I would like to buy a really cool red maple that has multiple trunks.
Any advice before i go buy one?
Thnx
K5
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Advice on a Japanese Red Maple?
~ Ken ~
Kenshin14435,
If I understand your question correctly you wish to purchase a finished tree. If this is correct you should start saving your money and in the meantime go to your local box store and get a couple of $20.00 one gallon trees and begin to learn how to manage them.
Seriously, a quality tree will easily cost hundreds of dollars, if not more. Better to get the experience you need by working on lesser material. I know from your other posts you are just starting out and it would be a painful setback to spend a lot on a tree and lose it to the kind of foolish mistakes that we all make in the beginning.
Here is a link to a few vendors that have Maples so that you can get an idea of development and pricing.
[url]https://www.hollowcreekbonsai.com/productCat32709.ctlg[/url]
[url]https://home.comcast.net/~okamigardens/catalog/catalog1.htm#finished[/url]
This one sold for $675.00
[img]https://www.thegrowinggrounds.com/gallery/images/66.jpg[/img]
And you could buy a nice car for the price this one might sell for.
[img]https://walter-pall.de/asuper_shots.jpg.dir/images/2006_04_dsc_3698v.jpg[/img]
Norm
If I understand your question correctly you wish to purchase a finished tree. If this is correct you should start saving your money and in the meantime go to your local box store and get a couple of $20.00 one gallon trees and begin to learn how to manage them.
Seriously, a quality tree will easily cost hundreds of dollars, if not more. Better to get the experience you need by working on lesser material. I know from your other posts you are just starting out and it would be a painful setback to spend a lot on a tree and lose it to the kind of foolish mistakes that we all make in the beginning.
Here is a link to a few vendors that have Maples so that you can get an idea of development and pricing.
[url]https://www.hollowcreekbonsai.com/productCat32709.ctlg[/url]
[url]https://home.comcast.net/~okamigardens/catalog/catalog1.htm#finished[/url]
This one sold for $675.00
[img]https://www.thegrowinggrounds.com/gallery/images/66.jpg[/img]
And you could buy a nice car for the price this one might sell for.
[img]https://walter-pall.de/asuper_shots.jpg.dir/images/2006_04_dsc_3698v.jpg[/img]
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
WOW
ok ummmmmm.............WOW!
a new car!
don't we all wish for something like that.
I knew some of them cost ALOT of money.
I've seen some that cost over 50 thousand.
And this will be duely noted.
Say Norm, My neighbor has a Japanese Red Maple in their side yard, do you think it would be okay if i take a grouping off?(with their permission of course)
Thnx for info
K5
a new car!
don't we all wish for something like that.
I knew some of them cost ALOT of money.
I've seen some that cost over 50 thousand.
And this will be duely noted.
Say Norm, My neighbor has a Japanese Red Maple in their side yard, do you think it would be okay if i take a grouping off?(with their permission of course)
Thnx for info
K5
~ Ken ~
Kenshin14435,
I'm glad that my remarks did not put you off, it was not my intention to be discouraging just honest. I still suggest that you get one this year to learn how to manage it.
Japanese Maples can be propagated by seedlings, cuttings or air layers. An air layer seems to be the most probable for what you are interested in. Look for a branch that splits into two or three trunks. Take your time and locate a good section. You may even wish to try this on a less desirable section first and save the better one for next year.
If you are not familiar with air layering it is a technique that allows you to develop roots on a branch while it is still attached to the donor tree, it is a shortcut in developing material. Wait until this years leaves are fully formed and hardened off a bit. One hint, make sure to get some rooting hormone. Don't skip this step.
[url]https://www.bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATLayering.html[/url]
[url]https://www.evergreengardenworks.com/airlayer.htm[/url]
Norm
I'm glad that my remarks did not put you off, it was not my intention to be discouraging just honest. I still suggest that you get one this year to learn how to manage it.
Japanese Maples can be propagated by seedlings, cuttings or air layers. An air layer seems to be the most probable for what you are interested in. Look for a branch that splits into two or three trunks. Take your time and locate a good section. You may even wish to try this on a less desirable section first and save the better one for next year.
If you are not familiar with air layering it is a technique that allows you to develop roots on a branch while it is still attached to the donor tree, it is a shortcut in developing material. Wait until this years leaves are fully formed and hardened off a bit. One hint, make sure to get some rooting hormone. Don't skip this step.
[url]https://www.bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATLayering.html[/url]
[url]https://www.evergreengardenworks.com/airlayer.htm[/url]
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Ok Norm
I finally took the advice and got myslf 2 groupings.
I was a little disappointed because all the leaves faced one way on all the the branches.
But anyway, here are some pics of all the groupings.
This is the broadest and reddest grouping I found. There is quite a bit of length to the stem because I thought the grouping might need some stability.Also the branch is completely flat.
This is the front.
This is the back.
[/img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Red%20Maple/IMAG0108.jpg[/img]
Ok, heres the second grouping. There are signifigantly less branches on this one than there is on the first on.
This is the front.
This is the back.
