vermicomposting

[top_dollar_bread]

thanks for the comment fetida_freida

the worms are doing great, I kept one of my bins outdoors this winter and there still moving around, not eating as much but still very alive and I'm thinking ther breeding more. lots of cocoons...

toil
nice worm bag, ive seen one before but its nice to see some one else is enjoying it

ive been messing around with bedding and food a lot lately, trying to learn what my worms enjoy most and how to make better casting.
I like the shredded paper, fall leaves/leaf mold bedding drenched or fermented in plant extracts, worm leachate and or ACT
and a diversity of weed green mulch, kitchen scraps, forest or cowboys natural char smashed to a dust, river sand/silt & coffee grounds for worm food
the worms eat it up fast and the end product is amazing, ill post images soon on how I go about this..its easier then it sounds

[The Helpful Gardener]

Hey Freida

Try canteloupe; they freak...

TDB, I can't wait to hear; an interesting recipe that I am still thinking on; lots of carbon (I see how they do flock to paper) and with the studying I've been seeing I think the weed greens may be truly inspired. Good stuff. Keep us posted.

HG

[gixxerific]

the worms are doing great, I kept one of my bins outdoors this winter and there still moving around, not eating as much but still very alive and I'm thinking their breeding more. lots of cocoons...

Could that be because they are like plants in that they see their doom coming (due to environmental conditions) so they produce seed to carry on the lineage?

[wolfie]

ok so after reading this post, I think I want to give it a try. somebody chime in and let me know if I am on the right track here...

I take a rubber maid plastic tote thing with lid.
drill a bunch of holes in the sides on all 4 sides to allow air in
layer shredded newspaper, cardboard, coffee grounds, leaves and some veggie scraps
head to the bait shop and find some red crawlers and put em in

cover lightly with a damp cloth close the lid and let em work their magic

is that correct? am I missing something?

Thanks!

[The Helpful Gardener]

Red wigglers (Eisenia foetida) are the worm...

You ask for crawlers you will likely get nightcrawlers (Lumbricus terrestris) which won't live in a bin at all. The right worm makes all the difference...

Do you hav another container to put you drilled bin inside? Early starts can be bumpy and mass escapes from less tha accepetable conditions are not uncommon. And if you are keeping it moist enough there can be liquor run-off (good stuff for plants). But another outer container is a good idea.

But you have the basics

HG

[wolfie]

thanks for the clarification. Nope not another bin to put it in, unless I get a smaller bin as the start and then put some blocks in the bigger bin and set the smaller bin on them then the run off can go that way... does that make better sense to do it that way? I guess I can start small and always grow if need be... better to do it right the first time

[Toil]

layer shredded newspaper, cardboard, coffee grounds, leaves and some veggie scraps

can you elaborate? what you wrote sounds like a recipe for a sour bin. At first, fill it with bedding and only bury a bit of food.

[wolfie]

arent the layers I listed the bedding?

[Toil]

yes I just want to be sure you are not layering with veggie scraps as well. I was pretty sure you aren't, but since I made a similar mistake... Just do bedding at first, and as the population grows you can feed more. It's exponential, so if you start with twice as much it does make a big difference.

[wolfie]

alrighty, will see what I can put together over the next week and keep ya posted, thanks!

[The Helpful Gardener]

I like the revised plan, and toil's caution on starting them slow is a good one. I have found potato peels in smallish quantity to be a good starter food. and a slice of mellon, rind up, is always a good way to get everyone in the mood for love once everyone settles in. But slowly...

HG

[seagullplayer]

I was in wally world this week picking up some stuff and looked for a bag of peat, they didn't have any in yet.

I planned to use peat moss and news paper for my bedding?

Then get my red worms at a bait shop?

[The Helpful Gardener]

Everyone seems stoked about the bait shop; I am not really sure about whether the specific red wiggler (Eisenia foetida) is a bait shop item, but if that genus and species is, you should be good to go. Anyone out there using bait shop bought worms?

