tedln
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Stella,

I've seen, smelled, and heard the culture in Tijuana, Juarez, and Matamoros. I love the colors, the sounds, and the flavors. The only reason I stay away now is the sound of gunfire disturbs me unless I am pulling the trigger. If you hear the shot, it is to late to duck.

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I didn't read to far into all of these threads, so bear with me if I'm repeating anything. : )

I grew up on a turkey farm and we used turkey manure in our garden every year. But turkey poo, like chiken poo or any poultry poo, is extremely high in nitrogen. For the garden I have now, which is maybe 15 x 60 I fill up a 3 gallon bucket only half way with the turkey goods, sprinkle it around, till it in on the first till, and let it sit a week or two until the second till. You can actually burn a plant by exposing it to too much turkey poo, not sure if the same is true for chicken poo, but I do know a little of either goes a long ways!
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Mansgirl,

I think you are right. But you can carry the thought a little farther to any kind of fresh "poo". Cow poo, horse poo, pig poo will probably do the same thing if it isn't composted first. Have you ever used your turkey poo to grow peppers? If so, how well did it perform with peppers. This thread started discussing the reason shesasshee's jalapenos are not producing well. It has moved all over the map as we discussed different things so your comment fits perfectly. It would really be interesting to know how well turkey poo and jalapenos work together.

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I use turkey poo on my entire garden. I can post pictures tomorrow. Everything seems to love it, but its not turkey poo fresh out of the barn. Its sits on a "poop pad" (an asphalt surface) in a huge pile all winter long waiting for spring sale. We keep piling poo on top, but if you grab from the bottom of the pile its pretty well composted. I sprinkle that lightly over my entire garden, till it in, let it sit for a week or two, till again and plant.
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It sounds good, but is asphalt the best surface for breaking down the turkey poo? :?:

How many do you have? My favorite herb lady has a turkey strutting around her herb stand along with chickens and geese. They're BIG! :shock:

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OK, the Big Jim ARE chili peppers....got it.

I had to back through and re-read some pages to see that the conversation shifted at some point from giant jalapenos to chilis :oop:.

That's what I get for skimming :lol:.
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garden5 wrote:OK, the Big Jim ARE chili peppers....got it.

I had to back through and re-read some pages to see that the conversation shifted at some point from giant jalapenos to chilis :oop:.

That's what I get for skimming :lol:.
:D You didn't miss anything. The subject is kinda slippery. Just at the moment I think I have a good grasp on it, it changes. I certainly don't believe I've caused any of the misdirection. :shock:

When the conversation went to "Big Jim", I thought we were still talking about Jalapenos also. I did a lot of searching for those "Big Jim" jalapenos and could only come up with the Anaheim type chiles. I did find one web site that described the "Big Jim" and had a photo of normal jalapenos next to the description. When you went further on the page it had photos of the Anaheim type pepper named "Numex Big Jim". I added to the confusion.

I guess at this point, we can discuss, Big Jim, Jalapenos, or turkey poo.

We still haven't solved shesashee's problem but since she just had her wisdom teeth pulled, she shouldn't be eating hot salsa anyhow.

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mansgirl wrote:I use turkey poo on my entire garden. I can post pictures tomorrow. Everything seems to love it, but its not turkey poo fresh out of the barn. Its sits on a "poop pad" (an asphalt surface) in a huge pile all winter long waiting for spring sale. We keep piling poo on top, but if you grab from the bottom of the pile its pretty well composted. I sprinkle that lightly over my entire garden, till it in, let it sit for a week or two, till again and plant.
Let me know when your gonna have that spring sale for turkey poo. I will surely be there.

I also don't grab turkey poo. I use a shovel. On a serious note though, is the turkey poo a mixture of maybe sawdust and poo or is it the straight poo? (what was that question to determine if someone is telling the whole truth? "Are you giving me the straight poop?")

:D :D :D

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OMGosh, Ted... cracking me up here LOL!


