2013-14 WHO'LL BE GROWING WINTER TOMATOES INSIDE THIS YEAR?

[Bobberman]

I put tomato plants that I started late this in my solar greenhouse and they are taking nice so far. I have about 10!

[gixxerific]

[applestar]

I went and bought a pair of electric toothbrushes yesterday (about $10) -- I really missed the sight of the pollen shooting out of the tomato blossoms! (is that odd? )

I promise you, it's very reassuring.

Of course I'm also using them on pepper blossoms and I noticed more pollen-fall when I tried it on tea plant blossoms, too.

Gixx, I love that striped fruit!
Bobberman, are you able to post photos yet?
Northernfox, let's see what you got.

[gixxerific]

Applestar that striped fruit is JA Yellow X Hippie Zebra F2. I have Pit Viper going as well that is all for now. I am taking it easy for now. I may drop a few more, Streak Legal Black for one maybe some of the smaller dwarfs as well like Yellow Dwarf.

[applestar]

Be sure to post pics when that one ripens please
F2 means long way to go huh? Looks like a good start


Kootenai is definitely living up to expectations for productivity, earliness, short/small container growing, and starting to setting fruits low.
Here are a couple of examples:

(Winter Wonderland)

Kootenai with multiple green fruits

(Top of Winter Paradise -- one of garage Kootenai)

Kootenai with multiple blooms

Still waiting to find out about fruit size and flavor.

Sweet N Neat -- which was actually my hopeful -- is just starting to develop flower buds, so definitely later than Kootenai:

Sweet N Neat starting to produce flower buds

So happy Shadow Boxing and Utyonok are still growing. The 2nd tiny Shadow Boxing is still trying to come back

Shadow Boxing and Utyonok

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[gixxerific]

Nice Apple I wish my plants looked that good.

That Shadow Boxing is coming in Dark, me likey.

[GardenFresh]

I am going to try and grow tomatoes (and some other things) inside this year. I attempted to convert a framed bathroom in my basement, that will not be completed anytime soon, into a mini greenhouse. Not sure if its going to work but figured I give it a shot. The T-5 lamp puts out some light / heat and it is averaging about 83 degrees and about 30-40 humidity. So we shall see.....Let me know what you think and any feedback would be greatly appreciated as well:)

[applestar]

Looks like a good start and a fun winter project

Since your lights are T-5's, start by lowering your lights to about 3-4 inches above the foliage of the bucket plants. (Don't let them get closer than 1 in). T-8's need to be closer 2-3 in. (Don't allow to touch for more than a few hours). And T-12 need to be 1-2 in. (Can touch without getting scorched).

What I do with little pots like the one you have to bring them up to the light is to put them on the soil of the larger containers. You'll have room enough until the big plants outgrow or grow a dense canopy. If the little plants are still too short, just put upside down containers under them to get them up higher. Your main objective as they grow will be to keep all the tops of the plants at the same level and distance away from the light by raising or lowering the lights or the plants. It's a bit like musical chairs.

The little containers will dry out faster so keep checking them by hefting and feeling their weight or by feeling the surface of the soil.

Here's an example under a t-8 fixture

These are under a t-5 fixture

[GardenFresh]

Applestar-

Thanks for the feedback...I will lower the light when I get home. I figured the light distance was decent because the temps were good...as you can see in the pic I have a little thermometer / humidity gauge on top of the buckets. But I will lower to 3-4 inches above the foliage as you stated (you are more experienced at this than me:)

Also, I will place as many as the little containers in the buckets as I can fit until the maters grow bigger. Then I will find something (addt'l buckets and a board prob) to bring the rest of to similar height.

So with all that being said...do you think I have a decent shot of growing / producing fruit over the winter?

Thanks....

[applestar]

To be honest, I think 83° is a little hot until they start blooming. My house is kept above 65°f but downstairs in the coldest winter months will get down in the 50's at night when the thermostat is turned down.

Tomatoes grow well and more compactly in the 50's/60's as seedlings and with good fruit set in the 70's.

Admittedly my house environment is a little on the cold side for fruit development. Last year, they all took off after worst of the winter was over and things warmed up a little -- I remember thinking "Ah, they WERE cold."

I think you will need to watch that they don't shoot up too quickly in the limited space. Be sure to give them as much light as you can. On the other hand, yours will probably grow more quickly to maturity and bloom better with sufficient light. If not too hot to set fruit, they should develop with fuller flavor.

It will be a good idea to get an oscillating fan to run on a timer for several short durations. That will help to cool them down and to strengthen the possibly weaker growth from growing quickly in an enclosed environment. I don't use a fan, but there is good air movement and the day/night fluctuating temp also provides some cellular stress.

It's early since the heat was turned on so we still have upper 50's% RH in the house, but I still mist them all thoroughly every morning. When misted, the RH temporarily increases to the 90's but dissipates in a few hours. Later on in the season, the heat will drive the RH down to 40's and even lower, but the change is gradual and the plants will adjust to the daily morning high humidity then dry air for the rest of the day. I believe this cycle also helps to toughen up the "skin" of the foliage.