[/img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Red%20Maple/IMAG0110.jpg[/img]
I got both just incase one of them dies. Also, if you could tell me what would be best in order to keep these little things alive, that would be great.
Right now I have them in a pitcher of water.
I think first I'm going to put them in a deep pot to give them some stability, then I'll probably switch the pots whe the rots get long enough.
I know that I should get thm root stimulantbut havnt any idea of what kind.
Pretty much its like bein a NOOB all over again.
So pretty much tell me EVERYTHING that needs to be learnd.
Type of soil, what kind of sunlight, what kind of fertilizer for which different seasons, etc.
Thnx So much for all yallz help
K5
I finally took the advice and got myslf 2 groupings.
I was a little disappointed because all the leaves faced one way on all the the branches.
But anyway, here are some pics of all the groupings.
This is the broadest and reddest grouping I found. There is quite a bit of length to the stem because I thought the grouping might need some stability.Also the branch is completely flat.
This is the front.
This is the back.
[/img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Red%20Maple/IMAG0108.jpg[/img]
Ok, heres the second grouping. There are signifigantly less branches on this one than there is on the first on.
This is the front.
This is the back.
[/img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Red%20Maple/IMAG0110.jpg[/img]
I got both just incase one of them dies. Also, if you could tell me what would be best in order to keep these little things alive, that would be great.
Right now I have them in a pitcher of water.
I think first I'm going to put them in a deep pot to give them some stability, then I'll probably switch the pots whe the rots get long enough.
I know that I should get thm root stimulantbut havnt any idea of what kind.
Pretty much its like bein a NOOB all over again.
So pretty much tell me EVERYTHING that needs to be learnd.
Type of soil, what kind of sunlight, what kind of fertilizer for which different seasons, etc.
Thnx So much for all yallz help
K5
~ Ken ~
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Also root pruning. What about leaf pruning and all that?
Never had any experience in this kind of pruning.
Never had any experience in this kind of pruning.
Last edited by Kenshin14435 on Sun May 18, 2008 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
~ Ken ~
Ken,
Although Japanese Maples can be propagated from cuttings it is not always successful. Commercially expensive misting systems are used to keep humidity up. I have tried with cuttings a few times and the only luck I had was by keeping them under glass.
It is the wrong season for hardwood cuttings which are taken during the dormant period. last years wood at the base of your cuttings is an example of hardwood cuttings.
Softwood cuttings are taken from this years new growth after it hardens off a bit. The fresh new growth on your cuttings is an example of softwood cuttings. This is what you want at this time of year.
Make your cuttings approximately 4-6 inches in length. Use a razor knife and make a slanting cut below a node. Remove all the leaves except the upper leaves to reduce loss of water through transpiration. Apply rooting hormone and place the cuttings in your chosen medium.
You already have you medium prepared and your rooting hormone on hand right? If not leave the cuttings attached to the old wood and in water until you gather your supples. Get rooting hormone at most any nursery or home center.
Never let the cuttings dry or they will fail. I have used various sized jars to cover cuttings with good results. For a group of cuttings an old 10 gallon aquarium can be used. Either turn it upside down over the potted cuttings or place the cuttings in the aquarium and cover with a pane of glass or sheet of plastic.
[url]https://www.bonsai4me.com/Basics/Basics_Cuttings.html[/url]
[url]https://www.evergreengardenworks.com/cuttings.htm[/url]
Norm
What roots? These are cuttings right? Worry about roots next spring if you are lucky enough to get any.Also root pruning. What about root pruning?
I suggested that you purchase a nursery tree in order to learn their cultural requirements and to look into air layering for the twin trunk tree you initially inquired about.I finally took the advice and got myslf 2 groupings.
Although Japanese Maples can be propagated from cuttings it is not always successful. Commercially expensive misting systems are used to keep humidity up. I have tried with cuttings a few times and the only luck I had was by keeping them under glass.
It is the wrong season for hardwood cuttings which are taken during the dormant period. last years wood at the base of your cuttings is an example of hardwood cuttings.
Softwood cuttings are taken from this years new growth after it hardens off a bit. The fresh new growth on your cuttings is an example of softwood cuttings. This is what you want at this time of year.
Make your cuttings approximately 4-6 inches in length. Use a razor knife and make a slanting cut below a node. Remove all the leaves except the upper leaves to reduce loss of water through transpiration. Apply rooting hormone and place the cuttings in your chosen medium.
You already have you medium prepared and your rooting hormone on hand right? If not leave the cuttings attached to the old wood and in water until you gather your supples. Get rooting hormone at most any nursery or home center.
Never let the cuttings dry or they will fail. I have used various sized jars to cover cuttings with good results. For a group of cuttings an old 10 gallon aquarium can be used. Either turn it upside down over the potted cuttings or place the cuttings in the aquarium and cover with a pane of glass or sheet of plastic.
[url]https://www.bonsai4me.com/Basics/Basics_Cuttings.html[/url]
[url]https://www.evergreengardenworks.com/cuttings.htm[/url]
Norm
I got your pm Kenshin, but well after Norm replied. And, honestly, temperate species aren't really my bag anyway, you're much better off listening to Norm.
