I posted recently, in another forum, some pictures that I took, a few years ago, of a house and a Japanese-style garden in Victoria.
I mentioned the European practice of integrating of house and garden with French windows that provided access and a view between gardens and daytime living accommodation. I also said that it was similar to the Japanese practice of integrating the house with the garden that the Journal of Japanese Gardening recommends and calls 'Sukiya Living' . I suggested that the picures that I posted were an example of this.
Fron the reaction it brought, I'd beaten a hornets' nest with a stick.
However, I wonder what the folk here think of the principle of integrating house and garden more closely than is generally practised in the west? I, for one, like being able to sit in my living room - and at my breakfast table in the kitchen - and to have a view of my garden at the same time, and view the shrubs & their seasonal changes and watch birds flutter in the bird baths & so on. If that's 'Sukiya living' I like it.
Do the pictures give you the impression that this house integrates the house with the garden & provides an attractive environment to live in?
https://www.pbase.com/embe/sukiya_living
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I was in contact with a professor who maintains a JGarden website and he said that while he didn't agree with some of the things some people held about Japanese Gardening, disagreements are to be expected, and he seemed to have zero problem with that. I thought that was a wise position to take, to be accepting that others may not agree with him.
It's a great attitude to have, and it's the kind of thing we encourage here.
I'm not a J Garden expert (not even a neophyte- I'm just the janitor around here, so to speak ) but I have to say the photos are breathtaking.
It's a great attitude to have, and it's the kind of thing we encourage here.
I'm not a J Garden expert (not even a neophyte- I'm just the janitor around here
, so to speak ) but I have to say the photos are breathtaking.webmaster - It's very kind of you to say that of the pictures. What impressed me most about the site was how they'd managed to turn a really awkward & ugly area round the house into something better and to adapt the house so that they could enjoy it.
There were some other things in the very tight space round the house (not included in those pictures) that I liked rather less, but that's just a matter of personal taste: they were certainly beautifully made and maintained. An example of what I mean would be their small machiai. I incline to think that I'd only want a machiai if it was going to be regularly used as a place to sit: this one looked (to me) to be too small for that & to be purely decorative. (But so, I guess, are Japanese lanterns, so maybe I'm being inconsistent.) I feel a bit doubtful too about the flared cross-piece above the roofed gate next to it. Maybe it's because it gives it a sort of Torii Arch effect? Or is it needed to contrast with the roof over the Machiai? Without it there would be two very similar roofs next to each other & that might look awkward? See the attached picture of it.
I think the hornets' nest effect that I mentioned was caused not so much by the pictures as by my making a favorable reference to the <I>Journal of Japanese Gardening.</I> It upset a particular, small group of people: they thought I was waving a red rag at their bull (as you might say.....) - which is what the JOJG itself often does & may be why I like it so much!
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57260170
There were some other things in the very tight space round the house (not included in those pictures) that I liked rather less, but that's just a matter of personal taste: they were certainly beautifully made and maintained. An example of what I mean would be their small machiai. I incline to think that I'd only want a machiai if it was going to be regularly used as a place to sit: this one looked (to me) to be too small for that & to be purely decorative. (But so, I guess, are Japanese lanterns, so maybe I'm being inconsistent.) I feel a bit doubtful too about the flared cross-piece above the roofed gate next to it. Maybe it's because it gives it a sort of Torii Arch effect? Or is it needed to contrast with the roof over the Machiai? Without it there would be two very similar roofs next to each other & that might look awkward? See the attached picture of it.
I think the hornets' nest effect that I mentioned was caused not so much by the pictures as by my making a favorable reference to the <I>Journal of Japanese Gardening.</I> It upset a particular, small group of people: they thought I was waving a red rag at their bull (as you might say.....) - which is what the JOJG itself often does & may be why I like it so much!
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57260170
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Hi Herb
As someone oft on the recieving end of the red flags, I don't have much good to say about that particular publication, other than the information, when it is not pure opinion (masquerading as information), is good. Doug has a few excellent articles in every issue; if he could leave the editorials out it would be a much better magazine and I would still subscribe.