HG

[applestar]

seagullplayer, look for a brick/block of compressed coir. That's what came with my Can-o-Worms bin. I heard compressed coir is also available in pet shops as reptile bedding. Better than peat.

[Toil]

bait shops often have wigglers. they are great bait because they wiggle around. There is a fly called "san juan worm" that mimics this action. Especially where banks are steep, fish will be looking for them. Bait shop worms will all be full grown adults though, whereas worms sold for vermiculture are by the pound and include cocoons, juveniles, and adults.

You can order live worms, OR, you can order a whole lotta cocoons for the same price.

If I had to start over, I would go with cocoons. I'll take a thousand juveniles over a hundred adults.

[Ozark Lady]

After a fishing trip one hot summer day. We got home with worms left over. These were just containers of fishing worms... probably red worms.
We usually fished alot, so I wanted to keep the worms alive for next time.
I dumped the containers into a can similar to a coffee can, with a plastic lid, then, I added peelings of whatever was available to it.
I stuck the can under my kitchen sink. And forgot about it.
About a month later, I found the can... I thought oh yuck.
I opened it and it was fine, the worms had ate the peels and were doing great.
Since fall was approaching and we were not going to be fishing for awhile, I just took them outside and dumped them into the garden. I think those worms were pretty happy to not be fish bait after all.
But, this exerience shows that they can survive some pretty severe handling. I didn't give them anything really... some peels, and I forgot about them.
I wonder if worms like leaves or if they compact down too tightly for them?
And could wild garden worms survive in a bin?

[Toil]

if you put out some wet cardboard, the red ones you get will do just fine.

They are tough little buggers. I feed mine pickled food scraps. Really sour scraps. They love it.

If you give them banana peels, freeze them first.

[top_dollar_bread]

in my experience coir isnt too much better then peat for bedding. both work very well but peat seems 2 decompose faster, fall leaves and or leaf mold are way better. especially if you run it over w/ a lawn mover before using as bedding.
also if using coir I think it be best to rinse the heck out of it, I got me some coir that claimed to be rinsed and I had problems with seedlings. don't know if it will effect worms but I think its best to rinse it. doesnt take to much extra work

also if using garden worms or knightcrawlers (fish worms) its best to use a bin that is exposed to soil. that way the worms can move about more and if you feed the bin, they will stick around.
A bedding of fall leaves and or leaf mold and shredded news paper is what my worms seem to like the most. I moisten the bedding with ACT from finish ewc or LB (lacto bacilli)

this exerience shows that they can survive some pretty severe handling

very true, we recently had lots and lots of rain here and I got really sick and forgot I had a small bin of worms out side with no drain holes. well once the rain stopped I went out ther to check the worms and the bin was over flooded with water. I had about 20 or more worms escape but ther were actual worms under the water, still alive and moving???
especially lots of babies, they were tiny pink and white. I'm guessing all those cocoons decided to hatch.
well I drained the excess water and apologized to my worms with fresh grounds but I still cant believe I didnt loose them. I didnt even find a dead worm and I searched.

[Toil]

I've found coir to be superior for using a bin as waste disposal (less work), but inferior for making worm castings (less volume, bits of coco).

[Jackielyn]

I just ordered some worms from Uncle Jim's and will be heading out to find some rubbermaid bins to start our worm farm! I got the book "Worms eat my garbage" by Mary Applhof I read through this whole thing and I'm excited to put what I've learned so far into practice I can post pics of our worm bin once we get started

[charlie@vt]

Thanks top_dollar_bread for the informitive post. This could be another winter time indoor project along with sprouting & herbs.
We have to keep thoes finger nails dirty you know!

[Ozark Lady]

I think that I almost understand what a worm bin needs.

