Pest prevention.....

[yoki]

I need some advice on how to prevent bugs from eating my garden.......

1. Soap water........
-does it work? anyone have any recipes to make it, how much soap per water and what kind of soaps are safe for the plants?
-pretty sure last year I used the wrong soap or too much and it caused damage to my tomato plants leaves

2. Onion / garlic water........
- has anyone tried this, does it hurt the plants any and what sort of recipes have you used? I read something about 1 cup water per 1/2 cup onion / garlic then mix that with equal parts water after it soaks for a week....have yet to try this though

3. Neem oil .........
- is this superior to the soap water or onion/garlic water and how does it affect the plants?



I have tried to plant diversionary plants around to keep the bugs distracted but just want to learn all the methods I can because last year I was in a full war with the bugs and this year looks to be similar . Might try some bat houses or something Any suggestions would be very much appreciated thanks

[JennyC]

I'm still contemplating guineafowl myself. I definitely mixed my soap solution too strong on my peach tree; fortunately I couldn't reach most of the leaves anyway!

I'm very interested to see what others have to say about this thread, too.

[TheLorax]

Hey yoki, a very warm welcome to you here at The Helpful Gardener.

It's going to be real hard to offer suggestions with so little information.

Would you be able to start out by listing all that you are growing?

If possible, it would be really great if you could also list out what types of pests you have if you know. If you don't know, maybe you would be able to post some photos of the pests eating your garden?

[yoki]

Hi,

Planted in garden

1. tomato
2. potato
3. peas (couple different kinds)
4. beans
5. carrots
6. radish
7. spinach
8. lettuce
9. squash
10. cucumber
11. eggplant
12. rhubarb
13. strawberries
14. asparagus

That's what is in the garden so far........

Pests that seem to be a problem not entirely sure what species but I can describe them........

I know last year it was some black bugs in tomatoes, the soap water worked but it basically killed the plant so only got the tomatoes it had already produced.. Flies and other flying insects (mostly my fault for not picking tomatoes quick enough)

Ants seemed to be attacking my baby tomatoes earlier this year but seem to have stopped now...... have railroad ties to walk on in the garden so there are some termites not sure if they do anything bad.

Some huge orangish grubs of some sort I think they are beneficial but can't be sure......


But in any case I would also like some general information about making homemade pest controls........ As there is no way for me to predict what bugs will be here this year, but I want to be prepared this time hehe

[cheshirekat]

I thought railroad ties were only for non-edible gardens because they leach major bad stuff into the soil. Is this true?

I don't know if the railroad ties release chemicals that also weaken your edible plants so hopefully someone who knows can comment on that.

[TheLorax]

This is pretty much my first year container growing vegetables. I have:
tomato
salad greens
cucumber
rhubarb
strawberries

I have been growing asparagus for a while but that's in a separate bed.

Looks as if we're going to be learning together as I have a list of what I'd like to try next year and I doubt seriously if I will escape being plagued by something that wants to eat my veggies as much as I do.

One thing I have learned is to try one's best to meet the cultural requirements of a plant. Me personally, I am beginning to believe the organic route is the best. A well sighted and healthy plant is considerably less susceptible to disease. After that, watch carefully and deal with issues as they arise so you don't beat yourself up trying to anticipate what may happen. There's a learning curve to all of this and you and me are new and we're going to make a lot of mistakes. They're unavoidable.

I'm sure there are lots of members here who can provide you with general homemade pest controls but you are going to have to name your foe.

[TheLorax]

This is pretty much my first year container growing vegetables. I have:
tomato
salad greens
cucumber
rhubarb
strawberries

I have been growing asparagus for a while but that's in a separate bed.

Looks as if we're going to be learning together as I have a list of what I'd like to try next year and I doubt seriously if I will escape being plagued by something that wants to eat my veggies as much as I do.

One thing I have learned is to try one's best to meet the cultural requirements of a plant. Me personally, I am beginning to believe the organic route is the best. A well sighted and healthy plant is considerably less susceptible to disease. After that, watch carefully and deal with issues as they arise so you don't beat yourself up trying to anticipate what may happen. There's a learning curve to all of this and you and me are new and we're going to make a lot of mistakes. They're unavoidable.

I'm sure there are lots of members here who can provide you with general homemade pest controls but you are going to have to name your foe or be able to provide a photo.

[opabinia51]

1) Soap is used to wash aphids off of plants and is diluted 1:1 to wash aphids off of plants

2) I don't recollect what this is for but, you may already have had an answer. Rest assured it is not use all for everything treatment

3) Read the thread on neem oil in the "What doesn't Fit elsewhere" thread.

