Yes, worms are a great sign that there is life in the soil, and a decent amount of organic matter to start with.sheeshshe wrote:Oh, there were lots of worms in the soil. Does that say anything good for the type of clay that it is?
Just keep adding good organic matter (compost is great) as you go, because the act of gardening causes a lot of the soils organic matter to be "used up".
Last edited by farmerlon on Wed May 30, 2012 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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rainbowgardener
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I'm not sure what they mean by decline in work ethic... If Americans don't work very hard off the job, maybe it's because they work too much on the job. Americans work more hours per week and more weeks a year than any other country... 137 more hours a year than Japanese, 260 more hours per year than British workers, and 499 more hours per year than French workers, with fewer holidays, less paid vacation, and less maternity leave.,, 85.8 percent of males and 66.5 percent of females work more than 40 hours per week.
https://20somethingfinance.com/american-hours-worked-productivity-vacation/
So everyone is working more than 40 hrs a week and yet they have a house, yard, kids, soccer games, elderly parents... sounds like work to me.
And yet one in 4 Americans volunteers some time on a regular basis to non-profit, charitable causes, more than in other countries:
Similarly, in 1998, Americans were 15 percent more likely to volunteer their time than the Dutch, 21 percent more likely than the Swiss, and 32 percent more likely than the Germans. [and in another article I saw we also volunteer more than the Japanese] These differences are not attributable to demographic characteristics such as education, income, age, sex, or marital status. On the contrary, if we look at two people who are identical in all these ways except that one is European and the other American, the probability is still far lower that the European will volunteer than the American.
https://www.american.com/archive/2008/march-april-magazine-contents/a-nation-of-givers
(1998 is just the data I could find, but our rate of volunteerism has been increasing a lot since then: [url=https://philanthropy.com/article/Volunteerism-Increases-at/65949/?otd=Y2xpY2t0aHJ1Ojo6c293aWRnZXQ6OjpjaGFubmVsOnRvZGF5cy1uZXdzLGFydGljbGU6MjYtb2YtYW1lcmljYW5zLXZvbHVudGVlci1uZXctc3R1ZHktZmluZHM6OjpjaGFubmVsOnZvbHVudGVlcnMsYXJ0aWNsZTp2b2x1bnRlZXJpc20taW5jcmVhc2VzLWF0LWhpZ2hlc3QtcmF0ZS1pbi02LXllYXJz]surge in volunteerism[/url]
tell me again about the lazy Americans?
https://20somethingfinance.com/american-hours-worked-productivity-vacation/
So everyone is working more than 40 hrs a week and yet they have a house, yard, kids, soccer games, elderly parents... sounds like work to me.
And yet one in 4 Americans volunteers some time on a regular basis to non-profit, charitable causes, more than in other countries:
Similarly, in 1998, Americans were 15 percent more likely to volunteer their time than the Dutch, 21 percent more likely than the Swiss, and 32 percent more likely than the Germans. [and in another article I saw we also volunteer more than the Japanese] These differences are not attributable to demographic characteristics such as education, income, age, sex, or marital status. On the contrary, if we look at two people who are identical in all these ways except that one is European and the other American, the probability is still far lower that the European will volunteer than the American.
https://www.american.com/archive/2008/march-april-magazine-contents/a-nation-of-givers
(1998 is just the data I could find, but our rate of volunteerism has been increasing a lot since then: [url=https://philanthropy.com/article/Volunteerism-Increases-at/65949/?otd=Y2xpY2t0aHJ1Ojo6c293aWRnZXQ6OjpjaGFubmVsOnRvZGF5cy1uZXdzLGFydGljbGU6MjYtb2YtYW1lcmljYW5zLXZvbHVudGVlci1uZXctc3R1ZHktZmluZHM6OjpjaGFubmVsOnZvbHVudGVlcnMsYXJ0aWNsZTp2b2x1bnRlZXJpc20taW5jcmVhc2VzLWF0LWhpZ2hlc3QtcmF0ZS1pbi02LXllYXJz]surge in volunteerism[/url]
tell me again about the lazy Americans?