I can say that I've never had luck transplanting "dug up" maple seedlings, even year and two year old specimens. And cuttings, forget about it, I've tried, even with rooting hormones, with no luck. My advice, if you don't want to go with nursery pot stock or air layering, is that you set up a controllable environment, like Norm suggests, and take as many softwood cutting as possible now, or hardwood cuttings in the fall/winter. Thing is, though, with the effort and expenditure of time and money invloved in cuttings, it's more prudent to either air layer or buy a nuresery potted tree.
I can say that I've never had luck transplanting "dug up" maple seedlings, even year and two year old specimens. And cuttings, forget about it, I've tried, even with rooting hormones, with no luck. My advice, if you don't want to go with nursery pot stock or air layering, is that you set up a controllable environment, like Norm suggests, and take as many softwood cutting as possible now, or hardwood cuttings in the fall/winter. Thing is, though, with the effort and expenditure of time and money invloved in cuttings, it's more prudent to either air layer or buy a nuresery potted tree.
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
hahaha very funny on that first part norm.
But I guess your right.
Anyway, thnx for the advice.
My mom had homemade root hormone that she says almost never fails(we'll see bout that wont we!)
I used that stuff.
I have planted them into a water well planter thingy.(you fill it up with a hose in a pipe and the water travels down the 6 inch pipe into a water resevoir, which will over flow onto the ground if you put too much water in.)
And also, I did take your advice on buying that sapling from a grower but I had failed to remember to mention it and put a pix in(on a time schedule).
These branches that I had cut off though are pretty big(about 12 to 15 inches tall)and I plan to keep it that way for a while so they can grow their roots easier. Then I will cut alot of it off and shape it.
Also, I took some mature seeds from the red maple and planted them in a different planter. I planted 5 groupings of seeds, with each grouping consisting of 3 seeds.
I thought this might be good if the other trees fail.
When the cuttings have their roots I will probably buy them their own pot.
Now, here comes a really important question.
I'm thniking about buying a greenhouse for my bonsai plants.
It wont be permenant and can be taken dowwn very easy.
I will probably be getting it from
https://www.littlegreenhouse.com/
go on and take a look.
Is this a good idea for what im doing right now?
And about that aquarium.
That is a perfect thing you suggested!!!!
I have a ten footer with 1 fish left in it(dad forgot to put in the dechlorination chemical in it and all died except 1)
I'm going to get rid of that fish real soon anyway, so when I do that I'll do what you suggested.
Thnx so much.
K5
P.S.- How do you change your member rank? I noticed that kdodds rank changed. Does it have something to do with how many post you make?
But I guess your right.
Anyway, thnx for the advice.
My mom had homemade root hormone that she says almost never fails(we'll see bout that wont we!)
I used that stuff.
I have planted them into a water well planter thingy.(you fill it up with a hose in a pipe and the water travels down the 6 inch pipe into a water resevoir, which will over flow onto the ground if you put too much water in.)
And also, I did take your advice on buying that sapling from a grower but I had failed to remember to mention it and put a pix in(on a time schedule).
These branches that I had cut off though are pretty big(about 12 to 15 inches tall)and I plan to keep it that way for a while so they can grow their roots easier. Then I will cut alot of it off and shape it.
Also, I took some mature seeds from the red maple and planted them in a different planter. I planted 5 groupings of seeds, with each grouping consisting of 3 seeds.
I thought this might be good if the other trees fail.
When the cuttings have their roots I will probably buy them their own pot.
Now, here comes a really important question.
I'm thniking about buying a greenhouse for my bonsai plants.
It wont be permenant and can be taken dowwn very easy.
I will probably be getting it from
https://www.littlegreenhouse.com/
go on and take a look.
Is this a good idea for what im doing right now?
And about that aquarium.
That is a perfect thing you suggested!!!!
I have a ten footer with 1 fish left in it(dad forgot to put in the dechlorination chemical in it and all died except 1)
I'm going to get rid of that fish real soon anyway, so when I do that I'll do what you suggested.
Thnx so much.
K5
P.S.- How do you change your member rank? I noticed that kdodds rank changed. Does it have something to do with how many post you make?
~ Ken ~
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
ok everyone
I bought a book on bonsai called All About Bonsai by Ortho Books.
(No other known author)
It has Medium-to-High usefullness.
Has many good pix and describes great.
Although it does not go in depth on what kind of fertilizer, dirt and grit, etc.
I suggest this book and another that I found but could not buy(was not in stock).
The other book is Bonsai Survival Manual. I cannot remember the author or publisher off the top of my head.
K5
I bought a book on bonsai called All About Bonsai by Ortho Books.
(No other known author)
It has Medium-to-High usefullness.
Has many good pix and describes great.
Although it does not go in depth on what kind of fertilizer, dirt and grit, etc.
I suggest this book and another that I found but could not buy(was not in stock).
The other book is Bonsai Survival Manual. I cannot remember the author or publisher off the top of my head.