I'll tell you what I do here.... I use chicken poo and it is mixed with the pine shavings so it isn't straight poo. and I use a shovel :lol: I do deep litter method where I only clean out the coop once per year so it is pretty well composted already. most of it anyways. then I dumped it into a pile to sit for a couple more months. that is when I top dressed it onto my plants. THe jalepeno's weren't really doing anything so I thought maybe they needed some manure. I mean some were a lot bigger than the others so I know that I put the poo on the smnaller ones I just can't recall if I put it on the larger ones. 2 large 4 small. just the larger ones made the 2 peppers :roll: `1`

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OMGosh, Ted... cracking me up here LOL!


I'll tell you what I do here.... I use chicken poo and it is mixed with the pine shavings so it isn't straight poo. and I use a shovel :lol: I do deep litter method where I only clean out the coop once per year so it is pretty well composted already. most of it anyways. then I dumped it into a pile to sit for a couple more months. that is when I top dressed it onto my plants. THe jalepeno's weren't really doing anything so I thought maybe they needed some manure. I mean some were a lot bigger than the others so I know that I put the poo on the smnaller ones I just can't recall if I put it on the larger ones. 2 large 4 small. just the larger ones made the 2 peppers :roll: `1`

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tedln wrote: We still haven't solved shesashee's problem but since she just had her wisdom teeth pulled, she shouldn't be eating hot salsa anyhow.

Ted
I love your sense of humor. This one wiped me out.

Hey, guys, anyone want to talk about the Great Gurney's Hybrid Big Chile II Debacle? I've been wanting to start a thread about this, to ask if anyone knew what happened to this 9" hot pepper similar to the Big Jim's, but I knew the thread would fall like a lead balloon if no one knew anything about this pepper. However, in this happening thread, even I can't kill the conversation 8)

What do you say, Sheeshshe? Can I digress? The Big Chile II is kind of like a Jalapeno, well, a green silly-putty Jalapeno that got stuck in a car door :lol:

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Stella that comment cracked me up too :) Oh I can eat the salsa, I just can't eat the chips and that is what I want. not sure how long till I have to stop this boring food anyways. I wish to eat chips and salsa!

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sheeshshe wrote:OMGosh, Ted... cracking me up here LOL!


I'll tell you what I do here.... I use chicken poo and it is mixed with the pine shavings so it isn't straight poo. and I use a shovel :lol: I do deep litter method where I only clean out the coop once per year so it is pretty well composted already. most of it anyways. then I dumped it into a pile to sit for a couple more months. that is when I top dressed it onto my plants. THe jalepeno's weren't really doing anything so I thought maybe they needed some manure. I mean some were a lot bigger than the others so I know that I put the poo on the smnaller ones I just can't recall if I put it on the larger ones. 2 large 4 small. just the larger ones made the 2 peppers :roll: `1`
AHA! Perhaps after all these pages we've finally figured out just what's wrong with She's peppers :lol:.

Pine shavings! Maybe all the pine shaving caused some N-lockup in the soil, thus affecting the plants :idea:. Or, maybe I'm just making a desperate attempt at pulling this thread back on topic :lol:.

Any thoughts on my theory?
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yeah, but with horses they use the pine shavings too and people use that in the garden right?

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I bought a six cubic yard dump truck load of the horse poo/sawdust compost last fall. It had supposedly composted for a year. I was expecting great things from it. I put it in every bed. When I realized last fall, my fall/winter plantings were starving for nitrogen, I had to start adding other stuff to the beds to save my plants. I probably should have dug the stuff out of every bed but didn't. I just kept adding other composts. It affected my garden this summer because I had such a hard time getting nitrogen to my plants without the sawdust depleting it. I have been adding a lot of topsoil to the beds to simply dilute the sawdust and they seem to be recovering and the sawdust seems to be decaying away slowly. I still have a couple of yards of the sawdust/manure compost left in a pile. It has now composted for two years. I test it occasionally by germinating some seed in it and it seems to be slowly converting to real compost. The primary problem with it is the fact that when it is piled, it is almost impossible for moisture to penetrate the pile and really start the composting process in the center. It repels moisture like someone sprayed the whole pile with Scotchguard. The very center of the smaller pile is still as dry as the day it was delivered.