As for the sukiya living, I think this is an idea being rapidly adopted by Western designers, if not in a traditionally Japanese manner, then in a modern sense. This year has brought outdoor couches, lamps, even paintings to decorate outdoor space, so I feel that garden living is becoming an international affair. Thai, Morroccan, and Persian style gardens are other good examples of outdoor living in the garden. The sukiya style is a particular Japanese garden that incorporates this ideal, but it is not the only type of Japanese garden...
Scott
As someone oft on the recieving end of the red flags, I don't have much good to say about that particular publication, other than the information, when it is not pure opinion (masquerading as information), is good. Doug has a few excellent articles in every issue; if he could leave the editorials out it would be a much better magazine and I would still subscribe.
As for the sukiya living, I think this is an idea being rapidly adopted by Western designers, if not in a traditionally Japanese manner, then in a modern sense. This year has brought outdoor couches, lamps, even paintings to decorate outdoor space, so I feel that garden living is becoming an international affair. Thai, Morroccan, and Persian style gardens are other good examples of outdoor living in the garden. The sukiya style is a particular Japanese garden that incorporates this ideal, but it is not the only type of Japanese garden...
Scott
Hi Scott,
I think it's very fair of you to say that the JOJG has some excellent articles in every issue. The ones that I 've found most useful are those that address small-scale gardening - I.e. the sort that help the ordinary gardener with an average suburban back yard.
II think it's now reached about the 50th issue, but there's no really useful index to them, so I recently compiled one for my own use. It's only a partial one because I left out articles about larger scale gardens & learned stuff about Japanese Garden history. I concentrated instead on the mass of material relevant to actual, small scale gardening. It's already saved me a lot of time. I don't know if you'd have much use for it but I can send you a copy if you'd like one.
Herb
I think it's very fair of you to say that the JOJG has some excellent articles in every issue. The ones that I 've found most useful are those that address small-scale gardening - I.e. the sort that help the ordinary gardener with an average suburban back yard.
II think it's now reached about the 50th issue, but there's no really useful index to them, so I recently compiled one for my own use. It's only a partial one because I left out articles about larger scale gardens & learned stuff about Japanese Garden history. I concentrated instead on the mass of material relevant to actual, small scale gardening. It's already saved me a lot of time. I don't know if you'd have much use for it but I can send you a copy if you'd like one.
Herb
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Scott,
Having learned how high feelings can run among you professionals, I should perhaps have anticipated you'd decline.
However, did you take a look at the little machiai that I posted the picture of? My own feeling is that I'd rather see something else there, perhaps a plain bamboo screen of some sort.
Herb
Having learned how high feelings can run among you professionals, I should perhaps have anticipated you'd decline.
However, did you take a look at the little machiai that I posted the picture of? My own feeling is that I'd rather see something else there, perhaps a plain bamboo screen of some sort.
Herb
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It feels very fresh and new; I suspect Sen no Rikyu would be hard pressed to say good things about it. I will limit myself to saying the pillow must go...I feel that for the size of the garden the sense of formality is overdone there; I would have tried for something far more so in style. The small size of the building feels wrong in this more gyo style, and it does not quite fit the wabi of the tea cermony, but this is just my opinion of course...
Scott
Scott
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Scott,
One thing leads to another. I got rid of the cushion and the tiles. Then I tried turning the Machiai into what might be a toolshed. Then, still dissatisfied, & wondering what else might work, and bearing in mind that I think they'd want to be screened off from the neighbour, I replaced the Machiai with a screen.
Clicking on 'Original' produces a bigger picture.
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57305932/large
One thing leads to another. I got rid of the cushion and the tiles. Then I tried turning the Machiai into what might be a toolshed. Then, still dissatisfied, & wondering what else might work, and bearing in mind that I think they'd want to be screened off from the neighbour, I replaced the Machiai with a screen.
Clicking on 'Original' produces a bigger picture.
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57305932/large
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Herb you've said remove it all together, and then replaced it with another object...
