redneck647
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Poor Soil - What's a Recommended Tomato Variety?

As seen in other posts my garden soil is poor and is leading to problems. I'm working on figuring it but I expect it to take a few years.

My tomato crop is made up of large red cherry and beefsteak tomatoes. The cherry tomatoes do produce a small crop but the beefsteaks usually do really bad and any fruit that forms end ups rotting on the vine before getting ripe.
I'm wondering if there are any other non cherry verities that might have a better chance for the next few years while I work on building the soil up? I don't expect something to thrive but that would at least get some fruit.
Otherwise I’ll probably end up switching the whole crop to the cherry tomatoes.

pepperhead212
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Have you thought about container planting while trying to build the soil up? I planted a bunch of tomatoes in self irrigated planters (SIPs) this season, and had incredible production, though a couple varieties didn't produce well, and I just won't grow them again! I got three Earthboxes last year, which made a believer out of me, but this season I made five large ones and eleven smaller ones, the latter ones from buckets, and the cherry and artisan tomatoes in the buckets produced so much, and spread so much, that I realized that next year I will have to plant fewer, and farther apart, so I can easily find them. LOL

I am constantly looking for larger tomatoes that will produce, and keep producing - the key words! A smaller - about three inch max. - variety that produces well for me and has great flavor, is Sweet Carneros Pink. The only problem is the first dozen or so end up with BER! This happens with a lot of them, but with poor soil it may keep occurring.

HoneyBerry
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'Early Girl' ripens early.
I had good luck with heirloom tomatoes that were started early in a greenhouse with really good dirt. They had a good head start. That seemed to make a big difference. I had tomatoes coming out my ears that year. I had 6 different heirloom varieties and they all did well. They grew like Jack's beanstalk that year.

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digitS'
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I grew Large Red Cherry for years. It was an heirloom, but I didn't know that. When I tried the new golden cherry hybrids, I became enamored with those and drifted away from LRCherry. I have enjoyed little Coyote heirlooms in my garden the last couple of years, tho'.

If you are wanting to stay with heirlooms, Thessaloniki was the first that I purchased seed for and deliberately grew. There have been many others since but that variety is a consistent performer in my garden over about 15 seasons.

If hybrids are okay, Early Girl was the #1 garden tomato in the US, according to Sunset magazine a few years ago. There are several reasons for that and Birdlover notes an important one.

Steve

PaulF
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Ten years ago we moved from central Iowa, the land of perfect tomato growing soil, to southeast Nebraska. The soil here had never had any amendments, ever. It is loess soil, which means million year old wind blown volcanic dust and grows weeds but not much for gardening. That said, it has been a ten year struggle to get the organic content built up. The first five years or so was difficult just because I wanted to grow tomatoes like I did where we came from.

Generally, my tomato crop is made up of all heirloom/Open Pollenated varieties of all sizes, shapes and colors. This year there were twenty-five large fruited (beefsteaks, rounds, globes and best of all, heart shaped) and three plants of cherries.

I have done some container plants a long time ago, but I dislike that they bear smaller fruit and are much less productive and less tasty than ground grown tomatoes. What I have done is just plant what I want, baby the entire garden and amend, amend, amend. I would suggest a soil test that will tell you exactly what needs to be done and how much. A good mulching program will help your tomatoes do the best they can do. I use newsprint as a base and 6-8 inches of weed-free straw. This keeps down weeds, cools the soil and retains moisture during the growing season. Best of all, in the fall I till it all back into the soil as additional organic material. You will soon discover many techniques to get the most out of what you have until you get to the place you want to be with your soil.

Over the years I have grown a few more than two hundred different varieties of tomatoes. I will never again grow a hybrid variety. There are too many good non-hybrids out there to try. But then, not everyone wants to grow excellent tasting tomatoes. I guess that is my way of saying, "experiment to find your best varieties." Gardening is not a one and done hobby/obsession. I could list maybe fifty varieties you could try, but Nebraska or Iowa is not Pennsylvania and my list could be useless information. There several tomato growing forums on the web where growers in your area could suggest varieties that do well. I am sure you will get suggestions from this site.

Most of all, have fun with your variety search and working with your soil to build it up. Even though I am a fat, old guy with not many years left, I always do what I can this year and look forward to next year and the next and the next. Good luck!

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My tomato growing experience in New England has been influenced by the trees bordering my property. The soil is good because the previous tenants going back two decades didn't rake leaves, creating a layer of black healthy soil full of worms, spiders and also grubs.