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Stella,

Educate me a little. What is the Guerneys debacle?

Okay, I looked at the Guerneys web page about the original and new Big Chile and Big Chile II peppers. Is it possible the Guerney seed is bulk purchased Numex Big Jim and Numex Heritage Big Jim seed?

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I can throw it around as well, has anyone grown or been wanting to grow the Chilli Willy Pepper?

Anyways, I have noticed my jalapeno seems to have stopped growing, the peppers are maybe 2 to 2.5" long, maybe 3/4" wide and they have been like this for a while, one looks like its is actually changing colour to a lighter green :? The plant is quite small itself, maybe a 14 to 18" tall, about 25 peppers on it, but all very very small. Maybe I am just used to seeing the bigger supermarket varieties.

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intersting!!! mine doens't repel water when I dump water on it. I tried to keep it wet to compost faster :) it doesn't look like pine shavings so who knows!

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I kept wondering why I felt so uncomfortable talking about turkey "poo" and horse "poo". I finally decided it must be because it reminded me of little kids saying "mommy, I need to go poo poo". It simply makes me feel so juvenile.

I guess I will settle in between feeling juvenile and uttering obscenities and simply call it manure or maybe natures gold.

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tedln wrote:Stella,

Educate me a little. What is the Guerneys debacle?

Okay, I looked at the Guerneys web page about the original and new Big Chile and Big Chile II peppers. Is it possible the Guerney seed is bulk purchased Numex Big Jim and Numex Heritage Big Jim seed?

Ted
I seriously hoped someone would jump in, writing, "Oh, my. I remember that. What a silly mistake that was!" No one has, so all I have is a slew of facts that deduce a silly mistake. I am fascinated by this pepper, and I haven't even tasted it yet!

First, you're probably aware that Gurney's almost shut its doors about 10 years ago and that a bunch of past customers stepped in and purchased it as a cooperative (I think) concern. I had bought my seeds all my life from Gurney's, living 50 miles from Yankton, SD. I took a five-year break from gardening. When I came back, now living in Wyoming, about 10 years ago, I naturally bought my first seeds from Gurney's.

I bought too many packets, as is usually the case. One of those packets was the Gurney's Hybrid Big Chile II. I suspect this pepper, sold in 1999 by only Gurney's and Johnny's Select Seeds, was supposed to be the answer to CPI's Nu-Mex Big Jim. It was (is) a 9" long hot pepper with supposedly terrific flavor.

This spring, I started 48 pepper seedlings, including my Nu-Mex Big Jim's. The dogs wrecked 'em, killing over half of them and, in the process, mixing up their organization so I didn't know what I had left. I had only five Nu-Mex seeds left, and I couldn't take a chance on using them all up. I dug through my seeds for a likely substitute and found my Hybrid Big Chile II seeds.

A month late, I started five of them. That's when the oddness began. Two of them grew a weed. It was a long, skinny twig of a plant with an occasional leaf stuck on in no particular order. Okay, I thought. They're old seeds.

I set out the remaining three on June 16. It wasn't long before they surpassed the Nu-Mex's, set out June 1, in height and mass. They were slow to produce, but they are now in full production, and the biggest peppers are longer than the Nu-Mex's. The plant itself is spectacular. I haven't seen a pepper plant like these since I grew Poblanos. They're now three feet tall, after only ten weeks outside.

I liked what I was seeing. I decided to buy some new seeds, thanks to the weird germination problems I'd had in mine, as in a weed growing instead of a pepper. That's when things started getting weird. You can't find these seeds. Gurney's has replaced these with another pepper. They make an apologia of sorts in the blurb describing the new pepper, something about the new one being more productive and more resistant to the sun.

Even more interesting, I've found a comment on the replacement that decried the loss of the Hybrid Big Chile II. Gardeners liked them, saying they had the best flavor of any pepper they'd ever grown.