Try replacing it with nothing...raked gravel, a pond or perhaps a singular upright plant that hid behind the gate some (I took the liberty of wandering around the garden a bit in your other images and I feel the space in the back yard would be lighter without the mass of a solid form there)Perhaps a plant? (It 'tis a garden...)
I was first thinking a maple but then I do love Enkianthus; it has a nice upright shape, prunes well, and it has such seasonal appeal. Lovely spring flowers, lush summer growth, and amazing fall color, like flame. It's even holds a few leaves in milder winters; in your neck its an evergreen practically. I like E. campanulatus for the touch of red in the petal (hence the common name of red-veined enkianthus, but the traditional Japanese form would be E. perulatus
Anyhoo, a singular focus instead of more STUFF, especially as you noted, red tile...
Scott
Try replacing it with nothing...raked gravel, a pond or perhaps a singular upright plant that hid behind the gate some (I took the liberty of wandering around the garden a bit in your other images and I feel the space in the back yard would be lighter without the mass of a solid form there)Perhaps a plant? (It 'tis a garden...)
I was first thinking a maple but then I do love Enkianthus; it has a nice upright shape, prunes well, and it has such seasonal appeal. Lovely spring flowers, lush summer growth, and amazing fall color, like flame. It's even holds a few leaves in milder winters; in your neck its an evergreen practically. I like E. campanulatus for the touch of red in the petal (hence the common name of red-veined enkianthus, but the traditional Japanese form would be E. perulatus
Anyhoo, a singular focus instead of more STUFF, especially as you noted, red tile...
Scott
Scott,
Yes, I think I see what you mean (if this effort is anywhere near it). Successfully inserting the shape & foliage of an Enkianthus into a picture, as with a Japanese Maple, needs a lot more skill than I have, so I just now took one of this shrub (now much distorted from the real thing) from a neighbour's garden across the street.
The habit of my substitute is quite different from Enkianthus or Maple, & the way I've done it, it would project somewhat into the neighbour's space. Nonetheless you've certainly made me conscious of the situation needing shrubbery rather than an 'object'.
While we're at it, I think that the little bridge that can be seen through the gateway in the front garden is a mistake too. To my mind it's too twee - & without a sense of real purpose. On the other hand, the bridge in the side or rear garden - shown in the picture captioned S2 - does have an obvious purpose, though I think I'd rather it were a bit simpler & more rustic.... But what the heck - it's their garden & if they enjoy it, that's what matters.
By the way, you've given me the urge to find a place somewhere for an Enkianthus in our garden.....
Thanks for a very educational exercise!
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57334510
Yes, I think I see what you mean (if this effort is anywhere near it). Successfully inserting the shape & foliage of an Enkianthus into a picture, as with a Japanese Maple, needs a lot more skill than I have, so I just now took one of this shrub (now much distorted from the real thing) from a neighbour's garden across the street.
The habit of my substitute is quite different from Enkianthus or Maple, & the way I've done it, it would project somewhat into the neighbour's space. Nonetheless you've certainly made me conscious of the situation needing shrubbery rather than an 'object'.
While we're at it, I think that the little bridge that can be seen through the gateway in the front garden is a mistake too. To my mind it's too twee - & without a sense of real purpose. On the other hand, the bridge in the side or rear garden - shown in the picture captioned S2 - does have an obvious purpose, though I think I'd rather it were a bit simpler & more rustic.... But what the heck - it's their garden & if they enjoy it, that's what matters.
By the way, you've given me the urge to find a place somewhere for an Enkianthus in our garden.....
Thanks for a very educational exercise!
Herb
https://www.pbase.com/embe/image/57334510
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The scale is certainly changed; the yard appears closer, more intimate, and I suspect bringing the inside view more into the outdoor space. A shame I don't have a good enkianthus shot, but it does seem to fit there. Perhaps an azalea and a yakushimanum rhododendron in front of it, dump the lawn space, make it gravel and add some rock and moss.
Or something to that effect...
HG
Or something to that effect...
HG