It is an insecticide that is derived from the Neem Tree as an allelopathic chemical that the tree secretes in response to insect herbivory. What is does is disrupt the molting process of insects in general. It is safe for human consumption and soap is made from it. However, it should not be used as a broad based insecticide and if used (as a last resort) should be used no more than once a week.

https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=925

[yoki]

the railroad ties are just wood no chemicals or anything on these...... If wood is bad might be in trouble though .

I'll check out that other thread for information on the neem oil thanks


Came up with a couple more questions

1. I want to test my soil's ph, can anyone recommend what device to get or what method they have used that was successful and relatively easy and inexpensive? Probably have more questions after I figure out what my ph is hehe

2. Plant disease's, I live in Iowa (midwest usa) so I was curious to know what ones I should be on the look out for ...... should I be doing anything to help prevent disease's from arising?

[yoki]

Aye I will keep a look out for what kind of insects I am invaded by..... right now it appears to be nats and lots of small flies but they aren't harming anything currently..... earlier I am almost sure it was black ants, perhaps I had disturbed their nest and they were out for revenge but they seem to have stopped now

[TheLorax]

Bad news, most railroad ties are chemically laden. They're generally pre-treated with all sorts of horrible preservatives just like telephone poles. Arsenic and dioxin are frequently used. These chemicals leach into the surrounding soils. I would not eat anything from a bed that used railroad ties.

While fungus gnats can be a problem, not generally so with many ants. Ants are generally friend not foe. Eliminate locally native ants and you could be opening yourself up to a visit from the types of ants that are a big pain in the rear. You need to know which ant you have. Sounds like a field ant which is a good thing.

For testing soil, there are affordable kits out there. You can probably go to your county extension office for a soil test. It might even be free.

Very difficult to be on the look out for any pest these days given how mobile we all are. Far too many variables to factor in. Best to be on the lookout for any plant that doesn't seem quite right to you.

[Jess]

Yoki my one piece of advice would be to know your enemy.
Learn to identify the insects that turn up on your plants. Try and figure out if what you see is actually causing the damage or is EATING what is causing the damage. Most pests have a predator and the sooner you can identify one from the other the more chance you have of a decent harvest.
You also need to learn to share a bit. Pests turn up at different stages of plant growth. Not all are completely destructive and can be allowed a bit of a chomp on a leaf or the occasional tomato. Usually there is more than enough to go round.
If you do get an army turn up intent on eating all of your crop then use your fingers before reaching for a spray. A lot of pests are large enough to be picked off. Keep your area clean and free from debris. A lot of pests are nocturnal and will hide under anything they can close by in the day. You can use this to your advantage, place rolled up pieces of cardboard near a plant you have seen damage on. Check this roll daily, you will be surprised at what you find in there.

[yoki]

I'll remember the railroad tie thing for future, but since they've been there forever I'm hoping any chemicals would be diluted. When I expand the garden what would you use to walk between rows? Its so handy to be able to have something to walk on besides dirt....

I got another question hehe, I decided being the genius that I am that I would use my lawn clippings to mulch around my rows of peas and tomatoes ..... I'm pretty sure I read that was ok somewhere, anyone care to comment if that was a good decision or will it attract too many bugs?

Who knows what I'll come up with tomorrow, hopefully the sun will burn some of the bad brain cells outta me. Gardening is becoming good exercise though

[yoki]

Oh lorax, what kind of containers did you go with? I have a bunch of spots to hang stuff up, and was thinking of maybe some pots with herbs or something..... My wife wants a banana tree for some reason so need a pot for it too, I think she will be in charge of that though

[TheLorax]

For the tomatoes, I used regular old 5 gallon buckets with four 1/2" holes drilled in the bottom for drainage. They have handy handles on them so when I want to rotate them a bit each day, I can grab the handle and spin them a little bit.

For the cucumbers, I used decorative concrete planters that most people plant ornamentals in. Same deal for the bell peppers, the rhubarb, and the salad greens. The salad greens are in a particularly nice big decorative concrete planter. I've had a few people ask me what I'm growing in the concrete planters and when I tell them they raise a few eyebrows. The concrete planters are all at least 5 gallon or greater. I think the concrete planters for the rhubarb plants were 15 gallon a piece.

yoki, you won't be hanging any of the planters I used ;) We had to get people to move the rhubarb planters into their permanent locations they were so heavy.

We used railroad ties for a kid's sandbox. Wasn't a good idea with what I now know.

The asparagus I have are in a raised bed of retaining blocks. Those work well enough and look nice. They're pretty cheap too.