K5
Ken,
Thanks for letting us know about your impressions of that book. I do not own either of those particular volumes. The second one you mentioned was written by [url=https://www.bonsaiforum.com/colinlewisbonsai/index.html]Collin Lewis.[/url] Reviews can be found [url=https://www.amazon.com/review/product/0882668536/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1]here.[/url]
Norm
Thanks for letting us know about your impressions of that book. I do not own either of those particular volumes. The second one you mentioned was written by [url=https://www.bonsaiforum.com/colinlewisbonsai/index.html]Collin Lewis.[/url] Reviews can be found [url=https://www.amazon.com/review/product/0882668536/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1]here.[/url]
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
I also found some other books called "The Bonsai Workshop" by Herb L. Gustafson and Craig Coussins.
And...."Bonsai School: The Complete Course in Care, Training, and Maintenance"
I went around on the web and in other forums they said these books were very usefull.
Oh, and correction on the john naka book prices. They vary from 35 dollars to 240 dollars. Just thought I shouldput that out there.
K5
And...."Bonsai School: The Complete Course in Care, Training, and Maintenance"
I went around on the web and in other forums they said these books were very usefull.
Oh, and correction on the john naka book prices. They vary from 35 dollars to 240 dollars. Just thought I shouldput that out there.
K5
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Ok heres some news about today.
I went out to Lowes and bought some supplies for my bonsai.
I got a REALLY BIG bag of Miracle-Gro Moisture Control Potting Soil and a Small Bag of Miracle-Gro Seed Starting Potting Soil.
I also got a watering can, root hormone, cutters, a tray, some screen, pea pebbles, etc.
I spent over 65 dollars on all this, but the story is even better.
I got to Lowes and not 5 minutes of walking around in the gardening center I lost my wallet. I had on basketball shorts on with one pocket.........and that pocket has a hole in it.(I noticed this after I lost my wallet of course.)
I spent around 5 minutes looking for it then I went to the cash regster and they had found it and gave it back. THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Then after I had gotten all my stuff I found out that I had forgotten to move the money from my savings account to my checking account.
Thankfully my dad comes to the rescue and pays for it.THANK GOD!!!!!(again)
Dad wasnt too happy after all this.
Then when I got home I repoted my bonsai with the screen on the bottom of the pot, a thin layer of pebbles, and the moisture control mix.
It looks a thousand times better now.(pix will be at bottom of this post.
And I got 2 mame sized japanese maple saplings from my curtious neighbor.
I put those in small pots(used all potting materials listed above).
Pix at bottom of post.
Then I took the seeds out and repotted them in The seed starting mix.
So right now I am very content.
I will also be buying a portable greenhouse by FlowerHouse.
It wont be that much money.
I cant get a permenant one because I cant afford it, but oh-well.
Its a little 4 foot by 4 foot by 4 foot 8 inches.
Here are the pix I promised.
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0121.jpg[/img]
Front
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0113.jpg[/img]
Back
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0114.jpg[/img]
Top
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0117.jpg[/img]
First Mame
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0115.jpg[/img]
Second Mame
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0118.jpg[/img]
Five groups of 3 seeds(covered in soil)
Hope you enjoyed!!!
K5
I went out to Lowes and bought some supplies for my bonsai.
I got a REALLY BIG bag of Miracle-Gro Moisture Control Potting Soil and a Small Bag of Miracle-Gro Seed Starting Potting Soil.
I also got a watering can, root hormone, cutters, a tray, some screen, pea pebbles, etc.
I spent over 65 dollars on all this, but the story is even better.
I got to Lowes and not 5 minutes of walking around in the gardening center I lost my wallet. I had on basketball shorts on with one pocket.........and that pocket has a hole in it.(I noticed this after I lost my wallet of course.)
I spent around 5 minutes looking for it then I went to the cash regster and they had found it and gave it back. THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Then after I had gotten all my stuff I found out that I had forgotten to move the money from my savings account to my checking account.
Thankfully my dad comes to the rescue and pays for it.THANK GOD!!!!!(again)
Dad wasnt too happy after all this.
Then when I got home I repoted my bonsai with the screen on the bottom of the pot, a thin layer of pebbles, and the moisture control mix.
It looks a thousand times better now.(pix will be at bottom of this post.
And I got 2 mame sized japanese maple saplings from my curtious neighbor.
I put those in small pots(used all potting materials listed above).
Pix at bottom of post.
Then I took the seeds out and repotted them in The seed starting mix.
So right now I am very content.
I will also be buying a portable greenhouse by FlowerHouse.
It wont be that much money.
I cant get a permenant one because I cant afford it, but oh-well.
Its a little 4 foot by 4 foot by 4 foot 8 inches.
Here are the pix I promised.
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0121.jpg[/img]
Front
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0113.jpg[/img]
Back
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0114.jpg[/img]
Top
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0117.jpg[/img]
First Mame
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0115.jpg[/img]
Second Mame
[img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Mame%20Bonsai/IMAG0118.jpg[/img]
Five groups of 3 seeds(covered in soil)
Hope you enjoyed!!!