I have the bowl full of worms that I just dug out of the compost piles at the barn. As I went through it removing sticks and rocks, I just tossed the worms into a bowl with a bit of the original dirt. I probably have close to a hundred and a few round balls that look something like the pics posted here as cocoons. I hope that is what they are.

We really need a sticky on how to do a worm bin. Both for city folks and another one for country folks. Muddy boots seems to have a method that might work for me. With using fresh manures, and stuff.

Even after spending alot of time reading, I don't totally get, why should I raise worms in a bin? I can go to the barn and get worms, or just turn on the garden hose anywhere and soon they will pop up to get away from the water. I feed household scraps to the animals, their poop feeds the worms, I clean the barn or henhouse, and they are so far ahead of me, that I get finished compost full of worms, not raw manure. So why keep a bin? What is it that they do, that I can improve on? I am seriously just considering putting the worms back where I found them in the first place.

I understand if you are in town and have no worms in your barn, but how does having a bin help me? I can get dirt full of them at will.

[Toil]

A bin is useless and redundant in your case I would say.

[rainbowgardener]

The idea of the worm bin isn't for growing worms; it's for turning kitchen scraps into earthworm castings (ewc) , which are a very rich soil amendment. But I don't do a worm bin either, just use my compost, which I figure must have some ewc in it, since it's got so many worms.

[The Helpful Gardener]

Well that makes three of us; I was scooping up handfuls of castings out of the paths and throwing them back on the beds last year, and the beds were just crawling. Pull a weed and four worms popped their heads out of the hole...

Toil on the other hand is reclaiming urban soil and needs all the help he can get; worm bin makes sense in that setting...

HG

[Toil]

I actually put sustainable waste disposal first, and the castings are not a big part of the garden. I do put some on the raised beds at home, but at the big garden we just use city compost for now (yes, I know, I can't be sure it isn't toxic, but it's just reality and I trust those veggies before market veggies). Just the veggies is 75 x 75 feet and has had just a couple active members until this season (we hope), and the most I could hope to do is brew tea to cover that. Alas, we have no electricity out there, just water.

But if I had chickens I would probably not own a bin. Or maybe one as a pet, but not a bin, a stack of smaller bins, and a worm bin bag.

Or with your kinda space I might think about a very very large worm operation. I don't know, I would be so giddy if I had your space, I would be immobilized. I would not know what to do.

[applestar]

Alas, we have no electricity out there

What about solar or wind generated electricity?
My neighbors across the street just had 20 solar panels installed on their roof. They've accomplished what I've been wanting to do for years now.

A mutual friend told me that the husband was at a sustainable energy conference through his work recently, but I haven't talked to him/them yet. I'm waiting for the green color to subside from my skin.

[Toil]

We don't even have membership fees.

Zero budget, just assets.

[Ozark Lady]

So, you have a community garden? Memberships, budgets, no electricity etc. is why I am asking.

Sounds like a lemonade stand to offer cool drinks, might get some money in a kiddy for projects there.

[Toil]

It's a very young community garden, yes. Nice chunk of property with decent sun/shelter compromise, and we have a fence around the veggie area and water that the land trust provides.

With the right people and methods I can see it supplementing significantly the diets of quite a few families. On top of the veggies we have fruit trees started, raspberies, and strawberries struggling to get a hold.

So far we have no individual plots but that is hard to keep that going as it grows.

[yardfarmer]

Great thread, and I am glad that I found this site. One thing that I do is use a two part system whereby I first partially break down my kitchen scraps via hot composting. I mix the kitchen scraps in with other yard waste and this speeds up the process, and that way I don't get the extra heat and bugs when adding straight from the kitchen to the worm bin.

Here is a wooden compost bin that I built from fence cut offs..
[img]https://www.ecoyardfarming.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/wormbintop2.jpg[/img]

I have had really good success with this system and it has yielded me many pounds of castings. Here is how I built this worm bin.
[url=https://www.ecoyardfarming.com/wormcompost/diy-stackable-worm-composter]Wooden worm bin[/url]