Justgettingstarted
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Help with stunted plants

Hello all!
New to the forum and the world of gardening!

Live in zone 7 in eastern WA, and have planted my second garden.

Went a little overboard and have four raised beds, 6x3 ft. But already two of them are really struggling .

The worst is a bed of melons and squash plants. The honey nut squashes continue losing mature leaves, gaining a few new ones, and staying the same height. It’s been about two weeks

There’s an Armenian cucumber too that’s quite sad.

Our soil is a 3 way mix from the local nursery, and I’ve been trying to avoid over watering them, doing it only when the soil stops being able to hold a ball shape. I’ve given a little sugar water thinking it could be transplant stress. But that’s the only intervention so far

Would so appreciate any feedback!
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TomatoNut95
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What is the temperature there? Have you had any cold nights? Have you fertilized them enough or maybe too much? Those leaves look burned or diseased. What kind of soil are you using? Some cheap store-bought soils don't have much nutritional value and still needs to be amended.

By the way, welcome to the forum. :D

Justgettingstarted
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Hi! Thanks for your reply and welcome. :)
I am using a 3 way: 1/3 aged fir fine bark, organic compost and topsoil/dirt

We’ve had a few hot ones recently, nighttime temps keeping around 50 at coolest. A few days to a high of 90, but the problem was happening before those, with highs of 75 or 80.The raised bed in question gets at least 12 hrs of sun, thanks to being so far north. Or no thanks to, don’t know

Thanks for your help!
Last edited by Justgettingstarted on Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Justgettingstarted
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Also, I haven’t added any fertilizer at any point, and I thought I should add that a summer squash plant in there is thriving with just one yellowish brownish leaf

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TomatoNut95
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Then I may I suggest some fertilize. Yellowing leaves are a sign of hunger. A water soluble kind like Miracle Gro would deliver the quickest results. When I use it on a sickly plant j usually see greener results within a week.

Topsoil hardly has any nutritional value If at all. Amending your soil prior to planting is a big help. I gave my veggies a nice sprinkle of Espoma in their holes before I planted them.

imafan26
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Your 3 way mix is an organic mix. If you are intending to go only with organics, you are probably nitrogen deficient. The plants are uniformly yellow so it is hard to tell if the problem is with water or nitrogen. Organic mixes are usually nitrogen poor, especially when it comes to heavy feeders and young seedlings. Nitrogen deficiency shows up as stunted growth and yellowing leaves with the lower leaves yellowing first.
Phosphorus is usually not deficient in compost. The soil may also be fungal rich especially if the compost was not completely finished yet. Unfinished compost will suck up nitrogen. Weak plants are more susceptible to pests and disease.

Plant growth is limited by nutrient availability. Nitrogen is a limiting factor of growth since it is needed in relatively large quantities at specific times.

Seedlings will require more nitrogen than slow release organic fertilizer can sometimes provide. Especially if this is a new garden and not an established one. If you continue to want to do organic. You should be supplementing with fish emulsion weekly while plants are actively growing. If it doesn't matter. I would have added a starter fertilizer with slow nitrogen that has a guaranteed analysis and a steady release rate.

Compost holds a lot of water and the best test to tell if your plants need water is to stick your finger in the soil and feel how moist it is at the level of the roots, around 3-4 inches down. Such young plants can be drowned by overly wet soil. You should try to keep the soil evenly moist around seedlings but the soil should be just barely moist 4 inches down. If you are watering till the balling stage. That is more than such small plants need. Bigger plants with larger root systems need more water than small plant with small root system. At this point with few plants, I would maybe just give the seedlings about 2 cups of water around each seedling. every 1-2 days. If the seedling isn't wilting at mid day, it can go another day.

The plants are so weak, I don't know if they are worth saving at this point. Once seedling hit the downslope, they have a hard time reaching their optimum. Stunted plants rarely catch up.

I would actually stop watering and till the soil to let it dry out. If you see white strands in the soil, it probably is still decomposing some matter, so you should wait until it is gone and just keep turning the soil every couple of weeks.

Start new seedlings in pots. Cucurbits transplant fine.

By the time the seedlings are ready the soil should be too.

I put a cache of slow nitrogen fertilizer at the bottom of my planting holes. I mix it into the soil and cover it with a couple of inches of soil on top of that. I use vigoro citrus food 4-6-4 with micros. I use citrus food for all my potted plants. I test my soil every three years. I only add fertilizer that is recommended to the ground.

When cucurbit seedlings are young, you only need a watering can. It only takes a cup or two a day to water them and try to water at the base not the leaves. Planting on a mound with a well helps to direct water in the right place and keep the leaves dry. Watering tubes work too. Mulching helps keep the surface soil from drying out. Temperatures in the 80's should be fine. They are warm season crops.
Increase the amount of water as the plants get bigger and the root system develops.

If you are going the organic route, you will need to give the plants fish emulsion every week while they are growing. Organic mixes will not provide enough nitrogen for heavy feeders.

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TomatoNut95
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That's why I don't like organic fertilizers because they're so weak. If you don't think it's too late, try starting over with new transplants or sow seeds.

imafan26
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Organic fertilizers are good but their numbers are low and only about half the nitrogen may be in an available form. Organic fertilizers must be converted by the soil microorganisms into basically a form that the plants can absorb. Synthetic fertilizers bypass the conversion and are like fast food ready to eat.

