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Gnome
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Ethical collecting.

Recently the subject of collecting trees from the wild has come up on the forum and perhaps now, with spring approaching, would be a good time to consider our practices in more detail. Firstly I would like those of you who do collect to consider what it is that you hope to gain by collecting trees from nature. In my opinion the real advantage of collecting trees lies in the potential of collecting trees of superior quality. If you are willing to settle for younger trees of limited character please consider purchasing them from a nursery or even starting your own from cuttings or seeds.

Please remember that permission is always required to remove any trees from any property that you do not own. It is important we portray an image of responsibility in our actions. And consider this; would any of you look kindly upon having your property rights infringed upon?

The following text is excerpted from a longer article and is used with the kind permission of the author, Will Heath.



COLLECTING FROM THE WILD

All those who collect plants for bonsai should observe the ethical considerations of collecting because the manner in which we collect affects the perception of collectors worldwide. Unethical collecting can give a bad name to bonsaists everywhere and can make it very difficult for others to acquire permission to collect in the future. The following are some considerations that I personally abide by.

Always obtain permission from the landowner before you collect. Every single piece of land belongs to someone, be it a roadside, construction lot, field, woods, abandoned house, or farm.

Collecting anything that you do not own and/or do not have permission to is stealing.

Never take the only tree of its kind in the area.

Never collect a tree that you are not sure has a very good chance of survival. Experience can tell if a tree can be successfully collected or not.

Only collect what you will use.

Always fill in your holes and remove any and all signs that you were there.

Do not leave your garbage behind and always pack out other garbage that you may find. The key here is to leave the site better than you found it.

Tread lightly when in the wild, avoid stepping on or damaging the native flora while collecting and leave no sign of your passing. Do not "blaze trails" at anytime, if you can not find your way in and out with a compass or a GPS, you have no business being there.

I also pack in small seedlings of the species that I will collecting and plant one or two in the spot that I removed the tree from. Not only will this replace the tree I took, but it will assure that there are trees to collect in the future as well.

A word of warning. Spring is the time when many animals bear young and it is not uncommon to see fawns or other new born wildlife while walking, leave them be, they need nothing from you and any attention given will help no one and in the case of bear cubs, could cost you your life. I collect in bear country often and there is only one thing to do when you see cubs, walk in the opposite direction and pray.

Here is another excellent resource for aspiring collectors. Make sure to follow the links to pages two and three.
https://www.bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATcollectring%20trees%20from%20the%20wild%20W%20Pall.htm

Norm
Last edited by Gnome on Mon Sep 29, 2008 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rjj
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Nice addition to the stickies. Thanks Will and Norm.

randy

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tarian
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not starting no debates or anything but I do not have the contact details for the land owner of the site whitch I have collected (stolen) but from now on I will try my best and sorry for any inconvenience

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Tarian,
from now on I will try my best and sorry for any inconvenience
There has been no inconvenience, we are all here to learn something from each other. This sticky was not aimed exclusively at you. Sandman had recently posted a question about collecting and it seemed a good time to address the issue. I'm glad that you may be seeing things in a different light. I'm not sure how things work in your area but there must be some kind of records regarding land ownership. Perhaps an older neighbor can help in this regard.


Norm

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tarian
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thanks

cahl
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and it's even worse in Australia, funnel webs, snakes, angry emus...just a pity that most of our speices don't lend themselves easily to bonsaiing.

gnome80
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Very helpfull Post (even with humor).

I think I'll stick to seeds for now, not many trees in Holland that will fair well when treated as Bonsai's

Good thing too as we don't have bears, but angry Cows ;)



Correction:
The last bear part is very funny and I would like to thank the author for making my day and giving me permenant smile ;)

thnx

DragonsBlood
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your collecting bonsai link did not send me anywhere. lol

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The link has been fixed. [url=https://www.knowledgeofbonsai.org/collecting/basics.php]Here's the article[/url].

Thanks!
:)

Striferitus
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gnome80 wrote:Good thing too as we don't have bears, but angry Cows ;)
ha west nile took care of all of those pesky birds in missouri

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Wow, very surprised to find this sticky here on "Ethical Collecting" from the wild at The Helpful Gardener.
I also pack in small seedlings of the species that I will collecting and plant one or two in the spot that I removed the tree from. Not only will this replace the tree I took, but it will assure that there are trees to collect in the future as well.
I strongly disagree with this practice although I believe the author's heart was in the right place. Not good to introduce a non-native genotype to any natural area right about now without even mentioning the risk of an accidental introduction of a pest or pathogen that could be present but undetected in the "replacement" tree. There are other issues with wild collecting that were somewhat touched upon by the author of 'Collecting Trees from the Wild Part One' linked in the first post.

