Ok. As a mod, don't type anything you might regret though. The warning and a PM would be fine. I could quote it in a reply.opabinia51 wrote:I'll post the information that I have on it tomorrow.
Just saying.
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opabinia51
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I meant be careful of libel. A damning report coming from a poster here would be less of an issue to the manufacturer than someone affiliated to the site.
I offered to post the info for you, that's all, so you or the site couldn't get in to legal trouble.
It's definitely damning info there, enough to put me off. Paints Glyphosphate in a completely different light than the link I gave, with a lot of conflicting information. Another case of putting profit before the environment, it looks like.
I might try some of the substances Helpful Gardener suggested. Vinegar seems like a good option if it works or it might be better to try a stronger acid like battery acid or something, I get a strange feeling that vinegar would have no effect in the dose I'm thinking of. I'm probably wrong though.
Glad to get any advice really. I could see everyone was rooting for the tree there for a while. Well, I wouldn't remove it if there was another reasonable solution so thanks for the help.
I offered to post the info for you, that's all, so you or the site couldn't get in to legal trouble.
It's definitely damning info there, enough to put me off. Paints Glyphosphate in a completely different light than the link I gave, with a lot of conflicting information. Another case of putting profit before the environment, it looks like.
I might try some of the substances Helpful Gardener suggested. Vinegar seems like a good option if it works or it might be better to try a stronger acid like battery acid or something, I get a strange feeling that vinegar would have no effect in the dose I'm thinking of. I'm probably wrong though.
Glad to get any advice really. I could see everyone was rooting for the tree there for a while. Well, I wouldn't remove it if there was another reasonable solution so thanks for the help.
I wouldn't be too worried about legal trouble. There are lots of websites that push information of all kinds about products, good or bad. So long as what you are posting is the truth, it isn't libel.
The truth is, the awful side effects of these chemicals has been downplayed for years. Nowadays most people don't know how else to get rid of a weed without spending $40 at the store and spraying it with something and waiting 2 days for it to die. By then you could have pulled those weeds and saved yourself two days waiting and $40...
Many people are only just starting to question these chemicals. Just as many people are only starting to look at the ingredients label on their microwaveable dinner - the side effects of all this change, in one generation is only now starting to be looked at.
The truth is, the awful side effects of these chemicals has been downplayed for years. Nowadays most people don't know how else to get rid of a weed without spending $40 at the store and spraying it with something and waiting 2 days for it to die. By then you could have pulled those weeds and saved yourself two days waiting and $40...
Many people are only just starting to question these chemicals. Just as many people are only starting to look at the ingredients label on their microwaveable dinner - the side effects of all this change, in one generation is only now starting to be looked at.
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opabinia51
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Thanks for the heads up Mootube but, this is information on the chemical Glyphosate that is widely redeemable from Peer Reviewed Journals and my posting of the information on Glyphosate is merely the spread of much needed knowledge about a chemical that is widely used in North America.
What people choose to do with this information is up them. The information is damming, but, the chemical itself is pretty damming as well.
What people choose to do with this information is up them. The information is damming, but, the chemical itself is pretty damming as well.
Instead of using Roundup for killing a section of grass or something, what would it hurt to say "cover the area with some black tarp, or spray it with vinegar" ?
Last edited by Grey on Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Helpful Gardener
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Even when I talk to pros who are wising up to the rest of the bunch I still hear "But I still use Round-up. Cuz what else are you gonna do?" When I mention alternatives they look at me like I have a hole in my head...This one is such an industry darling and household name that it will die a slow lingering demise, hopefully not taking a lot of good plants and animals with it.
Scott
Scott
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opabinia51
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That's the problem that needs addressing,
walk into a nursery or Home Depot and what do you see? Synthetic fertilizers and poisons. So, people don't know any better. I know that BC Hydro used to use Round Up (drilled into trees) to kill them instead of cutting them down when they threatened power lines. I don't know that they still use the stuff but, I wouldn't be surpised.
Anway, it is because of sites like this and people like Scott, Grey, Val, Roger, Newt and so on that people are learning about the problems with the current paradigm we are in.
walk into a nursery or Home Depot and what do you see? Synthetic fertilizers and poisons. So, people don't know any better. I know that BC Hydro used to use Round Up (drilled into trees) to kill them instead of cutting them down when they threatened power lines. I don't know that they still use the stuff but, I wouldn't be surpised.
Anway, it is because of sites like this and people like Scott, Grey, Val, Roger, Newt and so on that people are learning about the problems with the current paradigm we are in.
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The Helpful Gardener
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He's coming around...
Roundup is his biggest fault tho. He asked me last night how else, in September when it is time to start a new lawn, can he kill off all the weeds in the whole lawn?
I said vinegar, a few other things that I'll look up, or a big black tarp... he says "will those kill the weed seeds too?"
As if Roundup can do that.
All I know so far (as lawns just don't interest me much) is if you stay on top of the mowing this year, so the weeds never have a chance to go to seed, then do the vinegar & whatnot, or the tarp trick, and you've given your new grass a much better chance of survival without the Roundup leftovers in the ground.
The clincher seemed to be Opa's post on how bad Roundup is...
Roundup is his biggest fault tho. He asked me last night how else, in September when it is time to start a new lawn, can he kill off all the weeds in the whole lawn?
I said vinegar, a few other things that I'll look up, or a big black tarp... he says "will those kill the weed seeds too?"
As if Roundup can do that.