Both forms of fertilizer has their pros and cons
Synthetic fertilizers
guaranteed analysis and relatively high numbers
This means more nutrients per pound and it is a lot easier to spread a handful of fertilizer than a wheel barrel full of organic fertilizer to get the same NPK
con: No matter what fertilizer you get the NPK will never = 100%. 50% -70% of synthetic fertilizers are fillers and salt.
Care must be taken not to apply more than is needed as it can burn plants, and build up in the soil and get drift into the water ways.
Contrary to popular belief, synthetic fertilizer do not directly kill soil micro organisms. The plants and microbes will happily feed on the nitrogen in synthetic fertilizer. It is just not a balanced diet without carbon. sSynthetic fertilizers are an efficient source of nutrients. It works best with the addition of organic matter in the form of compost to provide the carbon and improve the nutrient, water, buffering, and tilth of the soil.
Synthetic fertilizers won't harbor pathogens like e. coli, or mad cow disease. If the source of the chemicals is pure, it should not contain contaminants like heavy metals.

Organic fertilizers:

Can be made at home, so you know what is going into your soil. It takes time but it is relatively low cost if you make it yourself and less yard and kitchen scraps enters the waste stream.

These are sourced from "natural products". In their whole form like fish emulsion (from fermented whole fish) and compost should be complete fertilizers although their NPK will vary from batch to batch depending on the source material and the numbers will generally be low and in a form that is not totally readily available to plants immediately.

The best sources of nitrogen is animal byproducts which do have a small risk of carrying pathogens.

Organic nitrogen is relatively hard to get. The NPK of organic fertilizers are low and and not totally available especially to young growing plants when they need it.

component parts like bone meal, blood meal, are organic but may not be complete fertilizers.

Compost that is incomplete or not thermophylic may also let pathogens and viruses survive. Some weeds like nut sedge may not be completely killed by composting and if plants sprayed with extended herbicides are composted, there may be residual amounts left that show up as herbicide damage on crops.
The quality of the compost is dependent on the quality of the source material. The NPK will vary from batch to batch.

It takes time for organic fertilizers to become available to plants. The availability may be relatively fast like fish emulsion and blood meal, but most like manures and compost will only slowly be made available over time up to two years to completely release. The conversion rate is dependent on the number and kinds of soil microbes available in your soil and the time of year. Cold weather slows the process down.

Organic matter and fertilizers are best added well in advance of planting to give the soil microbes time to make the nutrients available. Organic components ideally should be added 6 months before they are needed. That is why organic gardens usually require regular supplementation with compost or manure tea, or fish emulsion to boost nitrogen especially in the early stages of plant growth when it is most needed.
It is also the reason why an organic garden starting from scratch with average to poor soil to start with may take 2-3 years to be as productive as a conventional garden in terms of yield.

Plants grown organically, are usually smaller, have more insect damage (due to limitations in pest control and variety choices), but are healthier over all than conventional gardens.

Compost and organic matter may have low NPK, but the fillers are carbonaceous and feed the soil where synthetic fertilizer does not provide carbon to feed the soil.

Compost helps retain moisture, buffer pH, improve soil tilth. Synthetic fertilizer does not do any of that.

If you do a soil test and don't need more of an element like phosphorus, it is hard to do that since organic fertilizers are rarely pure and the component elements are hard to separate out.

Organic fertilizers ,manures, and compost still contain salts and ash.

Certain organic components can make the soil very alkaline like compost and wood ashes.

Compost piles do attract undesirable things like centipedes. One of the reasons that I only buy bagged compost. Although, it still sometimes comes with ants.

Volume: While compost contains carbon and valuable fillers, it is a lot of weight and volume to have to haul around compared to synthetic fertilizers.

Manures from pastures and animal farms have contaminated fields downstream with pathogens like e-coli and salmonella. These are risks of using manures that have not been hot composted or contained until the pathogens were neutralized.

Best of both worlds.

For soil health, add compost and organic matter. Minimize tilling. Tilling kills more soil organisms than choice of fertilizer.

For soil balance, test your soil and amend as recommended either organically or with synthetic fertilizers. It is your choice. Only add what is needed. It saves money on what you don't need and saves the environment from runoff.

Pest control: less is always best. Promote an environment safe for natural enemies and grow cultivars best suited for your area. Always scout and control pests early.

Consider your garden as part of a larger ecosystem and not separate from it. Ecosystem work best when they are in balance.

Healthy plants need:

Good soil that drains well

Adequate nutrients availability at the right time

Adequate water not to much or too little

Air movement and space. Plant spacing is important for optimal growth

Light

Right plant in the right place. Select the best cultivars for your environment. Plant at the right time.

Protect plants. Be proactive not reactive. Scout regularly, identify and treat problems early. Anticipate the usual suspects return if they have been problems before. Barriers, cultivar resistance, water, invite beneficial insects to the garden. Diversify garden. Sanitation. Promote a balanced ecosystem.

Learn more. Research needs of plants that you have not grown before. Learn to identify pests and what is best practice in dealing with them.

Enjoy. don't fret the small stuff.

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Gary350
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imafan26 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:27 pm
Organic fertilizers are good but their numbers are low and only about half the nitrogen may be in an available form. Organic fertilizers must be converted by the soil microorganisms into basically a form that the plants can absorb. Synthetic fertilizers bypass the conversion and are like fast food ready to eat.
Click and read the link. Organic fertilizer is factory made too. A lot of people are fooled by the word organic, there is very BIG money to be made selling 25 cents worth of organic fertilizer for $14.99. Nothing wrong with replacing NPK in your garden with factory made NPK that is what plants use up and needs to be replaced. Soil gets all the micro nutrients from organic material you add to your soil. Farmers mulch their plants they return to the soil so all the micro nutrients goes back into the soil again. If we mulch our garden plants then return them to our garden soil micro nutrients will stay in the soil for the most part.

https://www.enviroingenuity.com/articles/synthetic-vs-organic-fertilizers.html?fbclid=IwAR0NVmOtJ2p-RNU50VdtgC8q3DWnxNcDGIeVby4NzpUVypVhYOQqcN8L1fs



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