[rainbowgardener]

Yup, I thought the same thing as soon as I looked at the picture - the light is too high above the plants. Any amount of light you can give your plants is so much less than sunlight that you have to really work to compensate, by having the light right down next to them and by having it on for 16 hrs a day.

Perhaps you can rig up a little shelf next to the buckets for all the little pots?

If you up pot into bigger containers, I would use plastic, not the peat ones. In my experience, those can be seedling killers. Hold too much water for a long time, keeping everything too wet and then finally dry out and suck all the water away from your plant.

[applestar]

Couldn't resist posting these pics too...

These Coyote's are at their full (small cherry) size so I suppose they will be ready first?

[GardenFresh]

applestar-

I moved my tomatoes closer to the light as you directed yesterday. I also moved the smaller containers closer to the light using some addt'l buckets / board I had laying around.

[rainbowgardener]

Looking good! Since the little ones on the shelf are farther away to the side, they may start leaning towards the light. In that case, you can just keep rotating them frequently. I do 1/4 turn twice a day (not morning and night, morning and half way through their 16 hr day).

[GardenFresh]

Looking good! Since the little ones on the shelf are farther away to the side, they may start leaning towards the light. In that case, you can just keep rotating them frequently. I do 1/4 turn twice a day (not morning and night, morning and half way through their 16 hr day).

Thanks for the feedback...and will do!

I hope I can actually get fruit to come on at some point:)

[Northernfox]

All of your plants are looking great!! I am so glad to have access to some green in my life!

I have a small update on mine

I started pruning my peppers. it was painful but for the best!

[Northernfox]

I totally posted this on the wrong thread the first time. oops

[applestar]

Looking good! I'll post the latest pic of my Sweet N Neat tomorrow. The lights are turned off by the timer there now.

First fruits of the Cherokee Tiger F6 Striped Plum:

CT Striped Plum F6

I was practicing my techniques for crossing tomatoes -- you remove petals, anther cone and the calyces of the blossom you intend to pollinate. I just used any available pollen (Coyote and Kamatis Tagalog) for this Koootenai but it did set fruit

[Northernfox]

Oh if I could get my hands on sweet n neat seeds I'd be a happy Gardner ! I am growing mine this winter so I can hopefully get some ripe fruit I can harvest the seeds from ! I want to spread the love!

What kind of lights are you running that allows you to get such great tomatoes going ? I have never done tomatoes inside so I am not quite sure what I'm doing.

[applestar]

If you refer back to this post and the one after it, I briefly described the light set ups in each location. I can clarify with more details if needed.

-- I didn't have the camera with me just now, but the Sweet N Neat has first truss of tiny green fruits.

ETA -- you'll have to excuse me... I just recently got an iPad Air to upgrade from an original release iPad1 with no camera, so I'm a bit paparazzi right now....

Here are photos of Sweet N Neat:

Sweet n Neat atop Winter Paradise fruit trusses

Entire plant:

An update photo of the three Kootenai in the "Winter Wonderland":

[Northernfox]

I did read your post you must forgive me I have an 8 month old at home whom is having a lot of fun keeping me up at night!

your plants look great! you started them in August right? I got mine going in mid September so I am expecting a little bit of a delay!

I love the pictures keep them going! Enjoy the new iPad! I get my work iPhone 5 s I think in the next few days!

[GardenFresh]

applestar / rainbowgardener-

Any suggestions on what I can use for a good all around "organic" fertilizer for my winter indoor garden?

I was thinking about just picking up a bag of Espoma "Plant-Tone"......

Suggestions / Thoughts....

Thanks,
Michael

[Northernfox]

GardenFresh I just use a 2.2.2 liquid organic fertilizer. nothing to strong just easy food for them

[applestar]

I don't worry about it for the first couple of months since I use organic potting mix with compost and nutrients that tend to be slower releasing, the seedlings get uprooted as they grow, and in the cooler environment I think nutrient loss is slowed down as is the growth rate and usage by the plants.

You don't want to be too generous with fertilizing these plants because you want them to stay compact, and we don't have the luxury of exuberant growth.

I water with filtered or chlorine out-gassed water, and occasionally add used coffee grounds (UCG) as well as last dregs rinse out water for juice and milk cartons, soda bottles, etc. Once they are in their final size containers and the plants start fruiting, they need more water and I think would use up the soil nutrients faster, so I would probably start making AACT with the vermicompost and also weak "fertilizer tea" with tomato tone or dr! earth tomato fertilizer which will be added to the water every other watering or so.

[GardenFresh]

Northernfox-

Where do you buy this 2.2.2 liquid organic fertilizer from...local big box store or online?

applestar-

Yep, I understand I may not need it for a few months...just wanted to have something on hand in case they need it:)

[GardenFresh]

BTW, forgot to ask earlier....those that are currently growing winter veggies...what kind of light cycle are you currently on?

