Why must I live between all these chemicals?

[JV]

I don't use chemicals on my lawn but yet I'm not going to go around to my neighbors and tell them what they can and can't do for their lawns. Last time I checked we still live in a free country so far and if they bought their property and are paying taxes then they should be able to use what ever they want as long it isn't illegal. But that's just my opinion.

[DoubleDogFarm]

and that's why the say, " Good fences make good neighbors"

[cynthia_h]

Here's a Sticky in one of our forums re. Sevin/carbaryl and other chemicals used in this country on plants, even those which will be eaten by gardeners and their families. Note also the concerns about drift, sometimes also called wind drift, of chemicals. The vapors of these chemicals themselves are hazardous when inhaled.

It's interesting to me to note that the thread started in June 2008, almost two years ago. Some of the concerns raised then by members have now spread to a somewhat larger non-gardening world, but we still have a ways to go....

https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8520

Cynthia H.
Sunset Zone 17, USDA Zone 9

[gixxerific]

JV I don't TELL my neghbors what to do though I do bring the facts and let them decide which is best. Oh and the stuff they spray in the yards is the same stuff my kids play in sometimes so it does effect me personally.

[Decado]

I don't use chemicals on my lawn but yet I'm not going to go around to my neighbors and tell them what they can and can't do for their lawns. Last time I checked we still live in a free country so far and if they bought their property and are paying taxes then they should be able to use what ever they want as long it isn't illegal. But that's just my opinion.

Which is why I wish it was illegal.

[peachyness]

My new next door neighbor had the gall to come over to me when I was working on my garden to tell me that I needed to use chemicals to kill my weeds. He has actually been coming over and spraying some of them for me!!! I will politely tell him later on that I plan to grow an organic garden and that I will pull the weeds myself.

[Gerrie]

We have road crews that come along once a year and spray for encroaching grasses or berries along the roadway. All you have to do is put up a sign that says 'NO Spray' and they won't spray. We're way out in the country so I think the crews figure they won't get in trouble by their bosses if they don't spray. I wish I could get DH to listen the same way. He won't come near the yard or garden with the sprayer but uses it along the perimeters of the seven acres. We have wells, I keep telling him this is going to end up in ur groundwater. He thinks he's going to live forever. I need help from "Dear Abby".

[Gary350]

My neighbor sprayed his yard today. The wind always seems to blow in the same directions for some reason the wind blows across my yard from the south and north towards the grade school 2 blocks away. This gives me an idea. If this stuff is legal I wonder how people would like it if I built a large water fountain full of lawn spray and sprayed it 20 feet into the air so all that bad toxic smell would blow across the grade school. Early morning when all those parents drive up with their kids I bet if the smell was so strong it knocked you down I bet a lot of parents would be screaming mad. It might make TV news if parents refused to let their children attend school with all that spray in the air. Wonder if those parents spray poison on their lawn. Wonder how they would like that.

[gixxerific]

It really is terrible. most people don't understand how BAD this stuff really is. They have never been educated and that in itself stinks.

It funny in a way my neighbors know how I feel I'm not afraid to share my opinion an anything. SO when they do use thing like Grub-Ex they tell me but kind of shy away. Don't worry I'm not too hard on them. I let them have nice and slow so as to not scare them away.

I have noticed several people lately around here deploying this and that while wearing either masks or respirators. That has to tell you something, right.

One day people this earth will be ours again, or......................................................

[Sage Hermit]

I only jest when I say sneak over and sabotage their lawns. Your direct approach works well and I wish you success and a large following.

[gixxerific]

I only jest when I say sneak over and sabotage their lawns. Your direct approach works well and I wish you success and a large following.

I know you were kidding and I'm sure everyone else did as well. I would never do that, the subtle direct approach as you say is a good avenue. They will eventually start listening I hope.

As far as the sabotage goes my Roundup crazy neighbor was mad at another person in the neighborhood so he wanted to trow "total vegetation killer" bombs in their yard. That stuff will kill everything for years. That is the mentality of some people around here so you see what I'm up against.

[DoubleDogFarm]

Yes, A little fun, not serious.

[applestar]

Yes. I have a neighbor like that -- not actually throwing weed killer on other peoples' property, but will go to pretty unneighborly lengths . He said he was "just looking out for the neighborhood" ... He followed that comment with "... you know?" I think he was expecting me to agree....

