Help with mosaic virus

[Brand D NATURALS]

This is my first year gardening, and I have had my share of difficulties with bugs and disease. I have what I bellieve is mosaic virus on just about everything in my entire garden. It started with my cucumbers and spread to the melon patch, pole beans and now field peas. The pole beans seem to have been affected the most, with only a handful of beans on the vines. My concern is for subsequent crops. Like I said, this virus has spread throughout my entire planting area, including my raised beds, so leaving these areas unplanted is not an option. I have discarded all diseased plant materials and mulch. I am planning to use beneficial nematodes to get the insects under control also. Besides choosing resistant varieties of seeds for future plantings is there anything else I can do to prevent another epidemic?

[rainbowgardener]

How do you know what you have is mosaic virus? I have never seen it; can you post some pictures? Instructions for that are linked in my signature line.

Mosaic viruses are usually pretty specific. There's a tobacco mosaic virus that commonly affects tomatoes and peppers (as well as tobacco), a cucumber mosaic virus that affects all the cucurbitae (cukes, zukes, etc).

If you are right about that, it is very bad news. As with people, there are no cures for plant viruses. It sounds like you are doing everything you should. The key for control is sanitation, discarding all affected materials, keep your garden weed free (especially perennial weeds that can carry the virus over from one year to the next). Use row cover and insecticidal soaps to keep things like aphids in check and as you noted, use resistant varieties of seeds. Avoid working in the garden during damp conditions (viruses are easily spread when plants are wet)

So sorry to hear you've had such a hard time. I saw your previous posts about stinkbugs and aphids. It sounds like you are working on gardening organically, for which I congratulate you. If I had to guess, I would guess that the area/ plot you are working, has been the subject of chemical gardening in the past, with use of pesticides, herbicides, synthetic fertilizers, etc (perhaps by previous owners). What can happen in the transition from that to organic gardening, is that all the pests and diseases come roaring back and there are no bio controls left for them. Sometimes people give up at that point and think organic gardening doesn't work, not understanding that what they are seeing is the result of the years of chemicals and that things will get better, once some balance is restored.

While you are dealing with each individual problem, it helps to try to keep some big picture focus. What you are trying for is a healthy eco-system, which will ultimately become more self-sustaining with a lot less input from you! The basis of this is healthy soil, with lots of compost and organic matter, very high diversity of plants in your garden as a whole and in each bed, presence of birds, lizards, toads, beneficial insects, other predators, mulch and deep watering. When this is working, the plants will be able to fend for themselves a lot better.

[applestar]

I had similar concerns though only in a limited part of the garden: https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=143455

One possibility is to restrict yourself to planting crops that don't get the disease, although, believe me I went through the list and it's is a very small selection.

I think number one priority is to get your soil as healthy as possible, with all the living microorganisms and build up the biological natural immunity. Healthy soil grows healthy plants and healthy plants, just like people, can resist viral infection.

Have you read the thread on our last [url=https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=43]book club reading of Teaming with Microbes?[/url]

[Brand D NATURALS]

Thanks for the suggestions. You are right, I am not positive that mosaic virus is my problem. That is pretty much the conclusion I drew after extensive hours online looking at pictures of different plant diseases and bug damage and reading as much as possible about them. I will try and post a picture later today of the plants I have left that are affected. Maybe, if I am lucky, I am wrong and it is something much more benign.

I am gardening organically, and had hoped to grow enough for sale to a few individuals who have expressed interest in local organic produce next spring. At this rate, I won't have much success with that. Not giving up though.

The land I am using has been in burmuda grass pasture for at least the last 15 years with no chemicals or fertilizer. The soil has a very heavy clay content and does need tons more organic matter to be added for optimal growing conditions. I have had a shortage of compost due to my entire compost pile having to be discarded because of contamination from herbicides used on the hay we bought for our horses. Yet another disaster story. I am attempting to rebuild my compost pile and have started a vermicompost bin to help supply some of the organic matter I need.

[Brand D NATURALS]

Here are some pictures of some of the plants left in my garden. Mosaic virus or something else?
[url]https://s895.photobucket.com/albums/ac152/lisapstuckey/[/url]

[sheeshshe]

I'll be closely following this thread since a lot of my stuff looks exactly like yours and I can't figure out what is wrong with the pole beans and others...

[The Helpful Gardener]

Nope not virus...

I am thinking you have locked the nutrients somehow; unfinished compost, hardwood mulching, something, but everthing looks slightly nitrogen deficient and some more than others. Some have had some secondary attacks probably based on weakened states, but I am thinking that is your biggest issue.

Fish hydrolysate, my friend. I like [url=https://www.neptunesharvest.com/]Neptune's Harvest[/url]myself. A great way to organically get a pretty significant shot of nitrogen in a readily soluable form onto your plants. A foliar feed and soil drenching; it will help with all of the above. ASAP. Stat. All those other TV words they use on medical shows...

HG

[Brand D NATURALS]

Thanks Scott for the info. I will head into town in the morning to purchase your recommendation. You could very well be right. I planted right after removing the bermuda grass and really didn't do much ammending of the soil beforehand.

It would be wonderful if that is my problem and not mosaic virus. Of course I had envisioned the worst case scenerio. If a little nitrogen will remedy the situation, I will be soooo happy.