Thanks Rainbow for the information. No wonder we're tired!
As far as clay soil goes, you might want to find out the history of the lot .
We live on a knoll which is clay to start with, like many of soils around here. As someone said, can get very cloddy.
But can still be gardened.
Years ago right next to our garden was excavated for oil and gas. Lots of digging, bringing up subsoils, covering up top soil with even denser clay.
It had to be thoroughly dry before even walking in it or it turned to concrete!
About 14 or so years ago our son made raised beds for the garden, filled with beautiful soil. Gardening has been a pleasure ever since!
As far as clay soil goes, you might want to find out the history of the lot .
We live on a knoll which is clay to start with, like many of soils around here. As someone said, can get very cloddy.
But can still be gardened.
Years ago right next to our garden was excavated for oil and gas. Lots of digging, bringing up subsoils, covering up top soil with even denser clay.
It had to be thoroughly dry before even walking in it or it turned to concrete!
About 14 or so years ago our son made raised beds for the garden, filled with beautiful soil. Gardening has been a pleasure ever since!
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applestar
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If they are homeschool moms, I have a suggestion for you --
Try proposing that you want to explore different ways of turning clay former cow pasture into good productive garden. Tell them that off hand there are several different till and no-till ideas that have been suggested --
(1) conventional typical method -- tilling material in with a tiller (a tiller is said to leave a hardpan at depth of the tiller by no-till proponents)
(2) using broad fork (or garden fork will work though not as deeply or easily) -- a manual pre-power tool era process and probably closer to typical home garden
(2.5) you might also see if you can rent or borrow a non-power wheel hoe as an in between of (1) and (2). IMHO they look closest to the colonial and pioneer horse-drawn hoes though this is human powered, smaller and less heavy-duty. Possibly from a vender under aegis of (home)school project.
(3) double dug bed -- dug properly, the soil layers and structure are minimally disturbed
(4) no-till sheet mulched/lasagna bed
(6) UNMODIFIED bed where pioneer crops wil be grown to prep the bed for next year -- maybe more than one to test different crops
Now tell them you want to experiment and explore which of these are most effective by creating separately prepared beds and growing exactly the same crops.
BAM! A summer science project right there for their kids. They can research the differet methods, then vote which they think would be best and make up teams to be in charge of each bed.
If they want to get really serious about this project and you can keep animals on this land, you might also consider trying a chicken tractor. I would suggest setting up a sturdy, covered dog kenne/cage (to keep predators OUT) and putting the chicken coop inside. One other more serious permaculture idea is to put some pigs on the land to dig. Goat as weeders and ducks..... You might find some 4-H groups that maybe interested.
(OF COURSE start and maintain compost piles.)
Try proposing that you want to explore different ways of turning clay former cow pasture into good productive garden. Tell them that off hand there are several different till and no-till ideas that have been suggested --
(1) conventional typical method -- tilling material in with a tiller (a tiller is said to leave a hardpan at depth of the tiller by no-till proponents)
(2) using broad fork (or garden fork will work though not as deeply or easily) -- a manual pre-power tool era process and probably closer to typical home garden
(2.5) you might also see if you can rent or borrow a non-power wheel hoe as an in between of (1) and (2). IMHO they look closest to the colonial and pioneer horse-drawn hoes though this is human powered, smaller and less heavy-duty. Possibly from a vender under aegis of (home)school project.
(3) double dug bed -- dug properly, the soil layers and structure are minimally disturbed
(4) no-till sheet mulched/lasagna bed
(6) UNMODIFIED bed where pioneer crops wil be grown to prep the bed for next year -- maybe more than one to test different crops
Now tell them you want to experiment and explore which of these are most effective by creating separately prepared beds and growing exactly the same crops.
BAM! A summer science project right there for their kids. They can research the differet methods, then vote which they think would be best and make up teams to be in charge of each bed.