K5
Ken,
I'm glad you found your wallet I thought I lost mine a few times but luckily it always turned up.
I'm surprised that you re-potted the Juniper again and chose such a dense medium despite my comments in the other thread.
The Maple seedlings will need to be grown out for years before much in the way of training can be attempted. The potting soil is not so troubling for the seedlings and the seeds you have. If you are having trouble finding an inorganic component look for Perlite, Lowes will carry it.
Norm
While these books are highly regarded by most bonsai enthusiasts they may not be the best choice for a novice.I found a book called "Bonsai Techniques" by john naka.
There is a second one called "Bonsai Techniques 2" also by john naka.
They are out of print and can only be bought used for around 35-40 dollars a peice. Should I get these books???
I own 'The Bonsai Workshop' by Gustafson and have found it useful but the pictures and the text do not always coincide with one another which makes following the sequences a little difficult. My copy Is by Gustafson alone though.I also found some other books called "The Bonsai Workshop" by Herb L. Gustafson and Craig Coussins.
I'm glad you found your wallet I thought I lost mine a few times but luckily it always turned up.
I'm surprised that you re-potted the Juniper again and chose such a dense medium despite my comments in the other thread.
I wish you luck with it but if it fails do not let it get you down, it has had a rough time of it recently. The next time you are at the nursery look at the Junipers there. Nursery stock can make decent bonsai especially if you choose wisely. By the way it is not too late to work on Junipers so if you do find one perhaps you can make some progress with it this year.It would have been better if you had not been so hasty. Apparently you root-pruned it and replanted it in the same soil it came in. Correct? Junipers really benefit from a very gritty, free draining medium. Junipers can suffer from root rot if they are kept consistently wet and a medium that is finely textured and heavy in organic matter is more difficult to manage.
The Maple seedlings will need to be grown out for years before much in the way of training can be attempted. The potting soil is not so troubling for the seedlings and the seeds you have. If you are having trouble finding an inorganic component look for Perlite, Lowes will carry it.
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Thank you for your advice Nome.
I think I probably should add some sand or something like it to the soil.
We'll see how it does first. I was very surprised to see how much the roots have grown since my last repot. I am very aware that those saplings will take a couple of years to grow-out to the point where I can start shaping. I took all that into consideration before I started on them.
But it also allows time to see what kind of shape it will take on it's own, and you get to know more "personaly". Meaning yuo will learn to know what it tends to ike and what it tends to not like.
Also, I will be visiting the National Bonsai and Penjing Museum at the National Arboretum this memorial day Monday. Just a question, but is anybody a National Bonsai Foundation member?
I just joined a couple days ago.
Thnx
K5
I think I probably should add some sand or something like it to the soil.
We'll see how it does first. I was very surprised to see how much the roots have grown since my last repot. I am very aware that those saplings will take a couple of years to grow-out to the point where I can start shaping. I took all that into consideration before I started on them.
But it also allows time to see what kind of shape it will take on it's own, and you get to know more "personaly". Meaning yuo will learn to know what it tends to ike and what it tends to not like.
Also, I will be visiting the National Bonsai and Penjing Museum at the National Arboretum this memorial day Monday. Just a question, but is anybody a National Bonsai Foundation member?
I just joined a couple days ago.
Thnx
K5
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Wow, Haven't been to this thread in a while.
Anyway, I have a little 4 inch sapling(maple) and I want to turn it into a mame bonsai. But in order to do this I have to leaf prune 2/3 of all leaves starting from the top. Only 1 problem though..........theres only 7 leaves.
I did a quick calculation and found I would would have to trim 4 leaves off(4.6 if you ask a calculator ) I have some pix of it .
Here they are. Oh, the lighting isn't good in any part of my house so it may look a little weird.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010002.jpg[/img][/img]
This is a veiw of the mini tree I'm talking about. It may look like there is a dead leaf hanging from it, but there is not, it is the angle at which I took the picture.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010003.jpg[/img][/img]
Heres another angle. I think this angle is better than the first.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010004.jpg[/img][/img]
This is a top view of the tree.
I haven't pruned this thing at all because I really don't want it to die. It is the early summer over hear so this is the time to do this leaf prune(according to the book). I haven't root pruned either.
I want to know if I can take these leaves off without doing any damage to the tree.
Thnx
Ken
Anyway, I have a little 4 inch sapling(maple) and I want to turn it into a mame bonsai. But in order to do this I have to leaf prune 2/3 of all leaves starting from the top. Only 1 problem though..........theres only 7 leaves.
I did a quick calculation and found I would would have to trim 4 leaves off(4.6 if you ask a calculator
) I have some pix of it .Here they are. Oh, the lighting isn't good in any part of my house so it may look a little weird.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010002.jpg[/img][/img]
This is a veiw of the mini tree I'm talking about. It may look like there is a dead leaf hanging from it, but there is not, it is the angle at which I took the picture.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010003.jpg[/img][/img]
Heres another angle. I think this angle is better than the first.
[img][img]https://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk207/Kenshin14435/Maple%20Seedlings/S4010004.jpg[/img][/img]
This is a top view of the tree.