I once had a garden that was level with the ground. Used untreated planks between the rows and they definitely are available in a 2x8 or maybe even a 2x10 size and I think they might have been pine... these really great planks provided better access for the bambis and thumpers to eat everything in the garden to nubs. These long planks have the added bonus of deterring weeds. Heads up, they're slippery when wet. Felt as if I broke my tail bone once when I slipped and went down.

Can't answer what's best for around the base of your peas and tomatoes. Grass clippings sound fine to me however I tend to mulch everything with hardwood chips. Better wait for somebody who has been doing this a lot longer than me to answer your question.

[applestar]

I initially mulched the seeds with wisps of straw to maintain moisture... plus I layered straw and compost on top of the potato ditch. Now, I'm seeing spiders everywhere so hopefully, they're keeping watch over my veggies. Also, I let the grass near the veggie beds go to seed and the little tiny wasp-like bugs are swarming all over them. I'm pretty sure they're the beneficial kind -- takes care of caterpillars?

Hmm... the trouble with that is I'm hoping to attract Black Swallowtail butterflies to my parsley.... Maybe I should go plant more parsley in the "Sunny Meadow-to-be" on the other side of the house.... I also found a source of Zizia in the Native Nursery List (thanks Lorax!) so I'll order a few of those.

[TheLorax]

Angelicas are great for Black Swallowtail butterflies too!

[yoki]

The grass doesn't seem to be attracting to many bugs yet so hopefully its ok....... If it turns out fine I think I'm going to do the same thing with my potatoes, keeps raining here I can't mound up the dirt around them when its mud !!!!!

If anyone has some tips on pruning tomatoes could use those ...... The first flowers are starting to come out on them, could also use some cheap ideas to use for stakes to hold the tomatoes up last year I found out that bamboo doesn't hold a big plant up in the wind

I think I found some 1 gallon pots that I can hang and found an article that says I can put cucumbers / peppers / maybe strawberries in them and hang them up..... oh herbs too

[yoki]

I'm almost certain it has to be ants eating my leaves, they are everywhere and I've caught them crawling on the tomato plants.... also some black ants around not sure if they are at war or what but caught one carrying another one around today....

I'm gonna try out some soap water on one plant to see if that gets rid of them without killing the plant..... any other suggestions would be great the little brown ants almost tricked me into thinking they were mites but I'm pretty sure they are ants...

[TheLorax]

yoki, do you have black ants and brown ants? Why don't you take a photo of your ants please. Maybe take a photo of your chomped leaves too both tops and bottoms. The last thing in the world you want to do right now is to remove something that could be friend not foe. I will say that ants can farm aphids so please go online and do a google search for aphids to familiarize yourself with the many forms they can take then go back to your plants and look for the presence of aphids.

Even a Leaf Cutter Ant does not eat leaves and there are no leaf cutters ants anywhere in the Midwest. Ants don't eat leaves anyway because they don't have enzymes capable of digesting the cellulose in the leaves. It's not good to begin treating something until you have identified your foe. One stab in the dark leads to another stab in the dark and before you know it, you could very well end up with cures that have killed off your plants.

As far as pruning tomatoes, this is my first season growing them in containers and I've decided to go au naturelle this year. I thought back to my mother's garden and don't recall her doing anything other than staking them. I called my dad on the phone and asked him if he remembered how mom pruned tomatoes and he said he didn't remember her doing much other than staking them. Was mentioning it to a neighbor this morning and she said she'd never pruned or pinched hers before. Same deal with another neighbor. The information I've been getting could be falling into the conventional wisdom category so it might be best to post a question over in the tomato forum asking specifically for the pros and cons of pruning tomatoes so you can decide for yourself which route is best for you to take.

[Andrewsmomma]

Hi,

This is my first post here, but I have been lurking for a while.

I am looking for what to use to rid my String Beans of Aphids. They really have done a number on them in a few days and because it has been raining I did not know it. I found this link, does this sound right? or are there other suggestions?

Thanks in Advance

Elizabeth

[TheLorax]

A very warm welcome to you Andrewsmomma.

I tried beans once. They were destroyed by local critters before I could have any issues with them. I can't tell you what would be the best route to go for you to treat the aphids even though I've had to treat aphids on other plants. You've got a bean plant and that's out of my league.

Pretty much all of The Helpful Gardener site is green so most around here are going to go for the most environmentally responsible method of dealing with a pest first but... all the heavy hitter veggie folks are over in the veggie forum and they probably won't find your question buried back here in this thread. Here's a direct link to the veggie forum-
https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=4
I think you'll probably have much better luck over there where your request will catch the attention of somebody who has good solid experience growing beans. Really sorry I can't offer suggestions here but you wouldn't want my help with beans anyway.