[rainbowgardener]

I have noticed several people lately around here deploying this and that while wearing either masks or respirators. That has to tell you something, right.

Yeah, my neighbor is always out there, even mowing his lawn with a mask on. He does all the chem lawn stuff. He says that he wears the mask because of allergies, but I have to wonder if his lawn wouldn't make him sick, if he didn't put poisons on it all the time. In the meantime, my un-poisoned, un-cared for lawn looks better than his and I have pix to prove it!

[DoubleDogFarm]

bring out your pix, bring out your pix!!

[cynthia_h]

There are some stunning pix of RBG's (lawn and) flowers, trees, etc. at "SPRING FLOWERS":

https://www.helpfulgardener.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22775

incredible looking plants! Congratulations, RBG!

Cynthia

[gixxerific]

Isn't it funny RBG I haven't used chemical ferts in my lawn either for a few years.

I finally broke down and bought some corn gluten to fertilize the lawn. I almost wish I hadn't. My grass is growing leaps and bounds above anyone else s around here. Oh well that's more fodder for the compost and more green mulch for me.

OH and RBG your pics are awesome, really. I wish I knew how to arrange plants and flowers like that. I do okay but that is really something there. Which reminds me back to my plants I need to figure out something for my new front garden.

[DoubleDogFarm]

I found this information about corn gluten here.
https://wihort.uwex.edu/turf/corngluten.htm

If you have a problem with GMO's, you may have issues with using corn gluten

Is Genetically Modified (GMO) corn used to make corn gluten?

Up to 60% of the commercial corn and soybeans in the United States is grown from GMO Seed. Corn gluten sold as a preemergent herbicide may indeed contain GMO corn, but it has not yet been tested. Here's the twist. Corn gluten can reduce the need for traditional herbicides that have environmental side effects. It likely now contains GMO corn. It could be produced from non-GMO corn, but would likely be more expensive.

If GMO corn is used, can certified organic growers use it and will European markets allow it? How do home gardeners feel? And if plants are grown in soil treated with GMO corn gluten, could a crop pick up anything that show a positive GMO detect in testing?

[gixxerific]

DDF [url=https://www.bradfieldorganics.com/corngluten900.html]here[/url] is where I get mine from. I tried to run the [url=https://www.bradfieldorganics.com/MSDS/Bradfield_MSDS_9-0-0.pdf]materail data sheet[/url] but my pc was just renewed due to problems and is not yet up to par. If you can view it maybe you you could make your opinion based on this.

But than again my friend wouldn't you rather use GMO corn gluten over anything Scots etc?

The brand I use is also endorsed by Paul Tukey (sp) who is very much into organic principles. So far be it from me to challenge him. You can see the vid [url=https://www.safelawns.org/video.cfm?action=view&video_id=15&show_sponsor=true&KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=320&width=400]here[/url]. Check out the rest of his site while there lots of goo stuff to be read and viewed.

[DoubleDogFarm]

DDF here is where I get mine from. I tried to run the materail data sheet but my pc was just renewed due to problems and is not yet up to par. If you can view it maybe you you could make your opinion based on this.

Neither the link or the hazardous material sheet have anything to do with GMO's. GMO in my opinion is not Organic. The video tells me nothing either. We have used corn gluten in the landscape business, but only on gravel paths and driveways. If you apply this to your garden for nitrogen, don't be planting any seeds for 60 days.

GMOs,
If you apply corn gluten to your property and it's 60% gmo corn Are you willing to pay the patent fees (Royalties) to Monsanto. I am not. Look up GMO and the horror stories. He who controls the food controls the world.

[Ozark Lady]

I keep looking at the ruin, the electric company did... all dead and yucky looking.
I would like to extend my garden, to do that to the north is to run into the herbicide areas. To the east, is the highway, and to the west is the mint patch, that I allot to the bees, south is heavy forest.

I look at my future garden, it is still tree covered. But, at this edge of it, I could begin gardening, except there is a strip of about 8 feet where the electric company did their diabolical spraying.

Okay, so does that herbicide get into my soil?
What do I do with the plants killed by it?
Can I remove the dead mess, and plant?
I read to test whether a field is still herbicide issue you plant beans and if they won't grow you know there is a problem.
I can't grow beans on a good day, so how is that going to help?
I suppose I could plant some in a none sprayed area and compare what they do?