Must reserve comment on the photo of the mesh laundry bag full of sphagnum moss that was evidently "ethically" collected being displayed at the Knowledge of Bonsai Forums.

memorykeeper
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What would give you the idea that trees we collect from the wild are not superior. Have you ever been to Mississippi?

TheLorax
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What would give you the idea that trees we collect from the wild are not superior. Have you ever been to Mississippi?
I'm afraid you've lost me on this idea you believe I have but I find it interesting there's more than one of you out there collecting from the wilds for personal collections or were you speaking on behalf of the entire bonsai community of collectors?

Yes, I've been to your state. You have many wondrous indigenous North American species but please know many are barely eeking out an existence as a result of factors out of our control. I don't believe there to exist such a thing as ethical collecting by anyone without an educational need to so who has been properly trained. It's an oxymoron. Given all we've learned in the recent past, there's really no rational reason other than to save a buck for bonsai enthusiasts to be out there harvesting from the wilds. So many of these plants are in cultivation and readily available. Even the scientific community wouldn't dream of taking a plant for an herbarium specimen or collecting seed if there weren't at least 100 specimens documented as being present in a given plant community yet it would appear it's a-ok in the bonsai community to do so if there is more than one present if all other underlying issues were addressed? I'm in the camp that taking "just one" more can and has made a difference in the past. Think of the butterfly effect. I've provided a link for those interested in the event one is unfamiliar with the Ray Bradbury book in which the far-reaching ripple effect on subsequent events by one butterfly has its origin-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butterfly_effect

If future generations are to remember us with gratitude rather than contempt, we must leave them something more than the miracles of our technology. We must leave them a glimpse of the world as it was in the beginning, not just after we got through with it.â€

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memorykeeper,
What would give you the idea that trees we collect from the wild are not superior. Have you ever been to Mississippi?
I do not follow this either. If by chance you are referring to this:
In my opinion the real advantage of collecting trees lies in the potential of collecting trees of superior quality.
please realize that this thread was started over 1 1/2 years ago.


TheLorax,
I strongly disagree with this practice although I believe the author's heart was in the right place. Not good to introduce a non-native genotype to any natural area right about now without even mentioning the risk of an accidental introduction of a pest or pathogen that could be present but undetected in the "replacement" tree.
I agree that it would be better to refrain from introducing any foreign material, far better to allow nature to recolonize a disturbed area.
I don't believe there to exist such a thing as ethical collecting by anyone without an educational need to so who has been properly trained. It's an oxymoron.
I understand that is your position and I respect it but not everyone feels the same, furthermore not all collecting practices are equal. Collecting can be done in the urban landscape, for instance. Many fine old specimens are destroyed routinely when older homes are renovated or removed. I often suggest that enthusiasts look to the urban landscape for potential bonsai material. Abandoned pastures can yield good material and I am currently courting a Scots Pine that is growing in an abandoned gravel parking lot. There is an area of woods near my home that was logged out years ago and they smashed many trees that to them were worthless. I would have no reservations about collecting one such tree when the owner and the loggers had such little regard for the resource.
Walter Pall writes:

Man, with his machines and animals is the best generator of raw material for bonsai. The best trees are found especially along roadways or even in towns. Fantastic specimens can be found in places where for decades a hedge has been pruned, where someone has pruned away the trees in the garden, where many years ago livestock passed through the thicket, nibbling on it, where someone for several decades has kept small trees in pots or in a cemetery where a shrub was kept small.
Given all we've learned in the recent past, there's really no rational reason other than to save a buck for bonsai enthusiasts to be out there harvesting from the wilds.
Sorry but this is a complete misunderstanding of the practice of collecting. Regardless of where the material is found, be it the wild or your neighbors garden, the whole point of collecting is to obtain a superior specimen as I clearly stated in the opening post of this thread. I don't look for average, readily available material because I am too cheap to purchase such. I look for material of superior character that is difficult, if not impossible, to obtain from conventional sources. A discriminating collector does much more looking than actual collecting and their impact on nature is minimal.
Even the scientific community wouldn't dream of taking a plant for an herbarium specimen or collecting seed if there weren't at least 100 specimens documented as being present in a given plant community yet it would appear it's a-ok in the bonsai community to do so if there is more than one present if all other underlying issues were addressed?
This is an unfair generalization on a subject that you admittedly are unfamiliar. Yes I know what Will wrote in his article and it was an unfortunate choice of words but I doubt he would collect one of only a few individuals. Even if he would it is not right to paint the whole bonsai community with such a broad brush.


Norm

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