nickolas
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Plants that grow in full shade?

I need a list of edible plants that grow in full shade.

The summers here can get very hot, I have set aside an area so I can make a 1000 square feet courtyard, and this courtyard will have at least 50 large leaf deciduous trees planted in and around it, I am going to have an Aquaponic system in this courtyard so the constant flow of water can also help cool down the shaded courtyard even more.
I am doing all of this so I can have a nice cool place to sleep on those hot summer nights.
I am also going to make other larger courtyards that have plenty of sunlight to grow my food so don't worry.

I would be a lot easer for me to just put a water fountain in the shaded courtyard but keeping with Permaculture why do it one way when you can do it a different way and also get food out of it.

So far the only plant I have on my list is Japanese wasabi, it thrives in 80% shade.

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hendi_alex
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You say 1000 square feet. That is only 100 by 100. The space would hold three large oaks trees at most. A grown oak tree will span at least 40-50 feet.

Most greens, green beans, even raspberries will grow if the space at least gets morning or afternoon sun. Full shade all day long is quite a challenge.

nickolas
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3-4 trees in the courtyard sounds about right, the rest will be planted around the courtyard to form a dence shade area, I have decided to put the courtyard in the middle of a 12 acre forest.

this link will give a bit more of a back ground story into my 12 acre forest.
https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/vi ... 7&p=279375

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rainbowgardener
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What an amazing project! There are lots of nice wildflowers and tropical plants that will grow in shade. Growing food there is a lot harder and the denser the shade the more challenging. Things you can try include all the cool weather crops - peas, lettuce, other greens including mesclun and arugula, chard, spinach, broccoli, and also mint, lemon balm, chives, scallions.

Incidentally 100 x 100 would be 10,000 sq feet. If you really meant 1000, that is only 100 x 10 or more or less 30 x 30.

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hendi_alex
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Thanks, brain fart occurred! I even did a double take as something didn't look right, but shrugged it off and kept typing.

So just over a 30 foot square. That represents a nice area to construct a court yard in the midst of the trees. It sounds like allowing sunlight would be counter productive to the point of constructing the space. If the entire area will be under a canopy, with no direct sunlight at all, then the idea of growing food plants may be unrealistic. It is a challenge to find flowing plants for dense shade areas. Probably the best bet is to select from the pretty decent range of dense shade foliage plants that would do well, even thrive in such a location.

Early on, when the trees have not spread and open sun to filtered light reaches the spot, then edible plants such as those described in previous posts will do pretty well. If you have large trees outside the area, and limit trees inside the courtyard to smaller growing varieties such as dog wood and other under growth kinds of trees, then you may be able to keep enough filtered light coming in to sustain the permaculture arrangement that you envision.

My guess is that this space will evolve over time, as plantings are made, and trees mature. So what you can grow initially will be far different from what will grow as the trees and shrubs in the area mature.

imafan26
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Sounds like a neat idea. How long does it take for the trees to mature? Unless you are carving this space from an established forest it will take years for the trees to create this shady courtyard.

Could you create the shade using arbors instead or until your trees mature? Vines would spread faster over an arbor and can be trimmed to allow in more light. I grew a squash vine on an arbor over my tile block patio. It was only a 10x10 space, but it did provide a shady spot in summer. The downside was that the bees frequented the vine in the early morning and evenings and ants liked the vine too. The trellis was made from tent poles, but it was too light to carry the weight of the vines and started bending. Chain link fence poles and conduit tubing made a stronger trellis.

nickolas
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Thanks for the replies guys, also I can grow veggies in late autumn, winter and early spring when all of the leaves are off the trees. Where I am frosts are light to none existent so that’s a plus for growing in winter.

until the trees form a canopy I will use shade cloth over the courtyard, but that will be more for the plants wellbeing than mine, because the suns UV is so strong here that when plant tags say to plant in full sun they can really only planted in part sun.
That’s why my other larger courtyards will also have shade cloth permanently over the yard on wires, so I can slide the shade cloth out over the beds on those hot days we get here in Australia.

I am guessing the trees will start to form a canopy 20 years after I plant them, the site will need to be cleared of thick scrub (wattles), and the ground ripped with a tractor before I can start planting.
So it’s going to be at least 2 years away before I can start as I have got a lot of work to do.
I am 18 so I am starting at the right time, if all goes well I will be in my forties by the time the trees form a good canopy.

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applestar
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Fiddlehead (Ostrich) ferns
mushrooms

...any natural understory trees and shrubs? Sounds like what I know may be different from what grows there.
-- thinking something like huckleberries

If you are GROWING the in-court trees, why not grow food bearing trees? Are you also planting/growing the surrounding trees? They can also be food bearers.

imafan26
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Shade cloth is a good alternative to provide sun blocking. It is not the usual permaculture solution but will work until the trees grow in. As long as you are in it for the long haul.

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applestar
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Hmmm... I wonder what a permaculture solution would be...?

I'm guessing the long-range design might *simulate* natural progression of de- and re-forestation and not assume immediate planting of shade preferred edible plantings.

The planted trees would include short lived pioneer and N-fixer forbes, shrubs, and understory trees, vines, etc. But to help with the plant list for tht, we would need the estimated plan for th their timelines.

imafan26
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I think the true permaculture solution would be to plant natives that are more tolerant of the climate naturally. Permaculture would take into account what would naturally thrive in the environment and take advantage of that. It is always better to work with mother nature than against it.

While waiting for the Oaks to grow to create the environment you desire it pays to assess and take advantage of opportunities you have right now.

Victoria, Australia is in a temperate region. With the main planting season starting in May. Most of the Mediterranean plants would be happy here including many herbs which won't need that much protection from the sun.

Trees native to Australia that will probably do well will be Macadamia nut, Dawson's plum, Bay leaves (not much shade but good wind break), citrus trees, figs, and bunya nut. Some of these will probably grow faster than oaks and give shade in half the time. If you really want the oaks, then let these trees grow awhile when the oaks are small and gradually thin them as the oaks fill in.

Moringa oleifera (Marungay) grows fast the leaves and pods are edible. It is native to India but grows pretty much wild in tropical regions. It would provide shade in a couple of years. I have never really seen this tree in it's natural form. It is always being hacked for its leaves.

Warrigal greens, long beans, winged beans, jicama, yams, cassava, pawpaw, pigeon peas, are fruits and vegetables that could be planted now, even in the sun because they are native to tropical areas near the equator and could probably survive without additional protection. NZ spinach for sure would take off.


I do grow some of my cool season crops in the summer under the shade of my citrus trees. I do grow red lettuce and loose leaf lettuces more in the summer and romaine and bib in the rainy season. Iceberg lettuce would not do well anytime of the year. While I don't have a hammock, I do have a little table set nestled between my citrus trees on the west and east and my neighbor's 25 foot tall ladyfinger bananas so it does provide a nice cool shady spot to rest during the day.

The other vegetables can be planted in the appropriate season

//www.gardenate.com/zones/Australia%2B-%2Btemperate

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prettygurl
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