So, here's what I think, based on the foregoing: Gurney's new owners, anxious to restore it to its past glory, pushed a pepper onto the market before it was ready, a pepper that was supposed to take the shine out of the Nu-Mex Big Jim, but instead proved an embarrassment. When complaints came in, they were quick to pull the pepper and replace it with another pepper, one that had no such aspirations to greatness.

And that, unless someone wants to clear up the mystery, is the Great Gurney's Hybrid Big Chile II Debacle, a tale of desperation, ambition, and what may have been a truly extraordinary pepper, given different circumstances :(
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Interesting.. sounds like I want some of these seeds :) ... I think i can manage a 16th pepper for next season... I have a small anaheim I bought at a farm market, it has taken onn lots of growth since potting up, and has 1 pepper on it at least 6 inches and still growing.

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Stella,

You gonna save seed from your monster hybrid?

I read an article today that claimed most "supposed and advertised" hybrids are in fact OP. The article claims it is in the financial best interest of seed producers to convince customers plants are hybrid and will not breed true. For the seed producers, it is much less expensive to grow and produce OP varieties because they do not normally require hand pollination and simply sell them as hybrid.

The article continued by claiming even true hybrid plants will probably breed true 90% of the time in the F1 generation.

I have also found that when companies come out with a new and improved version of anything that was widely accepted and used, it is usually because the original supplier of the original product could no longer provide the product. It then becomes necessary to find a replacement which is advertised as "New and Improved".

I don't have the web page for the article, but I found it on the Knapp Seed web site.

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I am definitely going to save seeds from this fellow. Well, if the weather cooperates, that is, and I have no reason to think it won't. I have been studying the information provided in the seed savers forum; so far I haven't seen anything on saving pepper seed. It makes sense that I should let it become ripe, bright red, before I pick it. Or do I wait until it is over mature? If anyone knows, please let me know.

Based on the plant itself, I wouldn't be surprised if the next generation pepper reveals some Poblano characteristics. I haven't grown all the hot peppers, but I've grown a few, it being my favorite veggie to grow, and if I hadn't known what I'd planted, I would have said Poblano before it began to bear fruit.

csvd87 and anyone who wants seeds, you are welcome to them. Before this plant surprised and pleased me, I had already decided to experiment with seed saving. This one just got added to my list of seeds I would play with. I have to confess, though, that I've never done it before :oops:
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Stella, I'd love to try growing this pepper too. It sounds like a winner for the shorter growing season gardeners!

If my jalapeño seed saving experience is any indication, seeds from red peppers simply removed and dried will work. I sowed the biggest seeds and they had 100% germination rate.

I f you have the room, you might consider pruning one of them by about 1/3, digging it up, potting it up and bring it in to overwinter in the warmest sunniest (or supplemented light) area of your house.

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applestar wrote:Stella, I'd love to try growing this pepper too. It sounds like a winner for the shorter growing season gardeners!

If my jalapeño seed saving experience is any indication, seeds from red peppers simply removed and dried will work. I sowed the biggest seeds and they had 100% germination rate.

I f you have the room, you might consider pruning one of them by about 1/3, digging it up, potting it up and bring it in to overwinter in the warmest sunniest (or supplemented light) area of your house.
I'm not certain about the short season bennie. They are also maturing like my Poblanos did. They put on a few peppers, just to dip their toes into the water, worked on refining those, decided they liked the climate, and only then began working on producing the big crop. I remember how frustrated I was with those Poblanos! When they did produce, though, they did so prolifically. That year, we had a late fall, and I was picking them by the bucketful in September! However, I'm not certain how these fellows would fare in anything less than 120 days for a growing season.

I might try your idea of bringing one inside. I did that one year with Habaneros, and it didn't work, but I didn't have my grow light then. It might be worth another shot, just for fun.

Hey, what do you think about that weed two of the seeds produced? Could it have been because they were old seeds or because, as I suspect, they just weren't genetically stable?
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OK, I got lost somewhere in here about all the big jim talk. so is the numex big jim in fact the jalepeno or the anaheim?

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Apps, why do you say to prune the plant by 1/3 before you pot it and bring it in? I'm thinking about doing just this with my chili pepper plant.

