Since we have gardeners from all over, I wanted to ask about your experience with using season extension techniques and devices. Let's exclude larger permanent structure like greenhouses and semi-permanent high tunnels, which is a topic all on it's own.
I want to ask about coldframes and low/med poly tunnels. Temporary extension into late fall, removed at some point for winter, and early spring that are set up while the ground is still frozen. Also something sturdier that can make it through winter storms and not fall in from the ice and snowcover....
I'm asking because temp drop to low 20's is coming (forecast for Tues), and I'm trying to decide between covering with low tunnels vs. not bothering. Low 20's is pretty severe, it's already hovering at low 30's and many of the plants are not growing or have shut down though the leaves still look good. Once the sustained freeze is here, the leaves will be tattered and unusable.
So harvest now or cover?
In my area, I can expect 20's through December (this is a little early for it to start) and then regular dips into teens in late December with extra plummets into single digits and negative single digits around NYE and through January. February will see teens and twenties with first thaw and sugar maple tapping season (freeze/thaw cycle) starting around late February. And first peas and other early spring sowing around mid March.
So how much protection will do any good? Do you leave some secure, sturdy protection up over the winter that would get them through the winter rather than the winter weather killing them off completely? What kind of overwintering crops?
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applestar
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Huh. The question may become moot for this season because I just saw that they revised the forecast and now it's going down to 28°F TONIGHT ( expecting 25°F or so adjust for my garden). The FORECAST for Tues night is now 23°F 
...but let's talk about this topic. One of my winter projects is building a framed coldframe
...but let's talk about this topic. One of my winter projects is building a framed coldframe
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pepperhead212
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I make a short hoophouse to cover my greens with every season, making the hoops out of bent 1/2" metal conduit. To support the hoops I make a run of 1" PVC on both sides of the bed, with 5' pieces spliced together with tees, with 6-7" scraps of PVC vertical in the tees, to push the hoops into. The 6 mil plastic I get in remnant form - the first one lasted 5 years, and may have lasted one more, if it were not for that terrible winter last year. I clip the plastic on one side, then toss a bunch of dirt on that side, as well, to weight it down, then the other side I weight down with a bunch of old cast iron window weights, as well as pieces of pipe. This way, I can easily remove them, and get in to harvest in the winter, then replace them quickly. The most resistant Asian greens live when it is down in the single digits outside, and keep on producing!
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ElizabethB
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pepperhead212
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Did your plants survive, AppleStar?
Extending the season on the "front end," with small tunnels, and once with a coldframe, has been my experience. That is, until I had built a "colossal coldframe."
My problem with the coldframe years ago was regulating the temperature in such a small structure. I've encountered some of the same problems with my springtime low tunnels. The tunnels, however, are 4' by 10' and have hoops that keep the plastic film about 3' above the soil surface. All of that makes for quite a few more cubic feet than is enclosed by most coldframes.
Now, my "colossal coldframe" is my greenhouse. A better name is probably a "sunshed." The roof, north wall and parts of the east & west walls are standard, insulated frame construction. Only the sloping south wall of the 9' by 20' building is covered by plastic film. So you see, it is something like a very large coldframe but one I can walk in ... and, extend the season with fall and winter greens by protecting them further in there, under a low tunnel.
Here are some inside and outside temperatures I recorded:
83° in the greenhouse at 1:30pm, 35° outdoors (high for the day)
40° at 7:30pm, 25° outdoors
38° at 7:30am under the low tunnel, 26° in the greenhouse, 15° outdoors
Steve
Extending the season on the "front end," with small tunnels, and once with a coldframe, has been my experience. That is, until I had built a "colossal coldframe."
My problem with the coldframe years ago was regulating the temperature in such a small structure. I've encountered some of the same problems with my springtime low tunnels. The tunnels, however, are 4' by 10' and have hoops that keep the plastic film about 3' above the soil surface. All of that makes for quite a few more cubic feet than is enclosed by most coldframes.
Now, my "colossal coldframe" is my greenhouse. A better name is probably a "sunshed." The roof, north wall and parts of the east & west walls are standard, insulated frame construction. Only the sloping south wall of the 9' by 20' building is covered by plastic film. So you see, it is something like a very large coldframe but one I can walk in ... and, extend the season with fall and winter greens by protecting them further in there, under a low tunnel.
Here are some inside and outside temperatures I recorded:
83° in the greenhouse at 1:30pm, 35° outdoors (high for the day)
40° at 7:30pm, 25° outdoors
38° at 7:30am under the low tunnel, 26° in the greenhouse, 15° outdoors
Steve
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applestar
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See, that sort of data definitely make it seem worthwhile to experiment with different structures.
...but they've revised the forecast for tues night to 19°F
-- I feel like giving up on these fall and overwintering crops already and just concentrate on what I want to do next spring. BUT I did sow and have little seedlings of some Walla Walla onions and broccoli growing that I'd like to see make it over the winter, so I guess I'll maybe try *something*
...but they've revised the forecast for tues night to 19°F
-- I feel like giving up on these fall and overwintering crops already and just concentrate on what I want to do next spring. BUT I did sow and have little seedlings of some Walla Walla onions and broccoli growing that I'd like to see make it over the winter, so I guess I'll maybe try *something*I know that the 4 season greenhouse harvest isn't quite what you were hoping for. But, AppleStar! You might be doing about the same thing thru the winter with a high(er) tunnel, over 2 beds, and 2 low tunnels inside. I set up a door frame and attach film with lathe every spring for a tunnel (even if I don't have low tunnels inside 
).