I haven't pruned this thing at all because I really don't want it to die. It is the early summer over hear so this is the time to do this leaf prune(according to the book). I haven't root pruned either.
I want to know if I can take these leaves off without doing any damage to the tree.
Thnx
Ken
~ Ken ~
Ken,
Don't prune anything. This tree is way to young to worry about leaf pruning/defoliation or even styling in general. Let it grow unchecked for a few years. Also, bonsai pots are reserved for trees that are already to an advanced state of development. Using a bonsai pot so soon not only looks out of place but can even slow development of young stock. The pot you have it in now though is large enough to be essentially a growing container, so I'd leave well enough alone for the remainder of this year.
Mame can be difficult, creating a realistic image on such a small scale takes experience. Consider moving up one classification to shohin. The trunk of your tree is pretty thin still. The way to develop a stout trunk is to grow the tree out and later cut it back. This growth increase the girth of the trunk, adds taper and movement.
Decide on a style and size you wish to develop. Other decisions will stem from those. Look closely at the lower stem and observe if there are any nodes from previous growth. They will look like rings or bands around the stem, it is from these locations that new growth will emerge if/when you do prune it back.
No matter what you decide a newly potted tree is not ready for the stress you are considering right now.
[url]https://www.shohin-europe.com/ARTICLES-whatisashohin-bonsai.html[/url]
Norm
Don't prune anything. This tree is way to young to worry about leaf pruning/defoliation or even styling in general. Let it grow unchecked for a few years. Also, bonsai pots are reserved for trees that are already to an advanced state of development. Using a bonsai pot so soon not only looks out of place but can even slow development of young stock. The pot you have it in now though is large enough to be essentially a growing container, so I'd leave well enough alone for the remainder of this year.
Mame can be difficult, creating a realistic image on such a small scale takes experience. Consider moving up one classification to shohin. The trunk of your tree is pretty thin still. The way to develop a stout trunk is to grow the tree out and later cut it back. This growth increase the girth of the trunk, adds taper and movement.
Decide on a style and size you wish to develop. Other decisions will stem from those. Look closely at the lower stem and observe if there are any nodes from previous growth. They will look like rings or bands around the stem, it is from these locations that new growth will emerge if/when you do prune it back.
No matter what you decide a newly potted tree is not ready for the stress you are considering right now.
[url]https://www.shohin-europe.com/ARTICLES-whatisashohin-bonsai.html[/url]
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Ok, thanx Norm. I was just wondering if I could do anything.
I chose that pot because I have two young maples, so I decided I would put them in there instead of having 2 different pots. There is another one in there but it's a year younger than the one that is shown in the pix above. It only has 2 leaves. I know I can't do anything to that one for a long time.
Also, what size do thing a good starter maple woud be. I'm having a problem finding one around here. They're all a good 4- 5 foot tall and cost 70-80 bucks. Thats a big problem for me 'cause I have a limited money budget(as do all kids my age). I can't seem to find any that are nice and short(maybe a foot or two in height)at a low cost. Although, I haven't been looking online. That maybe my downfall there.
I have another question about the 7 leafer. How many years do you estimate I will have to wait 'till I can do anything.
Thanx so much!
Ken
I chose that pot because I have two young maples, so I decided I would put them in there instead of having 2 different pots. There is another one in there but it's a year younger than the one that is shown in the pix above. It only has 2 leaves. I know I can't do anything to that one for a long time.
Also, what size do thing a good starter maple woud be. I'm having a problem finding one around here. They're all a good 4- 5 foot tall and cost 70-80 bucks. Thats a big problem for me 'cause I have a limited money budget(as do all kids my age). I can't seem to find any that are nice and short(maybe a foot or two in height)at a low cost. Although, I haven't been looking online. That maybe my downfall there.
I have another question about the 7 leafer. How many years do you estimate I will have to wait 'till I can do anything.
Thanx so much!
Ken
~ Ken ~
-
constantstaticx3
- Green Thumb
- Posts: 391
- Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 7:24 pm
- Location: Haddonfield, NJ
Atleast 5years. These trees grow pretty slowly, to my experience with them, and you have picked the longest route to take. I have a few little ones a little older than yours. One is about as small as your first one that needs a lot of growing and another is a bit bigger. I have decided to keep the bigger one the way it is because of its elegant shape. I have decided to ground layer that one to at least have a nice nebari on it.How many years do you estimate I will have to wait 'till I can do anything.
In order to create a believable tree, you must have a mature trunk. The larger maples you are talking about are actually a good price and you can get multiple trees out of them by air layering before you cut it down to size. Make sure they have a decent nebari though, or if not you can always ground layer.
Tom
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Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Ok, I've come up with a grand plan.
I'm going to buy a good nursery Japanese Red Maple and Plant it in the ground. Then I'm going to layer it a couple times to get the most out of it.
The I'm going to chop off all the branches around the nebari. I'm hoping to get a multipull trunk system. Then I'm going to make a bonsai out of that. I'll do all this after I buy a couple of things. I haveth limited dougheth.
What do ya guys think, this plan sound good to you?