It's the lack of full sun AND the short growing season that's influenced how I grew tomatoes and what kind. In order to maximize sun I grew tomatoes in containers that I could strategically place for the most sun. In order to cope with the short growing season I planted fast growing varieties. Cherry type varieties worked best. Others fruited well, too. But the cherry tomatoes produced the most.

imafan26
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I agree with pepperhead. Tomatoes are heavy feeders and if your soil is poor, your tomatoes will not perform the best. Plant one large tomato in a half 55 gallon drum or 18-20 gallon containers. I prefer self watering containers because there will be fewer issues with BER.
In the meantime continue to work on your soil. If you don't want to bring in more organic matter it will be hard to get enough from a small compost pile. Plant green manure crops. Buckwheat, clover, sudangrass, and rye will add biomass to the soil when they are tilled in at flowering. To boost the nitrogen in the soil plant cowpeas, alfalfa, or hairy vetch after they have been inoculated with the proper inoculant to boost the number of nitrogen fixing nodules on the roots.
https://www.johnnyseeds.com/v-76-green-m ... &pagenum=2
https://www.johnnyseeds.com/search.aspx? ... ersearch=1

If you are not 100% organic, I suggest you use some low number conventional complete fertilizer. I am partial to citrus food Vigoro 6-4-6 from home depot. I used to use high number fertilizers but since my soil is so high in everything, I have now come to the conclusion that less is better. Even cover crops need fertilizer to get a good start.

For the containers these are my most successful tomato picks
cherry- sunsugar, sungold, spoon, napa grape. Black cherry had a nice flavor but it is not very productive. Medium sized tomatoes - Sioux (heat resistant), Early Girl, Husky, Big Beef, Cherokee Purple, Pruden's purple, Lucky Cross. Brandywine is the best heirloom tomato for old fashioned tomato taste, but it does not keep well and is prone to fungal diseases. If you can deal with that then it should also be on your list.

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digitS'
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When gardeners talk about improving poor soil sufficiently to grow tomatoes, my mind goes back to when I was first interacting with others digitally ... I don't know if there were forums then. This was a listserv for community gardens admin and gardeners. I was involved in that kind of gardening then.

One lady said that she followed her father's advice of one 50# bag of composted cow manure for each tomato plant.

I weighed a bag ... it was 20#. Was her father really finding 50# bags? Wasn't 50# a heckuva lot of amendment and fertilizer for just one plant? I should have asked those questions, 15+ years ago ;).

Cow manure varies but .5% nitrogen is the number often given. That's not much for a fertilizer. I have used 3% N composted chicken manure in the corn for years. I used one bag for 4 tomato plants in not especially good garden soil this year. My usual organic fertilizer was not available. It was a mistake not to give those plants some more, later in the season. They had an okay year ... the plants were fairly large, the fruit was fine but there could have been more of it. I knew I needed to get back with more of some kind of fertilizer, just didn't get a round tuit :roll: .

Two & a half bags of composted cow manure to equal 50#? I don't know ... I wouldn't put that much on good soil but maybe on especially poor soil.

Steve

Susan W
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For containers and smaller spaces, I suggest Better Bush. It's shorter and stockier, may need some staking, but stays relatively compact. Mine in containers have mid sized red tomatoes, and doing well. With good soil, some extra food throughout season, would do fine in 5 gal bucket.

redneck647
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Thanks everyone. I'll try the early girl tomatoes next year then if I can find them.
I've tried growing tomatoes in containers before but they didn't do as well as the ones in the garden. Now that might have changed. Lol.

imafan26
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To grow indeterminate tomatoes you should make sure the pot is big. 18 gallon tubs, 20 inch pots or 55 gallon half drums which would be over kill, but you could underplant them with basil or some other companion. Another tomato would fit, but then it might have a problem with the vines not getting enough air ciculation.

If you grow in pots use potting soil and tomato tone or fish emulsion. You will not get very good results with compost and manure in pots. If you use organic you will need to fertilize with the fish emulsion weekly.

If you want to improve your soil organically, it will take at least three years to build it up. It would be better to plant light feeders instead of heavy feeders in that kind of soil. If the drainage is good then add lots of compost made from multiple source material. Manures are o.k. but do a soil test, if your soil is alkaline you will want to avoid chicken manure and stick with cow or horse manure. If you are not going to plant for at least 4 months you can save some money by getting the manure from farms and stables. Try to get as much aged manure as possible. Fresh manures will need to be in the ground or aged in the compost pile at least 120 days before you use it and the pile must be a hot pile.

Ask for recommendations for growing tomatoes if that is your main crop and the extension will give you recommendations for fertilizer and pH adjustment specifically for that crop. If you want it to be organic you will need to ask for organic recommendations. Make sure your garden is not in a low spot and that it is in full sun and is not shaded.

Tomato variety won't make that much of a difference in poor soils. The smaller tomatoes will fare better than larger tomatoes in very poor conditions
Red cherry, spoon, and sungold will grow wild in my yard, but my soil is very rich in nutrients.



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