How do I go about cleaning my land of the filth of that herbicide mess?
Where do I start? By removing the dead stuff I am sure, but do I need gloves and trash bags, and simply put it in a landfill?
Can I give it to the electric company? It is their mess after all!
And get this, the tall trees that touch the line, are alive and sprouting! They killed my stuff, and polluted my soil in vain! Grrrr.

[gixxerific]

OL dig it up and drop it off at their front door with a gallon of gas and a match to boot.

Of course don't actually do that ............................................

[applestar]

When they had that "hay field broadleaf herbicide passed through horses
digestive system and ended upin manure" problem in England, the plants that showed the symptoms were tomatoes and potatoes (tiny mutant leaves and shoots). So why not try tossing some tomato seeds there?

[Ozark Lady]

I took photos today, of the tall ones, with leaves, and the destruction underneath of my elder berries and grapes, that won't even get up there. I will definitely deliver the photos to the electric company, maybe even the newspaper. I am that furious.

I will also bag up the trash and photograph that... The war is on!

I am also making no spray signs so they can't sneak in here and do this again.

I look all around, the worst of their spraying is not viewable from the highway, or they didn't do this anywhere but here.
There is just a bit of odd brush here and there that they sprayed, that I can see driving through... grrrr.

I like the tomato idea. I will plant some there, and when they are yucky, I will take photos of that too. Wonder how the electric company will like that publicity? Can they say "public image"?

[Sage Hermit]

I saw the most disturbing video the other day onn youtube.

A guy in a spray tank back pack comes up to a guys bee hives and intentionally sprays the bees. The owner beat the EDITED - PLEASE REPORT THIS POST out of him.

I swear I will kill anyone who sprays my hives.

[Ozark Lady]

Not if we get him or her first, ha ha...

And I don't even have a hive. I have backed off on bee keeping for this year, just no free time, to get them started. But, I am still a bee keeper wannabe, someday.

I actually protect mint, which is a nuisance, because I know the bees like it.

Oh, I get mad over one bee being swatted, don't even go there about a whole hive! They will move, just give them a moment, no one needs to swat them!

[gixxerific]

He should have gave him a dose of his own "poison" while he was at it Sage.

I had to explain last year to my than DD3 not to kill the bees. She's a killer at heart, shes the one my DS8 goes to for spider stompin'

[gixxerific]

OH MY!

Just went to see if I could find that link Sage. But there is an enormous amount of bee killing videos on You tube. Some just for the fun of it. How terrible is that. really I just don't know what to say about this.

I'm embarrassed to be called a human.

[Ozark Lady]

Hey, don't mess with a gardener and their greenery!

I have a date Wednesday, with the head hancho of the spraying department at the Electric Company. We are going to do a walk through.

I offered him photos, and asked:
What did you use? (Roundup similar stuff)
When are you going to come clean up your mess and haul if off? (don't know when we can get to it)
How do I get on the no spray list? (Ma'am we will never touch your land with spray again!)

He agrees, I should not plant a huge tree in their right of way, and infringe on their use of the air, and they should not ever infringe on my use and enjoyment of the bottom 8 feet of my land, no matter in what way I enjoy it, flower bed, hedgerow, or whatever... unless it can reach the power lines above!

So, no compensation, I am sure, not what I wanted anyhow. But, vindication that what they did was so wrong.

He even asked... Do you sell organic produce? If so this will violate your certificate. I replied, not certified organic, but I eat organically. What gives you or anyone else the right to spray poison on elderberries and blackberries that I like to eat?

He denies that they kill food plants, and said they hired a contractor...

Yes, a contractor that not one person on the crew spoke english, and when my son was telling them no they nodded and kept spraying!

So, likely nothing to gain by my protest, but I still am going to make them accountable for the mess they made. If only by wasting the head man's time in walking over the mess. Think that will discourage their spraying?
I told him, there was a 5 minute job cutting tall trees, and instead they wasted an hour killing brush, and the trees are alive and well!
How is that cost efficient?

Don't mess with my greenery... I eat wild plants!
Makes me a wild woman! ha ha
I know, I am mean.

[DoubleDogFarm]

ON your walk around, ask him, what the cost differences would be in, installing all utilities in the ground vrs maintenance overhead. Our Island is slowly puting everything in the ground. Fewer outages do to trees falling, branches, car wreckes, etc.

[Ozark Lady]

When I lived in Eastern Arkansas, every time you turned around we had power outages.
Finally, the power company went through and put them all underground. No more unsightly power lines! No more power outages!
It was great.

