supply. Make sure it is straw not hay. You will spread it over the finished bed 4 inches thick. When you plant, you will expose the row by moving the mulch to the side and plant the seeds in the ground. Do not cover the seeds with the mulch.

You can divide the bed in sections so you can work on one part at a time while another is planted. You need to have space for pathways anyway if you are planting many different things.

You can divide the bed into at least 4 quadrants and work one at a time. Plant the corn in one quadrant 4x4 rows.
15 c. is probably night temperatures. Day temperatures are warmer and no where near freezing. It is a good time to plant greens lettuce, cabbage, spinach, beets, carrots, radish.

[jal_ut]

Yes, there are many varieties of corn. I don't know what will be available there.
Golden Cross Bantam, Miracle, Growers Choice, NK 199 and Bodacious
are some examples of yellow corn.

The corn in the pictures is Ambrosia. Yes, it is bi-color.

[Taiji]

I have grown Bodacious that Jal-ut mentioned for the last few years and have loved it. It has a creamy texture that can't be described. This year though, for the first time, I did get some corn earworms in Bodacious for who knows what reason. But, the damage was minimal; the little caterpillars were only in the very tips of the ears. I would recommend Bodacious as a solid yellow corn.

bodacious.JPG (39.38 KiB) Viewed 2595 times

This upcoming year, I will be gardening in 2 separate locations, so I want to grow some of Jal-ut's Ambrosia at one spot and Bodacious in the other. I think they both have about the same maturation time. I've already got some Ambrosia seed. Can't wait!

[TareqPhoto]

I planted new seeds nearly 1 week ago after the first time failure, and this time I planted only 1 seed in each hole instead of two, and wow, the germinated also and will grow, I am not sure how long those new seeds/plants will grow/live, but it is good to know that the seeds are in good condition as long they germinated second time, I will update you with those new plants so if anything wrong going on you can tell me what so I can avoid it when I will plant the seeds in the ground instead of containers so they can have a permanent place without disturbance of transplanting.

[ButterflyLady29]

Corn seed should be spaced about 1/2 meter apart. Most corn needs a lot of room to grow and you'll need at least 50 plants to get proper pollination. So a block of corn would be at least 25 meters long and 40 meters wide. You'll have to have the corn plants separated by rows so you have room to walk through and check the plants and pick the corn. It would look a little like this [ ] [ ] [ ]. I forgot to add that you can plant 2 rows close together, then have a walkway or path, then 2 rows then walkway, and so on. Some people plant clover, usually white dutch clover in their corn patch to keep the other weeds from growing and to protect the soil. I've never tried that because I can't grow sweet corn. To many animals would eat it before I get any.

Mulch, any organic material spread on the soil to help save moisture in the soil and keep weed seeds from growing. Here in the US we have a lot of different kinds of mulch. Some people use cardboard sheets or newspaper. Others use grass clippings that are gathered when mowing the lawn. And some use shredded dried leaves that fall from the trees in autumn. Another mulch is wood chips or bark chips, known as bagged mulch. The wood or bark chips can be bought at stores and gas stations here. If paper or cardboard is used you have to put something on top of it to keep it from blowing away.

You can plant a lot of things outdoors now. Turnips, broccoli, carrots, beets, cabbage, lettuce, kale, peas, and radishes can be planted in cool weather.

I did a little checking on your temperature because my ability to convert celsius to fahrenheit is terrible. So your temperature is 59F to 82F. Here we call that summer. Do you ever drop below 0c? If your temperature won't get below 10c then you can plant squash, tomatoes, peppers, corn, sunflowers, and other warm weather crops outside. If it normally goes below 10c then the cool weather crops can be planted.

[TareqPhoto]

Corn seed should be spaced about 1/2 meter apart. Most corn needs a lot of room to grow and you'll need at least 50 plants to get proper pollination. So a block of corn would be at least 25 meters long and 40 meters wide. You'll have to have the corn plants separated by rows so you have room to walk through and check the plants and pick the corn. It would look a little like this [ ] [ ] [ ]. I forgot to add that you can plant 2 rows close together, then have a walkway or path, then 2 rows then walkway, and so on. Some people plant clover, usually white dutch clover in their corn patch to keep the other weeds from growing and to protect the soil. I've never tried that because I can't grow sweet corn. To many animals would eat it before I get any.

Mulch, any organic material spread on the soil to help save moisture in the soil and keep weed seeds from growing. Here in the US we have a lot of different kinds of mulch. Some people use cardboard sheets or newspaper. Others use grass clippings that are gathered when mowing the lawn. And some use shredded dried leaves that fall from the trees in autumn. Another mulch is wood chips or bark chips, known as bagged mulch. The wood or bark chips can be bought at stores and gas stations here. If paper or cardboard is used you have to put something on top of it to keep it from blowing away.