I'm going to buy a good nursery Japanese Red Maple and Plant it in the ground. Then I'm going to layer it a couple times to get the most out of it.
The I'm going to chop off all the branches around the nebari. I'm hoping to get a multipull trunk system. Then I'm going to make a bonsai out of that. I'll do all this after I buy a couple of things. I haveth limited dougheth.
What do ya guys think, this plan sound good to you?
~ Ken ~
Ken,
It's good that you have a plan and are thinking long term, this could work. I have been thinking a little about your situation and considering your plans for the future (I see you edited your signature again) establishing a growing bed will make life a lot easier on you in the coming decade. Four more years of school, four years away and two years getting yourself established somewhere puts you ten years down the road.
By establishing your own little patch of garden you can plant young material out and get some good growth. Later you will have some decent stock to work with. By then you will have also have learned a lot more about bonsai and will be better able to work that material. This will also take a lot of the stress from whoever gets the duty of maintaining your trees while you are away. A little fertilizer and a good soaking once a week and their done.
Norm
It's good that you have a plan and are thinking long term, this could work. I have been thinking a little about your situation and considering your plans for the future (I see you edited your signature again) establishing a growing bed will make life a lot easier on you in the coming decade. Four more years of school, four years away and two years getting yourself established somewhere puts you ten years down the road.
By establishing your own little patch of garden you can plant young material out and get some good growth. Later you will have some decent stock to work with. By then you will have also have learned a lot more about bonsai and will be better able to work that material. This will also take a lot of the stress from whoever gets the duty of maintaining your trees while you are away. A little fertilizer and a good soaking once a week and their done.
Norm
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Thanx Norm.
Buy unfortunately I have five more years of school around these parts. Lets just say I was one very, VERY rambunctious kid in kindergarten and mom thought I wasn't ready to move on. Plus the school I was going to wasn't the best. But it was probably one of the best things my mom could've done for me. If she hadn't of done that then I wouldn't have had all the great teachers I had this year. Not to mention friends(and girls, can't forget them now can we 
)
Anyway, Thank You.
On a less personal note, yes, I did change my signature. My rank also changed. I also posted what zone I'm in. On that note anyway, I was looking at the USDA's website yesterday and they might be coming out with a new zone map soon because of the changing temps. And my minimum average around here these days is certainly NOT 0-5 degrees. More like 25-30 degrees. Just a heads up there.
I've been meaning to ask this but what kind of fertilizer do Jap. Red Maples tend to like? I have a liquid but it's not organic. I would prefer to buy stuff for a specific species rather than stuff for just all around use. I would also like it to be organic. Another problem is getting the stuff I need for the future. I just don't know how to find the money. I'll figure that out later.
Now that I've done bonsai for a while(wow...it hasn't really been that long and......WOW.....I've learned alot. Just look at my threads from when I began here to the threads I'm creating now. Talk about maturity. I'm scaring myself)I've realized that I'm one that only like one kind of species.
I think I finally found it too . I only really like to Jap. Maples. Oh...I know, I'll call myself the MAPLE MAN 
.
That's what I'm focused on.
Another thing. The only thing I'm really, really worried about is soil. I know that it needs clay, river sand or equivalent, peat or equivalent, and something else.(Can't remember)
I don't know whether it would be better to buy pre-mixed soil or make my own soil. And what kind of soil to use for my maples.(All my other trees have died....or squirrels have attacked them. I only have good luck with my Maples) That's the biggest thing I need help with.
Thanks. I really appreciate it.
Buy unfortunately I have five more years of school around these parts. Lets just say I was one very, VERY rambunctious kid in kindergarten and mom thought I wasn't ready to move on. Plus the school I was going to wasn't the best. But it was probably one of the best things my mom could've done for me. If she hadn't of done that then I wouldn't have had all the great teachers I had this year. Not to mention friends(and girls, can't forget them now can we
)Anyway, Thank You.
On a less personal note, yes, I did change my signature. My rank also changed. I also posted what zone I'm in. On that note anyway, I was looking at the USDA's website yesterday and they might be coming out with a new zone map soon because of the changing temps. And my minimum average around here these days is certainly NOT 0-5 degrees. More like 25-30 degrees. Just a heads up there.
I've been meaning to ask this but what kind of fertilizer do Jap. Red Maples tend to like? I have a liquid but it's not organic. I would prefer to buy stuff for a specific species rather than stuff for just all around use. I would also like it to be organic. Another problem is getting the stuff I need for the future. I just don't know how to find the money. I'll figure that out later.
Now that I've done bonsai for a while(wow...it hasn't really been that long and......WOW.....I've learned alot. Just look at my threads from when I began here to the threads I'm creating now. Talk about maturity. I'm scaring myself)I've realized that I'm one that only like one kind of species.
I think I finally found it too
. I only really like to Jap. Maples. Oh...I know, I'll call myself the MAPLE MAN .That's what I'm focused on.