But as I moved west, first to Central Arkansas and finally to the Western edge, they have poles again.
The logic is that it is too expensive to go underground with all the dynamiting they would have to do.

Golly, the phone company put their line underground, and my line from the meter to the house is underground, and inspected!

Septic tanks and septic lines all must be down below the frost line. Hmmm?

I probably won't gain a thing, out of my protest, but it is definitely making a statement that I am very unhappy with what they have done. And the contractor will probably get asked to be more particular in where they spray.

It will be in their records, every time a customer protests what they are doing. And sooner or later, they will see it is not cost efficient to annoy the customer.

[cynthia_h]

Be sure and drag him up hill and down dale, showing him *everything* the contractor destroyed.

Get it in writing that they won't ever do that again. Have him write it out himself and sign it with his business title, stapling his business card to the paper.

The idea here is to take up AS MUCH OF HIS TIME as possible, increasing the expense.

Considering the expense they cost you...

Cynthia

[Ozark Lady]

We were unloading my new atrium in front of the house. I had the camera with me, so I just took this picture over the cab of the truck, that is parked in front of my front door.

[img]https://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww281/Ozark_Lady/000_0136_phixr.jpg[/img]

See the elderberry patch on the left? There are raspberries and blackberries, that I am naturalizing all along there. And these were tiny little patches. The one on the right that they murdered was my major source of elderberries.

They also killed a patch of elderberries, just starting outside the garden, I will get photos of that tomorrow, there weren't many elderberries there, but it will show how close to my garden they sprayed their poison.

[applestar]

Yes! Point out to him each and individual actual plants -- he'll probably just think of them as uniformly dead and brown vegetation=weeds.

[peachyness]

Ozark, I would be extremely livid if I were in your shoes! Just reading your posts made my blood boil.

And killing bees for fun? What's wrong with these people? How disturbing.

[The Helpful Gardener]

OL, I'm not so sure I'd let them know you don't want compensation. In fact I'd make like if I didin't get something in return I was gonna stink all over them...

There are only two things corporations understand. One is money and the other is marketing. I'd hit them in one or the other, if not both. Who do you know at the local paper? Get them to do a story. Got a friend or aquaintance in radio or TV? Band the neighbors together and the story writes itself; they LOVE that sort of thing...

Want to make a big change? Make a big stink...

Make him sweat tomorrow...

HG

[Ozark Lady]

I am so glad that the major "mint" patches for the bees were not under the power lines at all.

Why are there so many folks in the world who only care about themselves, and not anyone or anything else?

Live bees, and live plants are not video games where you zap them and when you restart the game they are back again!

[GeorgiaGirl]

Ugh, I hate it too; I'm downwind AND downhill from my chemical-loving neighbor who also happens to be a complete freak who threw a lit firecracker at my puppy a few weeks ago. I would have a chat with him about it, but frankly I don't feel like being civil to someone who would assault a sweet beautiful pup. He's had his house for sale for almost 2 years now... wish someone would buy it or he would get foreclosed on and MOVE.

We want to have a well dug on our property, but we fear all the chemicals that would wash right into it!

[Ozark Lady]

Here is the north edge of the garden:
[img]https://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww281/Ozark_Lady/000_0145_phixr.jpg[/img]

The large bin, is for leaves and compost, at the moment it is holding the dirt and compost that I hauled home.

The tables are the seed starting tables.

Look on the left, see where they sprayed? A bit too close in my opinion.

I changed angles, same basic area, see the compost bin on the right?

[img]https://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww281/Ozark_Lady/000_0149_phixr.jpg[/img]
And of course, Lady always hams for the camera. But, again you see, they sprayed right up to my garden fence!

See the highway? I like to keep a hedgerow of wild things there, to protect my garden, and give me some privacy, plus I grow grapevines on the fence.

My goodness, I hadn't realized how the trees in and around my garden have grown until I saw these photos.

Hard to believe that I still have to shade some of the garden!

[GeorgiaGirl]

Ugh, I hate it too; I'm downwind AND downhill from my chemical-loving neighbor who also happens to be a complete freak who threw a lit firecracker at my puppy a few weeks ago. I would have a chat with him about it, but frankly I don't feel like being civil to someone who would assault a sweet beautiful pup. He's had his house for sale for almost 2 years now... wish someone would buy it or he would get foreclosed on and MOVE.

We want to have a well dug on our property, but we fear all the chemicals that would wash right into it!