Okay, on my little springtime tunnels, I use a 10' board on each side. Lathe and nails hold the film. I can roll one side up and sit it on a couple of milk crates for ventilation.
I don't trust the boards to hold the film tight during windy nights. I've got bricks to add some extra weight. If I get a little too anxious about the wind: 4 stakes, 1 at each corner, and some baling twine over the top is insurance enuf.
Steve
).Okay, on my little springtime tunnels, I use a 10' board on each side. Lathe and nails hold the film. I can roll one side up and sit it on a couple of milk crates for ventilation.
I don't trust the boards to hold the film tight during windy nights. I've got bricks to add some extra weight. If I get a little too anxious about the wind: 4 stakes, 1 at each corner, and some baling twine over the top is insurance enuf.
Steve-
applestar
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Currently 27°F, daytime high of 31°F and forecast for tonight revised to 20°F with windchill in the teens. I walked around and everywhere I looked, my garden and sometimes winter hardy greens are frozen looking this morning after mid-20's overnight and singing "We're not gonna *MAKE IT* ...NO We ain't gonna *MAKE IT*...." 
But I really want to make it a priority to plan and build something next year. Thanks for all the input and expertise.
A couple of winters ago, we had an unusual winter and it never went down below 20's and the following winter was also unusual with repeated extremely heavy snowfall and snowcover lasting almost all through the winter. For those two winters, I had a taste of overwintered crops and extra early spring harvest. I really would love to replicate that, but I do have to plan ahead and it's going to take more than a slap on bubblegum and band-aid together build....
But I really want to make it a priority to plan and build something next year. Thanks for all the input and expertise.
A couple of winters ago, we had an unusual winter and it never went down below 20's and the following winter was also unusual with repeated extremely heavy snowfall and snowcover lasting almost all through the winter. For those two winters, I had a taste of overwintered crops and extra early spring harvest. I really would love to replicate that, but I do have to plan ahead and it's going to take more than a slap on bubblegum and band-aid together build....
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Gardener_Wes
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applestar
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Revisiting this thread to ask -- today's forecast is 41°F high and 16°F low. There's a dip down into single digit overnight on Thurs-Fri, but starting this weekend and into next week, the numbers are going to be in the mid to upper 40's high and 28°F + to low 30's low.
I have cold weather seedlings (broccoli, spinach, onions, tatsoi, overwintered lettuce, etc.) in the garage V8 Nursery where it has been as cold as mid to upper 20's, generally hovering just above freezing at 34°F or so, and I would like to move them out to make room for seedlings and plants that can handle 40's and above as soon as things warm up a bit.
It seems like next week would be about the right time to be able to harden off the cold weather crops to go outside in an unheated coldframe or poly tunnel. Is that correct?
What is the right timing to start using them? How do you go about it?
I have cold weather seedlings (broccoli, spinach, onions, tatsoi, overwintered lettuce, etc.) in the garage V8 Nursery where it has been as cold as mid to upper 20's, generally hovering just above freezing at 34°F or so, and I would like to move them out to make room for seedlings and plants that can handle 40's and above as soon as things warm up a bit.
It seems like next week would be about the right time to be able to harden off the cold weather crops to go outside in an unheated coldframe or poly tunnel. Is that correct?
What is the right timing to start using them? How do you go about it?
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applestar
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Yesterday, I took a peek under my double 3 mil low tunnel which I used to protect a row of fall sown Walla Walla onions, some fall-planted garlic and shallots.... A whiff of oniony smell as I pulled up one side... and I was so excited to see that the Walla Wallas had survived! 
...I also saw a bunch of holes -- Voles? Chipmunks? Voles?
-- especially along the edging timber....
I was wondering -- NOW WHAT?
-- it's been as warm as 50's to 60's during the day -- I was concerned that it would get too not under there -- but we are expecting dips in the high to mid 20's this week. At what point should I remove the plastic cover? Should I switch to single layer 3-mil for now, and later to fleece?
...I also saw a bunch of holes -- Voles? Chipmunks? Voles?
-- especially along the edging timber....I was wondering -- NOW WHAT?
-- it's been as warm as 50's to 60's during the day -- I was concerned that it would get too not under there -- but we are expecting dips in the high to mid 20's this week. At what point should I remove the plastic cover? Should I switch to single layer 3-mil for now, and later to fleece?
I don't know about covering your Walla Walla Sweets. I only sowed seed at the end of August and tried overwintering them 3 or 4 times. No cover was provided. Their problem was not survival; it was bolting to seed in the spring. I got the idea that any severe cold would prompt that. It was going to be successful here only after mild winters.
I do think you should do something about the voles.
Flooding their burrows may work. I have taken about 30 minutes with a long metal rod and a hammer to rid my garden of gophers a couple of times. I doubt if I hit him but it was not for a lack of trying. Take a stool and try to hit just about every square inch, anywhere around where you think they may be. Consider it a cultivation technique to help keep you going.
Harassing ground squirrels and marmots has also worked for me but I figured a metal rod wasn't going to work for them. They seemed to get the message that life will be very difficult if they stayed, so they moved on. At least, I didn't find any more evidence of them.
Steve
I do think you should do something about the voles.
Flooding their burrows may work. I have taken about 30 minutes with a long metal rod and a hammer to rid my garden of gophers a couple of times. I doubt if I hit him but it was not for a lack of trying. Take a stool and try to hit just about every square inch, anywhere around where you think they may be. Consider it a cultivation technique to help keep you going.
Harassing ground squirrels and marmots has also worked for me but I figured a metal rod wasn't going to work for them. They seemed to get the message that life will be very difficult if they stayed, so they moved on. At least, I didn't find any more evidence of them.
Steve