If they want to get really serious about this project and you can keep animals on this land, you might also consider trying a chicken tractor. I would suggest setting up a sturdy, covered dog kenne/cage (to keep predators OUT) and putting the chicken coop inside. One other more serious permaculture idea is to put some pigs on the land to dig. Goat as weeders and ducks..... You might find some 4-H groups that maybe interested.
(OF COURSE start and maintain compost piles.)
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TheWaterbug
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Sounds like an interesting project.sheeshshe wrote:My friends and I want to do a shared garden. We tilled the lot at this lady's house who has a huge field.
How did you till the field? Do you have regular access to equipment?
What kind of water access do you have, and/or what is the rainfall like?
If you're having trouble recruiting people, then I'd just start small, and with "easy" crops.
If you have a nearby water source and/or regular rainfall, I'd plant a few rows of corn, some tomatoes, and some squashes. Those are so easy that not even I can kill them
. And they don't even require that much soil prep.Plant just enough so that you and your one friend can handle it all if no one else participates.
Then, at harvest time, parade your trophies around and gloat. If anyone asks for a taste, do your best Little Red Hen.
And then next season you'll have more participants.
not sure how they tilled it, they knew someone who did it. it wasn't done well and needs to be done again. we're doing it on friday I hope.
that is exactly it. tomatoes, green beans, and some squash/pumpkins and we're calling it good. I'm not dealing with them... they backed out, and we picked 1/4 of the tilled spot that we're going to mess with, we have it under control and they can just deal with it next year once they see our success
bc we're growing some veggies!!!
they said it was too much work for them to get the soil ready this year. so they'll just wait until next year. I tried convincing them, and they just don't want to put the work into it. fine by me. the 3 of us will have a good time!
that is exactly it. tomatoes, green beans, and some squash/pumpkins and we're calling it good. I'm not dealing with them... they backed out, and we picked 1/4 of the tilled spot that we're going to mess with, we have it under control and they can just deal with it next year once they see our success
bc we're growing some veggies!!!they said it was too much work for them to get the soil ready this year. so they'll just wait until next year. I tried convincing them, and they just don't want to put the work into it. fine by me. the 3 of us will have a good time!
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TheWaterbug
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haha. we were going to do corn originally, and I suppose we still could, but we don't have the resources to amend that whole plot. we could get a lot of corn too with what is tilled thus far. the corn would have to go right in the existing soil, as is... we could try it I suppose and see how it does just for fun. maybe I'll pick up a packet of seeds for kicks
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gixxerific
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TheWaterbug
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I'd do it; you have little to lose by trying. I did very little amending to my corn patch last year, and I got one nice, fat ear for every stalk on 12" spacing and 36" rows. This year I'm planting denser, but fertilizing, and hoping for higher yields.sheeshshe wrote:haha. we were going to do corn originally, and I suppose we still could, but we don't have the resources to amend that whole plot. we could get a lot of corn too with what is tilled thus far. the corn would have to go right in the existing soil, as is... we could try it I suppose and see how it does just for fun. maybe I'll pick up a packet of seeds for kicks
Apologies if this is duplicate info for you, but be sure to plant more, shorter rows rather than fewer, longer rows. A block is better than a hedge for pollination.
I actually went back and edited that post, to remove that paragraph. In retrospect, it probably sounded more negative than I intended.rainbowgardener wrote:I'm not sure what they mean by decline in work ethic... tell me again about the lazy Americans?
However, the PBS documentary I had mentioned was called "Civilization, the West and the Rest". While they may not have it all right [few of us ever do], I found some of the historical perspective they present to be interesting, including their opinion that America is facing increasing competition from other countries because of a general shift (or decline) in work ethic.
I won't argue the statistics you quoted, but I might suggest that the quantity of hours might not necessarily correspond to the quality of hours worked.
Either way, I should have just kept the discussion to gardening... we all know that takes work; enjoyable work for most of us I believe!