Stella, I think the weeds are not from the seeds you planted. Rather, the seeds may not have germinated and the weeds did.
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sheeshshe wrote:OK, I got lost somewhere in here about all the big jim talk. so is the numex big jim in fact the jalepeno or the anaheim?
It's an Anaheim type. You can eat them, but not with tostado chips. :D

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No matter how big a rootball you manage to dig, you'll be cutting off a large portion of its roots, so you need to prune the amount of foliage the reduced root mass will support.

Also, remember that you don't want straight garden soil in containers -- not well draining enough, so you're going to be knocking/loosening off a lot of that soil entangled in the rootball, significantly disturbing the roots. It takes a while for the plant to recover from all that "transplant shock.". I like to feed with liquid kelp and AACT. As you know, I 'll be keeping any earthworms I find in the root mass, and if I don't find any, I'll add at least one... More likely at least two for a container this size. :wink:

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garden5 wrote: Stella, I think the weeds are not from the seeds you planted. Rather, the seeds may not have germinated and the weeds did.
Good thought, Garden5. However, I have to disagree. It wasn't a weed seed, not in sterilized starter mix and not sprouting exactly where the seeds had been planted and not technically identifiable as any Wyoming weed. In fact, I suspect no one has ever seen this weed before, as it was only a "weed" in the sense that it was undesirable :lol:
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sheeshshe wrote:OK, I got lost somewhere in here about all the big jim talk. so is the numex big jim in fact the jalepeno or the anaheim?
Sorry about digressing again, Sheeshshe! How are the jalapenos faring? I really think everyone is on to something with the chicken dung and its accompanying excess of nitrogen. Have you tried cutting back on their water, making them work a bit to survive?
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applestar wrote: As you know, I 'll be keeping any earthworms I find in the root mass, and if I don't find any, I'll add at least one... More likely at least two for a container this size. :wink:
I accidentally left at least one earthworm when I brought the Habaneros in that year. I was fostering some animal shelter kittens at the time, and I saw them playing with something in the hallway. It was a fat old earthworm. Whoops. I must have over-watered :roll:
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Well, then it looks like you got some rouge seeds in with your peppers. Did all the seeds look alike?

Apps, what kind of potting medium are you keeping you vegetables in? Will it be store-bought or homemade.
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garden5 wrote:Well, then it looks like you got some rouge seeds in with your peppers. Did all the seeds look alike?
Well, no -wall- that is of course possible but highly improbable, especially given the appearance of the seeds. I've never seen a young annual with a skinny brown twig for a stem, but I have seen young saplings that looked like that. I very likely got a plant experiment gone wrong. In fact, I find my thoughts leaning toward GMO.
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OK, so tell me the correct one that I want to purchase next year so I can switch it on my list :lol:

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sheeshshe wrote:OK, so tell me the correct one that I want to purchase next year so I can switch it on my list :lol:
I think, if you like Jalapenos and make lots of salsa, you should go with those Jalapenos Gigante Ted mentioned a while back. You can get those at Burpee.com. They are on my list :D
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excellent, thank you! what I had this year was a burpee but I don't remember what type and I don't want to get it out of my freezer since its packed with salsa and squash everything will come crashing out LOL!

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Well, just to confuse you a little bit more, the named variety I'm growing is "Jalapeno M" which came in my souvenir of Arizona multi-seed hot pepper packet, and it's very productive although the size is ordinary. It's a bit more blunt-ended than the 2nd generation Jalapeno from a plant I bought from my favorite herb lady last year.

But if you're looking for big peppers, these are not it. :wink:

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really it doesn't make too much of a difference to me on the size I don't think.... as long as I get more than 2.. :roll: Oh big woop!!! I have another one growing now... so I may just end up with 3 if frost doesnt kill it first HAHA

last year I got a wopping 1... and it wasn't even spicy. picked too soon I suppose.

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did your plants have lots of flowers? and possibly fall off. or just no blooms at all. sorry i don't want to read the whole thread.
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