[The Helpful Gardener]

This feeds not just the plants but the soil, and as that gets healthy it feeds plants itself. I love using fish, but not too heavy; the smell can make you unpopular... better a little a lot of times than the other way around...

HG

[sheeshshe]

would you mind me posting in this thread some pictures of mine? I would like your opinion as well.

[Brand D NATURALS]

Of course, post your pictures. I would like to see them also. We are all here to learn to grow.

[The Helpful Gardener]

If it is okay with BD it is ok with me...

HG

[sheeshshe]

thanks so much! now that the baby is napping I can go and snag some pictures BBIAB

[sheeshshe]

OK, here are a few pictures of my cucumber plants and green beans.

[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/PicturesbyLindsey102.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/PicturesbyLindsey106.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/PicturesbyLindsey103.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey105.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey104.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey101.jpg[/img]



[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/PicturesbyLindsey107.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey109.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey108.jpg[/img]

[rainbowgardener]

Have to say, sheeshshe, for all you've written about all the problems in your garden, your pictures don't look so bad.... Organic gardeners learn to accept that not every leaf in your garden is going to look perfect. It doesn't mean that anything is wrong.

So there's a few holes in leaves, suggesting there's a few bugs around. OK, that's kind of how things are. Plants can sustain considerably more damage than that and keep right on producing.

The picture in there that I would worry about the most is the next to bottom one, bean leaves, I think. The yellowed leaves, with green veins, looks chlorotic, which is a nutrient deficiency. Here's a paragraph about that:

Chlorosis is a yellowing of leaf tissue due to a lack of chlorophyll. Possible causes of chlorosis include poor drainage, damaged roots, compacted roots, high alkalinity, and nutrient deficiencies in the plant. Nutrient deficiencies may occur because there is an insufficient amount in the soil or because the nutrients are unavailable due to a high pH (alkaline soil). Or the nutrients may not be absorbed due to injured roots or poor root growth. https://urbanext.illinois.edu/focus/chlorosis.cfm

Have you checked your soil pH? You could have iron deficiency or nitrogen deficiency or other mineral deficiencies and any of those could be because the nutrients aren't there or because if your soil is very alkaline (or VERY acid), it can lock up the nutrients, making them unavailable to the plants. So I would start by finding out how acid/alkaline your soil is and working to bring it into balance. Then I would add lots of organic matter to add nutrients in an available fashion.

[sheeshshe]

well the reason why its not going to pot is because I'm being proactive I think. The cucumbers looked WAY worse than that a couple of weeks ago here are some pictures: (the color was not very green)

[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey085.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey083.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd229/sheeshshe/gardening/PicturesbyLindsey084.jpg[/img]

pictures don't really do them justice because I can't get my camera to focus on it very well. heneyways.... I guess the biggest issue I was having was the early blight on the tomatoes and the scab on the squash and the borers on the pumpkins. but whatever is going on with the beans is creeping up the the bush. and the problem with the cucumbers is that they aren't really producing all that much. with 20 something cucumbers plants you'd think I'd pick more than 2 cucumbers per day or every other day, ya know?

[sheeshshe]

I also wanted to mention about the soil pH. I have acidic soil here so I put a bunch of compost and lime this year because I get blossom end rot many times with my tomatoes until I add lime. so I added a handful of lime when I planted stuff. I don't think I added it where the beans were, BUT... I never do and they always do fine. I usually have a ton of green beans. I put compost and lime where I put the cucumbers.

[The Helpful Gardener]

I think there are a number of mineral deficiencies I am seeing there...

The yellow spots and holes in the leaves in that one image are classic manganese deficiency...

And the crisping around the edge of a yellowing leaf is often potassium shortages...

I would topdress with organic matter (compost) for the manganese and wood ash for the potassium. Some of the yellowing and distortion could be magnesium (low in most soils I see) and a tablespoon per gallon in the next watering would help there... I am mguessing based on photos; a soil test can help, but few are geared to organic gardening and they often tell you you are all set when the weak acid reactions in organic gardening are often insufficient to release all the nutrients they find in a stron acid test like the Melich III test most labs use. Adding some more seems a good idea here IMO...


RBG's take on soil deficiencies from high pH is exactly right and dovetails with my thinking above; this could also be a causal agent and you should look into it. Again, that soil test might not be perfect in informing us, but it sure is better than nothing...

HG
HG

[sheeshshe]

huh! this is interesting.

manganese.... well I thought we had a lot in our water, but perhaps it isn't the same as it being in the soil. I had put chicken poo on the cucumbers after these second set of pictures and the result is the first set of pictures that I posted. But why am I not getting loads of cucumbers? is it becuase they're stressed?

do you really think my pH is too high now? I didn't add much lime and I know my soil is very acid. I have wild blueberries growing everywhere in my yard. also, my water pH is 5.2 and every time I water I'm adding acid to the soil. hence the needing of the lime that I put.

where do I get the manganese etc?

[The Helpful Gardener]

Manganese should not be added; the compost should add enough, hence the suggestion. Any decaying material should have plenty. Our water in CT tends toward high levels of manganese as well, but if your Cation Exchange Capacity (CEC is the measure of what nutrition a soil can hold) isn't great and you have used it up in the soil, all the water in the world won't help. Compost will also increase CEC...

HG

[sheeshshe]

but I topdressed with the chiccken manure. do I need a different pe or somethingy