Inoculating leaf piles with forest decomposers?

[vermontkingdom]

Has anyone out there used a handful or two of forest leaf litter to inoculate their new leaf piles for leaf mold? While walking the dog today I decided to grab a soil litter sample from both the oak tree area and sugar maple tree area. I have many bags of each kind of leaf and mixed them together and placed them in several large wire pens. Over the years I assume those forest areas must have developed some efficient specific mutualistic fungal relationships with each type of leaf. A handful of the soil litter from those areas should contain enormous number of spores and would, I assume, be a very effective inoculant. Yes????

[rot]

..

I guess I'm just unclear on the concept of inoculation for composting purposes.

Bacteria and spores are just all over the place from the get go. The stuff is on your skin and in every orifice on your body.

The compost bin is just a place made for such things to grow. Build it and they won't come because they're already there. What they will do if you build it right is grow rather rapidly. If we construct things with the right amount of food, water, air and a little shelter the bacteria and fungus just grows and consumes what's there to eat.

In this example, the leaves are within walking distance from the pile. If you leave the windows open, the same spores in that leaf litter have been carried on the wind and into the house through the open windows. All the grass clippings, raked up leaves, twigs and so on are exposed to the same things. The difference between the house and the bin is that the house turns out to be less hospitable to rapid growth of bacteria and fungi than the bin. Well maybe not my brother-in-law's house but that's another matter.

I do not bother inoculating any compost. I'll pee in it and it makes it's own sauce maybe but I certainly won't buy anything nor will I go out of my way to add anything special.

Build it and they will grow. Or is there something I'm missing?

To sense

..

[vermontkingdom]

rot,
Sorry I wasn't clear about my question. I already have a large hot composting set up (4x8x5) and have done so for years. Into it I put all our kitchen scraps, horse mature, chopped leaves, hay, chipped twigs, grass cuttings, garden weeds, pulverized bones that survive their wood stove experience, etc. The low tonight is expected to be 20 degrees (F) but, even in cold Vermont at this time of the year, when I turned the pile yesterday, its temperature was about 135 degrees.

My question deals only with producing pure leaf mold and doing so without any other organic ingredients added to the piles. I would like to produce a lot more pure leaf mold quicker since I already have plently of balanced compost available.

Has anyone signifcantly increased the rate of leaf mold production by purposely inoculating their new leaf piles via small forest litter samples obtaind from old climax forests?

[rainbowgardener]

Nope.... but it does sound like an interesting idea. If you read the thread "I've Got Leaves" lots of us have been collecting piles and piles of leaves. I think someone(s) should try the experiment. Innoculate one pile of leaves and leaf one alone (sorry, I couldn't resist ) and see if by some reasonable period time at least 6 months from now, you can tell the difference.

I do take rot's point that innoculating isn't strictly necessary. You can make sourdough starter without any starter, by just letting the ingredients sit out uncovered on the counter at room temperature for long enough. However, to keep the analogy going, we do use and treasure good sourdough starters that get passed down through generations and shared from one person to the next. So it does make a difference to have a concentration of just the right specialized organisms.

[gixxerific]

I hope that it helps vermontkingdom. I have brought home a couple truckloads of leaves from the woods. A good majority of it was in deep piles in all it's lovely goodness. Half composted and more. I'm hoping that this will give my pile a jump start. I'm going back this weekend to get at least another truckload. I'm gonna dig deep this time and get all that old litter, there is a ton of it.

[rot]

..

So, you go out into the woods and you find a clump of leaves with leaf mold just falling off of it and you carry it home and put it into your leaf mold pile to kick start the leaf pile you've got there.

If your leaf pile is already in the optimal set up for growing leaf mold, what have you gained? A day? The mold is already on your leaves and it's just waiting for the right conditions to grow and reproduce like mad. Introducing more mold isn't going to change that.

If your leaf pile is just plain wrong for growing leaf mold, then you've just killed off a bunch of that mold you just brought home. What have you gained?

If your leaf pile is somewhere in between super optimal and just awful, how much have you gained? Some of that mold you carried home probably died in the trip. Bacteria and mold grow at exponential rates any way. If you only brought home a handful it's concentrated when what you really want and need is mold growing over the expanse of your leaf pile. Again what have you gained? A concentrated pocket of growth that will soon outstrip its food or water or air?

I think there is more to be gained by making sure your leaf mold pile, like a compost pile, is set up to support the leaf mold you expect to grow just as a compost pile is set up to support the growth of bacteria among other things.

Unless all your leaves got boiled in water, I see no point in inoculating with what's already present.

To sense

..

[stella1751]

Has anyone out there used a handful or two of forest leaf litter to inoculate their new leaf piles for leaf mold? While walking the dog today I decided to grab a soil litter sample from both the oak tree area and sugar maple tree area. I have many bags of each kind of leaf and mixed them together and placed them in several large wire pens. Over the years I assume those forest areas must have developed some efficient specific mutualistic fungal relationships with each type of leaf. A handful of the soil litter from those areas should contain enormous number of spores and would, I assume, be a very effective inoculant. Yes????

VermontKingdom, I think it's great to experiment like this! It might work; it might not. You won't know unless you try Let us know if you see a big difference

To [munifi]cence

[gixxerific]

post withdrawn