Does anyone grow Heirloom or Heritage Vegetables?
Does anyone grow Heirloom or Heritage Vegetables?
I grow several dozen different varieties of heirloom tomatoes, and am growing some heirlom mellons and squash this year. Most modern hybrids are bred for shipping, shelf life, and consistent yields under a wide range of conditions for market growers. That leaves the older varieties the were bred mainly for for flavor and productivity by and for people who actually ate what they grew. A very large proportion of 'heirloom' tomatoes are modern inventions, but they were invented for flavor, and to be grown by home gardeners.
I'm trying an heirloom tomato (or so I thought - question following) - Manitoba. In my effort to avoid hybrids, I tried to order only open-pollinated seeds or this one heirloom, but now I have a question. I just looked at my catalog, and the Manitoba is listed as an heirloom and open-pollinated, but at the end it has F1, V?? The catalog lists hybrid varieties as F1, but puts that at the beginning. Is the Manitoba an heirloom that got it's start as a hybrid? Forgive my ignorance! 
Is Manitoba a hybrid? Definitely NO (...and maybe yes)
There are biological (interspecies) hybrids and then there are horticultural (intraspecies) hybrids. Manitoba is not a horticultural hybrid, but may be a biological hybrid. Horticultural hybrids are the first generation offspring (only) from crossing two different varieties. Saving seed from a hybrid tomato will NOT give you more hybrid tomatoes. Manitoba is a stable open pollinated variety, but it may be a 'biological' hybrid in that it may have another species in its ancestry.
The domestic tomato, Solanum lycopersicum, generally is not resistant to much, but several of its wild relatives are (different species). The currant tomato, Solanum pimpinellifolium, was commonly crossed with domestic tomatoes to get those resistances (generally at agricultural universities), but that was many generations before the final variety made it to public release. So the V and F resistances might mean that Manitoba could be called a biological hybrid. You and I could be considered horticultural hybrids (mom and dad were genetically different).
For tomatoes, anything that is open pollinated (not a hybrid) is automatically called an heirloom by seed venders. A large proportion are old commercial varieties developed by/for agribusiness. Most Russian heirlooms in the American market (especially the black tomatoes) fall into this catagory because under the Soviet system the people were (generally) not allowed to grow gardens for personal use (so I have been told).
I think that mellons and squash produce male and female flowers seperately so bees have to cross pollinate flowers for fruit to grow, so yes, you would have to take a paint brush out and diddle the flowers and then bag them to get 100% true seed if you were growing different varieties in the same area. I'm going to plant mine at different ends of the property with 100 feet of tomato plants in between so that the probability of a bee getting from one kind of squash, mellon, or cucumber to the other without making many stops at other plants would be very low. Separting by distance is meaningless if there is not alot of different pollen in between for the bees to dilute themselves with. Honey bees will fly from apple tree to apple tree on our property and the trees are more than 200 feet apart.
There are biological (interspecies) hybrids and then there are horticultural (intraspecies) hybrids. Manitoba is not a horticultural hybrid, but may be a biological hybrid. Horticultural hybrids are the first generation offspring (only) from crossing two different varieties. Saving seed from a hybrid tomato will NOT give you more hybrid tomatoes. Manitoba is a stable open pollinated variety, but it may be a 'biological' hybrid in that it may have another species in its ancestry.
The domestic tomato, Solanum lycopersicum, generally is not resistant to much, but several of its wild relatives are (different species). The currant tomato, Solanum pimpinellifolium, was commonly crossed with domestic tomatoes to get those resistances (generally at agricultural universities), but that was many generations before the final variety made it to public release. So the V and F resistances might mean that Manitoba could be called a biological hybrid. You and I could be considered horticultural hybrids (mom and dad were genetically different).
For tomatoes, anything that is open pollinated (not a hybrid) is automatically called an heirloom by seed venders. A large proportion are old commercial varieties developed by/for agribusiness. Most Russian heirlooms in the American market (especially the black tomatoes) fall into this catagory because under the Soviet system the people were (generally) not allowed to grow gardens for personal use (so I have been told).
I think that mellons and squash produce male and female flowers seperately so bees have to cross pollinate flowers for fruit to grow, so yes, you would have to take a paint brush out and diddle the flowers and then bag them to get 100% true seed if you were growing different varieties in the same area. I'm going to plant mine at different ends of the property with 100 feet of tomato plants in between so that the probability of a bee getting from one kind of squash, mellon, or cucumber to the other without making many stops at other plants would be very low. Separting by distance is meaningless if there is not alot of different pollen in between for the bees to dilute themselves with. Honey bees will fly from apple tree to apple tree on our property and the trees are more than 200 feet apart.