Weeds

[jal_ut]

step 1 - stop tilling, tilling brings up dormant weed seeds. some weeds can stay dormant for a long time. yellow star thistle seeds are known to germinate after 20+ years in the soil.

Perhaps, but consider this. When plants produce seed, it usually either falls to the ground or it flies away in the wind. Sometimes it is carried by critters or birds, but in any case it is destined to fall to the surface of the earth, where it will germinatre when the conditions are right.

There is many times more seed on the surface than down deeper where a tiller may leave it. If left deep, it will not germinate. Yes, some seed will last a long time buried, but many types will not make it through one season if buried.

I like to till my garden. It chops up all garden remains and weeds and incorporates the organic matter into the soil where the microbes quickly reduce it to plant nutrients. It introduces oxygen into the soil for the microbes and speeds the process of decomposition. It loosens the soil so the roots of new seedlings can easily penetrate the soil.

If you want to use a tiller to help with the weed problem, till, then wait until the area turns green with sprouted weed seed, then till again, but shallow. This kills the sprouted weeds without bringing up many dormant seeds from down below. You can now plant your garden without getting so many weeds.

Yes, you will get some weeds. The thing to do is take the hoe to them while they are still very small. It is a simple matter to hoe a small garden while the plants and weeds are still small, and especially if the soil has been loosened with a tiller.

I have a pretty large garden. It is not practical to mulch it all, so I plant rows wide enough that I can take the tiller between the rows when the plants are small and get those small weeds. This tilling is shallow, maybe an inch is all. I then hoe between plants in the row. Some places I have to hand pull the weeds.

One thing you need to know about mulches, a mulch is food and hiding places for snails and slugs. Mulches are also sometimes loaded with weed seeds. Depending on where you get the mulching materials, you may also introduce new varieties of weeds into your garden with the mulch. This is a very real possibility if you get hay or straw from a farmer.

It is not my intent to start a till or no till war, but want you to just consider these ideas, then try something. You will after a time develop a gardening method that works well for you.

[DeborahL]

Yep-filling my flower beds with decorative bark chips was like putting up a welcome slugs sign.

[soil]

first off jal there are many many ways to go about organic farming, my post was my suggestion and my opinion, but...

There is many times more seed on the surface than down deeper where a tiller may leave it. If left deep, it will not germinate. Yes, some seed will last a long time buried, but many types will not make it through one season if buried.

so if there are tons of seeds on the surface, and you till them in. that's fine, I understand they wont germinate at lower depths. when you run your tiller over that soil again though, you bring up some to the surface along with what comes from outside inputs. which given the right situation will give more weed growth. I'm not really one to go out and spend hour(s) picking/pulling/tilling weeds. id rather be picking food.

I like to till my garden. It chops up all garden remains and weeds and incorporates the organic matter into the soil where the microbes quickly reduce it to plant nutrients. It introduces oxygen into the soil for the microbes and speeds the process of decomposition. It loosens the soil so the roots of new seedlings can easily penetrate the soil.

the practice of no till also promotes aeration and better soil porosity in a different way. through mostly the actions of earthworms and other macro organisms in the soil/mulch horizon. the bacteria and fungi will eventually produce a "glue" that will form soil aggregates, increasing the oxygen, water and root penetration further by creating air pockets in the soil along with the worm channels.

One thing you need to know about mulches, a mulch is food and hiding places for snails and slugs. Mulches are also sometimes loaded with weed seeds. Depending on where you get the mulching materials, you may also introduce new varieties of weeds into your garden with the mulch. This is a very real possibility if you get hay or straw from a farmer.

very true, source is everything. going out and getting a ton of grass that has just went to seed is not very smart. plants, leaves and weeds that have not gone to seed are great sources of organic mulch matter, they decompose block the soil surface to prevent further germination, most of the nutrition goes to the plant and soil organisms and the rest into stable humus further increasing soil fertility. straw isnt the best source of mulch, for one its only one material, one material can have only so much nutritional diversity in it. a diversity of mulch materials will yield a much healthier soil system.

no hard feelings jal

also not everything should be mulched, if plants will grow close and thick enough, a living mulch is far better to shade the soil and prevent weeds.

[jal_ut]

first off jal there are many many ways to go about organic farming, my post was my suggestion and my opinion, but...

Indeed. Very True. Add to that: every plot is different. Both in soil and in the micro-climate. What works for me may not work for you. That is why I said:

consider these ideas, then try something. You will after a time develop a gardening method that works well for you.

Many of us have had enough gardening experience to have arrived at a pretty good gardening method that works well for us. It is great to see so many willing to share what they have learned to help newcomers with their problems. Nor do I claim to have all the answers, I am still learning too. It is a lifetime study.

[DoubleDogFarm]

I'll just add, If you rototill at the same depth year after year,you could create hardpan. Every couple years you should run a chisel plow and rip it deep.


Eric

[gershon]

I till my garden several times before planting. Probably more than needed, but I enjoy it. I till one last time just before planting.

Then I do something real anal, but it works. I put a popsicle stick by every seed. They are about $3.00 a thousand at Hobby Lobby. And I plant in perfectly straight rows.

The reason I am this anal is because then I know exactly where to hoe before the seedlings come up.

Each day, I go over the surface quickly with a scuffle hoe. You can see a picture of one here: https://inmykitchengarden.blogspot.com/2006/06/I-cant-live-without_30.html

It's also a pretty good writeup on how much someone likes theirs.

If the weeds get a bit of a start or if the soil is wet, the scuffle hoe no longer works well, so I use a triangular Rogue hoe. I use the model 60S you can see here: https://roguehoe.com/scufflehoes/scufflehoes.html

They glide just under the surface of the soil and cut off the roots of the weeds.

It takes about 10 minutes to do 1,000 sq. feet of garden with these. And there is seldom a weed to be seen.

There are a couple other benefits. I find a lot of organic matter drifts in with the wind. Most of it is pretty small, but after hoeing each day, I find the soil improves a lot.

By breaking up the top layer of soil, it gets rid of the capillary action that draws moisture to the top. Although the top appears VERY dry, just an inch or so down where the roots are, it stays moist. Since the top layer is dry, the weeds can't germinate well.

It gets easier as the vegetables get bigger as not many weeds grow in the shade under them.

[mansgirl]

MG, you could use the papers, but I'd be careful about using any magazines. The newspapers made are printed on with soy-based inks, but I'm not sure what is used with some of the magazines. Hmmm, shredded may not work, since they may blow around. It'd probably be best to keep them flat and just weigh them down with dirt.

Oh, and I do agree that pulling weeds can be relaxing....well, sometimes .

Yeah.. by the end of July it can just be exasperating. Thats usually when I start to let mine go. Once my plants are big enough to fend for themselves, I stop pulling and just go through with a hoe occasionally. Thank goodness the fire pit is close to the garden! : ) Can you tell I've never tried anything for weed control other than weeding? ; )

Sometimes I think too that the weeds are a good distraction for the bugs. There's something that grows in our garden every year that the bugs just love, I think they can have them and stay of my veggies!

I like the duck idea.. and especially the beer cap idea! I might have to invent one that holds those little miniature bottles of wine. ; )

[mansgirl]

I'll just add, If you rototill at the same depth year after year,you could create hardpan. Every couple years you should run a chisel plow and rip it deep.


Eric

Never thought of that.. Thanks! : )