Right now I am doing about 16-18 hrs a day from about 4am to 10pm but was thinking about changing it to have the light on overnight since that is when it is the coldest...?

Thoughts on that or does it not really matter..?

Thanks.....

[Northernfox]

Garden,

it is a local product I use but I would assume you can find the same liquid fertilizer at any green house.

I have my garden growing inside and I have it on a 12 hour cycle which works best for me. I run the lights during the day as that is when my unregulated power is the cheapest When the seedlings were young I had mistakenly left my timer on the "on" mode which meant for the first month it was going for 24hours a day

[rainbowgardener]

I run mine about 16-18 hrs a day, from when I get up to when I go to bed. I think they do benefit from some rest period. If they are in front of a window, then if you have the lights on at night, they would never have a dark period. If they are not in front of a window, it probably doesn't matter when the lights are on.

[GardenFresh]

All-

Just thought of something else that has been on mind in ref to pollination. I read online that tomatoes are self pollinating plants because they have both male and female parts of the flower or something like that. It continued to say that you can help it along, even though not necessary, by using a fan or gently shaking the plant daily for indoor grown tomatoes.

I also read where folks have had a lot of issues with indoor tomatoes and pollination and fruit never developing. It was suggested that you should use a small paint brush or electronic toothbrush to stimulate the flower for pollination.

So which is it, will they pollinate by themselves or not.....I am confused on what I should do or buy to be prepared for developing fruit.

Thanks for your assistance.

[applestar]

I use an electric toothbrush. Tomatoes are different from the other flowers that have open blossom structure. The anthers are fused into a cone -- therefore called "anther cone" and when buzzed, pollen fall down en masse, helping to coat the pistil which is often INSIDE the cone. So there really no way to use a paintbrush or a cotton swab.

E. Toothbrush also works for peppers, and it seems to help pollen production in other flowers too, so I have been buzzing the flower trusses of the Meyer lemon before hand pollinating them.

I used to use a ($100) ultrasonic toothbrush, but am now using a Colgate electric 2 for $10 which seems to be working fine -- it buzzes/hums like a bee. To compare, I also bought a similarly priced CVs brand with a free replaceable brush head (about $10) and battery box, but that one is not as fine -- coarse and loud more like a power tool. If you end up getting a different brand, please post your reviews for comparison.

[Northernfox]

Well my Sweet N Neat are growing well and have started to flower



Not having a ton of time I planted directly and boy did it work !!

[youtudotbe]https://youtu.be/yhsd_Fv_qyM[/youtudotbe]

[ReptileAddiction]

I have a Brushpoint Oscillating Toothbrush. I use it outside when plants are covered etc though I usually try to pollinate most of the blossoms because I have noticed that it does help increase the percentage of blossoms that actually turn into fruit. It works great though and it is only 3.99 on amazon.

[staffeldt89]

I'm growing my tomatoes and peppers in my greenhouse this winter! I purchased a natural gas heater and had a professional hooked it up to my heater inside my house. We just had our first snowfall about a week ago here in Wisconsin and my temperatures stayed about 50 degrees with the heater on low. The other night with the wind chills it got down to -10 outside so I had to crank the heater up to medium and so far so good. I made a video about my heater if anybody else wants to try it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvSb9bXj2B0

Has anyone else tried this before?

[applestar]

One of the Kootenai fruits is starting to blush!

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[rainbowgardener]

So staffeldt, what stage are your tomatoes and peppers in? Are they blooming? Setting fruit? I haven't done winter toms, but literature says they need temps at least 55 deg F to set fruit.

[GardenFresh]

All-

In reference to hand pollinating my tomatoes, I have a few more questions.

At what stage do you start assisting with pollinating the flower, when the yellow flower is completely open?

How many times or how often do you do the pollination, just once multiple times?

About how long until you know if your pollination efforts were successful?

I have several yellow flowers on my plants and have even used the e-brush once or twice by vibrating right behind the yellow flower part as I saw on an online video.

I will post a couple of recent pics when I get a chance.

Thanks......

[ReptileAddiction]

I start pollinating mine as soon as the blossom is open enough to get in there. I pollinate all the open flowers every day until they fall off and are replaced by the fruit. They usually end up getting buzzed a few times. It is usually a few days until you know whether it was successful or not. You know because the petals fall off and you can see the tiny fruit.

[Northernfox]

Wow those tomatoes look great! Mine are just flowering now!

[GardenFresh]

I start pollinating mine as soon as the blossom is open enough to get in there. I pollinate all the open flowers every day until they fall off and are replaced by the fruit. They usually end up getting buzzed a few times. It is usually a few days until you know whether it was successful or not. You know because the petals fall off and you can see the tiny fruit.

RA-

Thx for the feedback on pollination. I will include a pic below with black arrows indicating where I have been attempting to pollinate each flower (which is what was instructed on an online video)...Does this look correct?

[Northernfox]

I have a fan that rotates over my indoor garden area. I figure the wind blowing a few times a day will help keep disease down and should help pollination.