Another thing. The only thing I'm really, really worried about is soil. I know that it needs clay, river sand or equivalent, peat or equivalent, and something else.(Can't remember)
I don't know whether it would be better to buy pre-mixed soil or make my own soil. And what kind of soil to use for my maples.(All my other trees have died....or squirrels have attacked them. I only have good luck with my Maples) That's the biggest thing I need help with.
Thanks. I really appreciate it.
~ Ken ~
Ken,
You will not be re-potting your Maples until spring so you have some time to do research. If you want to mix your own begin now to look for components. Have you read the soil sticky? That will take you a long way towards understanding soil basics. Make sure to follow the links as well.
I am still looking for a good solid organic fertilizer that does not cause problems for me. A couple of years ago I made some home-made fertilizer cakes and I though all was well, until I used them. They got waterlogged really quickly and attracted Fungus Gnats. Even worse they broke down and clogged my soil. Not wanting to waste the material I broke it all back down and used it as a powder. Even though I applied it pretty thin the same issues cropped up.
This year I found a product that was granular, about the size of a grain of rice and had high hopes for it but the same thing happened, clogged soil and insect problems. Now I am using the product up by making manure tea and watering it in.
You can use other products as liquids such as seaweed extract or fish emulsion. The latter really stinks though. Your local home center (Lowe's, Home Depot) will have these products. Dallas Bonsai has specialized fertilizers but they are fairly expensive. Perhaps if my collection was further along I would be more likely to look to these specialty products but for now I use more readily available products.
Norm
You will not be re-potting your Maples until spring so you have some time to do research. If you want to mix your own begin now to look for components. Have you read the soil sticky? That will take you a long way towards understanding soil basics. Make sure to follow the links as well.
I am still looking for a good solid organic fertilizer that does not cause problems for me. A couple of years ago I made some home-made fertilizer cakes and I though all was well, until I used them. They got waterlogged really quickly and attracted Fungus Gnats. Even worse they broke down and clogged my soil. Not wanting to waste the material I broke it all back down and used it as a powder. Even though I applied it pretty thin the same issues cropped up.
This year I found a product that was granular, about the size of a grain of rice and had high hopes for it but the same thing happened, clogged soil and insect problems. Now I am using the product up by making manure tea and watering it in.
You can use other products as liquids such as seaweed extract or fish emulsion. The latter really stinks though. Your local home center (Lowe's, Home Depot) will have these products. Dallas Bonsai has specialized fertilizers but they are fairly expensive. Perhaps if my collection was further along I would be more likely to look to these specialty products but for now I use more readily available products.
Norm
-
constantstaticx3
- Green Thumb
- Posts: 391
- Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 7:24 pm
- Location: Haddonfield, NJ
Norm, you can try this, https://www.shadysidebonsai.com/id76.html
I've been using it most of this year with minimal problems. It does break down and cake up the top somewhat but you can space them out so the whole top does not clog up, although I haven't had drainage problems. They are in little pellets much bigger than the ones you described. There were maggots in one of my pots that were attracted by it but I removed the three that I saw and haven't found anymore. If you have a dog, be sure they cant get into the pots because my dog loves it.
Tom
I've been using it most of this year with minimal problems. It does break down and cake up the top somewhat but you can space them out so the whole top does not clog up, although I haven't had drainage problems. They are in little pellets much bigger than the ones you described. There were maggots in one of my pots that were attracted by it but I removed the three that I saw and haven't found anymore. If you have a dog, be sure they cant get into the pots because my dog loves it.
Tom
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Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Wow...sounds like he has an addiction problem. You should consider rehabIf you have a dog, be sure they cant get into the pots because my dog loves it.
Jokin'
Norm,
Yes, I have read the sticky on soil. I read it awhile ago. It was helpful but didn't solve all my questions. I was recently looking through the Bonsai Survival Guide and I missed something completetly. I can't beleived I had missed it. The author owns his own Japanese Maples(bonsai)and he said they prefer Japanese Akadama Soil. I'm going to do more research into it and I'll come back and post and tell you what I come up with.
~ Ken ~
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A
Norm,
I have decided to get some akadama soil mix(not baked). There are three sizes. small, medium, and large. I know for certain I do not want large. I am having trouble deciding whether to get small or medium. I am planing on buying some peat moss to add to the pre-mix. I am also going to buy other goodies such as soil seives, soil scoops, a 6 peice novice tool kit, a watering can, etc. I am going to post a link to the soil. The kind I would like is the last set of three at the bottom of the page.
[url]https://www.dallasbonsai.com/store/akadama.html[/url]
Any Input?
I have decided to get some akadama soil mix(not baked). There are three sizes. small, medium, and large. I know for certain I do not want large. I am having trouble deciding whether to get small or medium. I am planing on buying some peat moss to add to the pre-mix. I am also going to buy other goodies such as soil seives, soil scoops, a 6 peice novice tool kit, a watering can, etc. I am going to post a link to the soil. The kind I would like is the last set of three at the bottom of the page.
[url]https://www.dallasbonsai.com/store/akadama.html[/url]
Any Input?
~ Ken ~
-
Kenshin14435
- Senior Member
- Posts: 284
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 pm
- Location: Northern VA USDA Zone 7A