You can plant a lot of things outdoors now. Turnips, broccoli, carrots, beets, cabbage, lettuce, kale, peas, and radishes can be planted in cool weather.

I did a little checking on your temperature because my ability to convert celsius to fahrenheit is terrible. So your temperature is 59F to 82F. Here we call that summer. Do you ever drop below 0c? If your temperature won't get below 10c then you can plant squash, tomatoes, peppers, corn, sunflowers, and other warm weather crops outside. If it normally goes below 10c then the cool weather crops can be planted.

Your post showing me that I should forget planting/growing corn because it sounds I need half of my whole garden area to be planted with corn for the best result, and actually I chose only quarter from that half of my garden anyway, I can't just use it only for corn, if that is the case then simply I have to ignore corn and plant another things I really need more than corn, I selected an area which is about 6x6m or nearly 20x20 feet after I took about 1m[3feet] from all direction to give a space to all around of that area, so if that 6x6m isn't that much enough for corn then I can't plant tomatoes or lettuce or whatever, I was thinking I may use half of that 6x6 say 3x6 for corn and 1x6 for tomatoes, 2 meter between the tomatoes and corn corps, the tomatoes I was planning to give one row, which is say along that 6 meter long but 1 meter wide, the corn I was giving it also long 6meter but in 3 rows next to each other so it can give kind of block, or 2 rows isn't enough? I mean pollination can't be done by hand so I don't depend on wind or flies to do it for me?

Also, are all corn varieties need the same block area to be grown or some can be grown in smaller blocks? I did read that I need minimum 4x4' block area for corn, if I understand it correctly this is 4feet by 4feet, right? if so then it translates or converted to about 1.2meter by 1.2meter, what if I said I will take quarter of that area 6x6m so it is 3meter by 3meter, this is about 10x10', that is even more than a double of 4x4', that isn't enough too yet? if not then simply I have to forget about corn and just plant something else including tomatoes.

[Taiji]

Butterfly Lady, did you mean to say 25 meters by 40 meters? I have been growing a small block of corn about 6 feet by 8 feet in recent years with good success. 25 meters by 40 is about 80 some feet by 130 feet.

[TareqPhoto]

Butterfly Lady, did you mean to say 25 meters by 40 meters? I have been growing a small block of corn about 6 feet by 8 feet in recent years with good success. 25 meters by 40 is about 80 some feet by 130 feet.

Exactly my point, honestly even my garden isn't that big if it is 25 meters by 40 meters, it is like I plant the entire garden, and even with 25 feet by 40 feet it is still so big taking nearly the whole side yard garden, I chose an area that is almost 23 feet by 23 feet, and I am taking 2-3 feet from all edges to keep it to 20x20 feet square area.

[rainbowgardener]

25 x 40 m doesn't make sense to me either . I have grown corn in a 4th block (1.2 m sq) and I have seen it grown in large containers.

[TareqPhoto]

25 x 40 m doesn't make sense to me either . I have grown corn in a 4th block (1.2 m sq) and I have seen it grown in large containers.

Ok, so one member suggesting to have a very large area and others just saying it doesn't make a sense, who I should believe? and what I should do here then?

[HoneyBerry]

Yes, I agree with these responses. Corn needs warmth and lots of sun. I always plant corn directly in the ground, not in pots. The organic farm where I did some volunteer work states that corn is easy to grow and will grow anywhere. I don't think that is necessarily true. One thing I know about corn is that how it is watered makes a difference as to how it turns out. It needs to receive adequate water while the corn kernels are forming. Those cobs of corn that you sometimes see that have uneven rows of kernels? That is the result of uneven watering.

[TareqPhoto]

Yes, I agree with these responses. Corn needs warmth and lots of sun. I always plant corn directly in the ground, not in pots. The organic farm where I did some volunteer work states that corn is easy to grow and will grow anywhere. I don't think that is necessarily true. One thing I know about corn is that how it is watered makes a difference as to how it turns out. It needs to receive adequate water while the corn kernels are forming. Those cobs of corn that you sometimes see that have uneven rows of kernels? That is the result of uneven watering.

So watering is the key, with good ground and plenty of sun it will go up strong and healthy, well, we have that plenty of sun, and I am still working out to prepare hat ground, all what is left is the watering, I really not sure how good quality our water is or what is the volume of water is needed for my plants including the corn.

[HoneyBerry]

Water is important, but other things are just as important. Seed selection, soil quality, soil temperature, timing, planting method, sun exposure. Whenever I plant something new, something that I've never grown before, I have found that doing some research before planting really helps. Even with practice, I still make mistskes, but I make less mistakes if I do some research first. Which is what you are doing. There are good people here to help.
One thing I learned along the way is that corn that is planted in small gardens does best if planted in blocks rather than rows. Planting in blocks helps the pollination process. Adequate moisture is important but do is well drained soil. A layer of mulch helps retain the moisture.