All I know so far (as lawns just don't interest me much) is if you stay on top of the mowing this year, so the weeds never have a chance to go to seed, then do the vinegar & whatnot, or the tarp trick, and you've given your new grass a much better chance of survival without the Roundup leftovers in the ground.
The clincher seemed to be Opa's post on how bad Roundup is...
Last edited by Grey on Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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opabinia51
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You know, there is a section in the same book that the "Round Up Facts" came from on how to "organically" have the best looking lawn on the block. And by this I mean, the standard "monoculture" lawn.
I personally don't believe in monoculture lawns, and I've already posted somewhere else what my lawn will eventually consist of but, I think it bears mentioning (the information from my book) just so that people have as many options at their disposal as possible.
I personally don't believe in monoculture lawns, and I've already posted somewhere else what my lawn will eventually consist of but, I think it bears mentioning (the information from my book) just so that people have as many options at their disposal as possible.
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Michigan2Iowa
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At the risk of being labelled a "tree hater", here it goes.
I had two UGLY and worthless boxelders (Acer negundo) in my back yard that I HATED. They are fast growing softwoods that send up numerous suckers, have unpleasant form, send down THOUSANDS of seeds every summer through fall, they STINK, and have you heard of the boxedler bug? They lay their eggs in the bark of the tree and then hatch by the hundreds of thousands every spring, coating windows, cars and your home with their POO! These overgrown weeds are in the maple family, but don't have any beautiful fall color. Anyway, I digress...
In 2004 we had a moderately strong storm come though Cedar Rapids and both of these trash trees had extensive trunk damage. These trees grew right up through the neighborhood power lines, yet the power company would only trim them back. I wanted them OUT...but they are on a high ridge in the back of the yard and we live in a residential area where you can't get in a cherry picker to take them down. If we tried to fell the trees, it would destroy about 4 or 5 houses in my neighborhood. To pay for removal, it would have cost $2000 or more due to the difficulty of the project. Well, I found out through a contact at the power company that they are required to remove any fully dead trees that are near power lines (see where I'm going with this?).
The death had to seem natural, and as you can tell by my many posts, I didn't want to affect my garden which lies directly beneath where these two boxedlers were. I was told that if you drill a small hole deep into the heart of the tree and inserted a long piece of brass, it would kill the tree without using chemicals, and it would slowly deteriorate over the summer. I'll tell you that those trees will have been gone a year on the 30th of this month.
Now, I know it may not seem ethical, but in my situation, I was faced with removing the trees either way. Was I going to pay thousands, or make the power company do something they should have done in the first place?
So, if you have to get rid of them, drill that hole, insert the brass (make it low to the ground so that if you have someone cut it down it doesn't destroy the chainsaw!!!) and wait. I will warn you that metal inside of a tree will create a very large and noticeable streak of blue on the interior wood. If you think someone might identify this and start asking questions...well, do this at your own risk.
If I've offended anyone with this post, I apologize...
-Paul-
I had two UGLY and worthless boxelders (Acer negundo) in my back yard that I HATED. They are fast growing softwoods that send up numerous suckers, have unpleasant form, send down THOUSANDS of seeds every summer through fall, they STINK, and have you heard of the boxedler bug? They lay their eggs in the bark of the tree and then hatch by the hundreds of thousands every spring, coating windows, cars and your home with their POO! These overgrown weeds are in the maple family, but don't have any beautiful fall color. Anyway, I digress...
In 2004 we had a moderately strong storm come though Cedar Rapids and both of these trash trees had extensive trunk damage. These trees grew right up through the neighborhood power lines, yet the power company would only trim them back. I wanted them OUT...but they are on a high ridge in the back of the yard and we live in a residential area where you can't get in a cherry picker to take them down. If we tried to fell the trees, it would destroy about 4 or 5 houses in my neighborhood. To pay for removal, it would have cost $2000 or more due to the difficulty of the project. Well, I found out through a contact at the power company that they are required to remove any fully dead trees that are near power lines (see where I'm going with this?).
The death had to seem natural, and as you can tell by my many posts, I didn't want to affect my garden which lies directly beneath where these two boxedlers were. I was told that if you drill a small hole deep into the heart of the tree and inserted a long piece of brass, it would kill the tree without using chemicals, and it would slowly deteriorate over the summer. I'll tell you that those trees will have been gone a year on the 30th of this month.
Now, I know it may not seem ethical, but in my situation, I was faced with removing the trees either way. Was I going to pay thousands, or make the power company do something they should have done in the first place?
So, if you have to get rid of them, drill that hole, insert the brass (make it low to the ground so that if you have someone cut it down it doesn't destroy the chainsaw!!!) and wait. I will warn you that metal inside of a tree will create a very large and noticeable streak of blue on the interior wood. If you think someone might identify this and start asking questions...well, do this at your own risk.
If I've offended anyone with this post, I apologize...
-Paul-
Where is your post about your lawn plants opabinia? I intend to replace my grass with some very low groundcover. Hopefully all useful plants and I'd also like to get lots of fruiting plants in to it if I can find the right ones.
)
Thanks a lot Paul, that method is as good and eco-friendly as any and I think I'll end up trying it that way. I may even be able to get it removed by the council for free because it could fall on the public footpath. Definitely worth looking in to. I suppose them realising about the blue streak is a risk I'll have to take but what could they do about it (If they told the Mrs though, that's another storyMichigan2Iowa wrote:Evil tree killing method...
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Michigan2Iowa
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Michigan2Iowa
- Full Member
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- Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:39 am
- Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa, Zone 5a
- Contact: AOL