[yoki]

my digital camera is broke at the moment or I'd post a picture..... could it be flies? only thing I've seen are flies and ants, from what I've read anything about can cause the yellowing of leaves but if there are holes in the leafs and leafs disappear somethings gotta be eating them.......

I'm going to test the garlic / onion spray on a couple plants to see if it is harmful........ its not supposed to harm the bugs only make have a bad taste and only lasts until washed off by next rain so worth a shot I think

Too much rain I think is part of the problem and it just won't quit.......

[TheLorax]

yoki, please hold off on your garlic onion spray. I know you are chomping at the bit to do something but... holes in the leaves? Sounds like maybe slugs. Do a search here for posts by a member named brian. He's been dealing with slugs or maybe it was snails. Quite a few affordable and easy ways to nail those leaf chompers non chemically! You can always private message brian too and I'm sure he'd try to tell you what's working best for him.

Silly question but, did you check into how best to meet the needs of all the plants you are growing before you planted them? A best defense approach to prevention is to meet as many of the needs of your plants as is possible. Healthy plants are happy plants! Healthy plants are considerably less susceptible to disease than unhealthy plants.

[brian]

Hello Yoki,
I had holes appearing in some of the leaves on my plants and it turned out to be snails eating them. They are not readily visible on the surface because they like to stay where it is damp. I can find them by pulling away a bit of the soil close to the base of my plants and I find them hiding there laying in wait for the cover of darkness to sit down to dinner. Some of the other members gave me all kinds of good suggestions for getting rid of them but for now they seem to be under control. if you want to find out who is doing the damage I suggest you check out your plants at different times of day and night to see if there is something on them. It seems that most of the damage in my garden
was occuring at night and When I looked with a flashlight there they were munching away. If you do find out it is snails post back and I will pass on all of the wonderful advice I recieved about getting rid of them.
Have a great day and God Bless, Brian

[yoki]

I'll check tonight to see if I see anything on them at night, I have some copper things sticking out of the ground supposed to help for slugs but will look tonight for sure......

I'm just testing my onion garlic on one of each type of plants to see if it harms the plants , I'm gonna try to capture me some spiders to see if I can put them in my greenhouse to deal with the flies.... Are butterflies harmful ? one was stuck inside my greenhouse today

I try to read about what is best but I'm sure that I miss stuff or forget things, my wife is always reminding me that those are my best qualities hehe.

Thanks for all the help so far I've been learning lots

setting an alarm now to go slug hunting hehe, let ya know how it goes

[cynthia_h]

Another "drive-by" comment:

1) Butterflies are pollinators, thus beneficial.

2) It's advisable to plant things together according to all their needs, including water. Water hogs planted near one another, drought-tolerant plants near one another, etc. Giving plants too much or too little water will make them susceptible to insects/disease/anything that happens by.

Cynthia H.
USDA Zone 9, Sunset Zone 17

[yoki]

went slug hunting at midnight but couldn't find any, but I'm pretty sure I found a couple spider mites little guys that look kinda like spiders and found this webbing stuff around the bottom of a cabbage plant........

I couldn't tell if they had 6 or 8 legs though was trying hard to count but it was dark........ from what I've read everything says other mites hunt mites is there anything else I can do to get rid of them ?

Way to much water everywhere in Iowa right now, but not much I can do about that probably not helping my insect problem either.......

Had another problem the other day come up hehe, never ending story........ My strawberries are molding because of the excess water, any suggestions there or just have to toss out the bad ones? I'm afraid everything is gonna rot if the rain doesn't stop soon

[brian]

here is a link to a site I fond about spider mites
https://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef438.asp

It seems that spider mites do not like the dampness that you are experiencing from all of the rain so you might have to keep looking for an answer. They also do not cause holes as you have described from what I have read, anyways good luck and God Bless, Brian [/url]

[TheLorax]

Hey yoki, backing up to pruning tomatoes again, I found a neat little explainer that provides a visual if you are interested-
https://www.taunton.com/finegardening/how-to/articles/pruning-tomatoes.aspx?

[yoki]

I will keep my eye open for slugs, it seems the pests have backed off some and the plants are looking a lot healthier so maybe they were just weak and as they get stronger will repel the pests on their own

Thanks for the links will check those out

The lawn clippings as mulch seems to be working out quite well, I think I'm going to expand that to my potatoes this week......

What tips did you have for repelling slugs? I mize well learn about them now I'm sure I'll get some at some point