[ButterflyLady29]

Sorry, my metric conversion messed me up. I'll try to rework it using feet. A plot that is 4 feet wide can be planted in a double row, seeds spaced closer to the middle than the edges. It could be done in 2 plots, as long as you want to make them. I did popcorn in 2, 3 feet wide and 20 foot long plots one year. So that would be 10 feet by 20 feet, including the path through the middle. I didn't hand pollinate them and still had good production.
Now I'm confused about how I got 25 x 40 meters.
Ideal seed spacing is stated as being 18 inches (1/2 meter) apart, but it can be planted a bit closer together.

[TareqPhoto]

Sounds the soil is really good enough, the seeds I planted again as second test germinated and growing, and wow, it is really growing fast, so I can't wait to plant the seeds in the permanent beds then watch it grow day after day, I feel these days are the best time for planting because we have warmth in the morning or noon until sunset then normal to cold, very hot and high humid may kill the plants or seeds or make it very very slow to grow, I know the plant need heat, but our heat is irresistible even for us human so I feel nowadays warmth is enough at least for germinating and sprouting.

[rainbowgardener]

25 x 40 m doesn't make sense to me either . I have grown corn in a 4th block (1.2 m sq) and I have seen it grown in large containers.

that was of course supposed to say 4x4 ft block, but it was done from my tablet and got auto corrected.... sigh

[TareqPhoto]

Well, we have low temp and cloudy temp today, and little rains, very little, and a bit windy, I really don't know why but the sweet corn seedlings is growing fast, and the tomatoes seedlings at least in 2 pots WOW, I feel they grown about 2-3 inches in one day, yesterday I felt they were slightly up the top of the pot, but today late night when I came back and checked out I see the seedlings are like increased 2 inches to my eyes, is it because this nice cloudy little rainy weather? and I thought only warmth with not rainy is what some plants like, and I was worry that my plants will be damaged.

I think I will try as soon as possible to plant corn seeds in my garden so they can grow in this nice weather and ready for summer, because until summer with nice weather between warmth and cold and rainy and sunny days it may help the plants to get used of weather at the best of it, with warmth some days and some shades and water from rain another days I wouldn't worry about lacking warmth and water, sounds the soil is keeping moisture enough, and I will watch sweet corn for second time, first time I failed, could be that I planted 2 seeds in one hole so they were fighting each other when they both germinated in one hole, now I planted 1 seed each hole and they germinated already except 1 seed from one container, but I think I should just stop testing and just wait to prepare that ground quickly in my garden and plant the sweet corn in block.

I am not worry about pollination, you told me about block so I will make sure about it, but the first time when I planted corn seeds, they germinated and sprouted and grown for about 1 inches or nearly 2 inches but then died all of seedlings, so before I worry about pollination I have to worry about growing enough, it didn't reach even 1 foot at least to have hope, if this second time worked little longer then maybe one reason I knew, I will check out later and update here.

[applestar]

I feel like I already addressed growing corn from seeds, starting them in containers and then planting them in the garden or small numbers of plants if you want to try that, as well as in self watering containers/sub irrigated planters to address the watering issues, and hand pollination when numbers of plants are inadequate for natural wind pollination. I thought I posted links to other threads and posts in which I described these procedures in detail. Have you had the chance to read them?

I sometimes have to stop myself from trying to repeat myself and write a whole new long post when I'd already written multiple posts in details that were fresh when I wrote them and that I probably won't remember them all now.

I'll be glad to answer questions you have if anything I described had not been clear.

[TareqPhoto]

I feel like I already addressed growing corn from seeds, starting them in containers and then planting them in the garden or small numbers of plants if you want to try that, as well as in self watering containers/sub irrigated planters to address the watering issues, and hand pollination when numbers of plants are inadequate for natural wind pollination. I thought I posted links to other threads and posts in which I described these procedures in detail. Have you had the chance to read them?

I sometimes have to stop myself from trying to repeat myself and write a whole new long post when I'd already written multiple posts in details that were fresh when I wrote them and that I probably won't remember them all now.

I'll be glad to answer questions you have if anything I described had not been clear.

You did, and thank you very much for that, I so appreciate it really!

I do read posts, but because I get busy in my life and with my plants and many other things and also I am not member on garden site only but another sites of photography and computers and such things so I quickly forget about posts here and there, so I apologize if I repeat something that has been already answered, also I sometimes keep updating my threads or posts to show what is new, and also new answers may have some good changes, and some methods that have been mentioned could be updated with new better methods, maybe not in planting, but always same answer or new better one always help, we here in arab world keep saying "Repeating will teach the smarts", and as funny we changed this saying to "Repeating will teach the donkey".