artisanoo
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scheff stump - how long till bud break?

hey - i just got a new schefflera that was a lot taller than i wanted, but had a nice trunk and rootage. i potted it in better soil and cut the 3 long stem/trunks down to lengths ranging from 3 to 4or 5 inches.

its been about a week - the stems are still green by the scratch test, but i was wondering how long it usually takes for buds to appear after doing something like that? (or how long to wait until i can assume it hasn't survived...)
ive been told ( and read in numerous places) that they can be pruned back to nothing, and since this was a free tree i thought 'why not'...
just hope it wasnt too much :)

ynot
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Re: scheff stump - how long till bud break?

artisanoo wrote:hey - I just got a new schefflera that was a lot taller than I wanted, but had a nice trunk and rootage. I potted it in better soil and cut the 3 long stem/trunks down to lengths ranging from 3 to 4or 5 inches.
Did you leave any foliage on it?
its been about a week - the stems are still green by the scratch test, but I was wondering how long it usually takes for buds to appear after doing something like that? (or how long to wait until I can assume it hasn't survived...)
Several weeks minimum, Again it depends on the conditions it lives in. A repot & a heavy pruning IS a lot of stress for a tree to shake off [Even a Scheff Though they are pretty tough.]
ive been told ( and read in numerous places) that they can be pruned back to nothing, and since this was a free tree I thought 'why not'...
just hope it wasnt too much :)
True enough, But most of those sources probably didn't suggest a simultaneous repot as well ;).
Given proper conditions I doubt you will have a fatality but it will be a while to bounce back.
I understand this approach entirely :D

ynot

artisanoo
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no foliage - none at all. but since it was at no cost, i thought, you need to take risks sometimes, and free risks are better than costly ones :)

i cut off some of the extraneous surface roots that had wound around the rim of thepot, and some of the longer ones, but i left a lot of the main rootball intact so hopefully that will count for something...

i have been keeping an eye on it, making sure the soil is moist , not too wet/dry, etc.. and it is right under my lights (full spectrum fluorescent.. i would put it outside since sun is most definitely better but its starting to get cold around here so i didnt think that would be the best idea... it was supposed have been in the 30's or 40's last night :( )


i guess i will just give it time, and we'll see what happens :)

ynot
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artisanoo wrote:no foliage - none at all. but since it was at no cost, I thought, you need to take risks sometimes, and free risks are better than costly ones :)
Exactly, Nothing ventured...Nothing gained...BTW, Cuttings are good for all kinds of experiments as well. :D.

The environment sounds good though with no foliage you may want to be cautious wrt watering as it will use less water due to a lack of transpiration [Until it has foliage again.]

Good luck.

ynot

arboricola
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Why to go Art, Scheffs are hard to kill and what you did is great. Don't worry, just be patient. Ynot is right on, watch the water, and give it good light. Here's a pic of one of mine. It was cut down to 4 inches and now is 6 inches.
[img]https://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e188/coloradus/scheff-3a.jpg[/img]

They can take a lot of abuse. Just be patient...

Phil...

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Phil,

That's a nice little Scheff. I have never thought very highly of them in the past. My Step-Father had one for years and never did anything with it, I hated it. It was about six feet tall with no foliage except near the top. I don't recall what happened to it after he died. Perhaps it is time that I take a fresh look at them.

Norm

arboricola
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Norm;
Do take another at the lowly scheff. It's a great tree for those new to bonsai
and good fun for those that think they know it all. Of course, we know that real bonsai are grown outdoors. LOL.

Phil...

moulman
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Scheff

Thought I'd share a pic of one of my scheffs ( as long as we're talkin about em) :)

[img]https://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x168/photomojo1/banyan2.jpg[/img]

artisanoo
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arboricola wrote:Why to go Art, Scheffs are hard to kill and what you did is great. Don't worry, just be patient. Ynot is right on, watch the water, and give it good light. Here's a pic of one of mine. It was cut down to 4 inches and now is 6 inches.


They can take a lot of abuse. Just be patient...

Phil...
Thanks - ill be patient with it, if it bounces back, hopefully in the next few weeks, ill try and post some pictures for ideas of what branches to keep etc..
(or is it smarter to just let it grow for a while with no pruning, to regain strength?)

ynot
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artisanoo wrote:
Thanks - ill be patient with it
Yep, Just ignore it for a while ;) 8)
artisanoo wrote:if it bounces back, hopefully in the next few weeks, ill try and post some pictures for ideas of what branches to keep etc..
(or is it smarter to just let it grow for a while with no pruning, to regain strength?)
Just see how it goes [grows], If it seems to be struggling/lagging then just let it be, If it is growing explosively I would just keep what you want [For design purposes].

If it is struggling you will want to retain as much foliage as possible to help it rebuild strength = No pruning.

If it seems good to go...The idea is to grow out the branchesyou intend to keep [And a new leader] until they are the diameter you want [It does not matter what length they end up being as you will be cutting them back later. Yes, It will look very goofy for a while but the benefits are to be seen later down the timeline.]
Essentially you repeat this process to induce trunk taper and ramification [Both are challenging with Scheffs] Lather, Rinse, Repeat... 8).

Good strong light will help immensely in keeping your internodes short [The distance between the leaf nodes] as well as helping your foliage to remain compact.

Good luck

ynot

artisanoo
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quick (although unfortunately pictureless as of yet) update,

since the last post the thing has started popping buds out in a bunch of places... of the 3 branches that were left, the two smaller ones have a bunch of buds each, with one at 3 or 4 maybe, and one at 4 or 5.

some of them look like they will start leafing out soon - cant wait for all those tiny little umbrellas
:)


unfortunately the thickest of the 3 branches only has one bud, and it is pretty low down, almost at the soil... i wanted to use that branch as a trunk but i don't know if that will happen - the branch itself (about 5 inches long) is still green under the bark, almost to where i made the cut - but no growth
... is there hope yet for that branch to bud?
should i cut it again? (just the one budless branch)

arboricola
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Art;

That's great news. I wouldn't do a thing right now. Be patient and let it grow.

Phil...

artisanoo
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tahts what i plan on doing - do you think there is a chance that last trunk will bud?

arboricola
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Art;

Only time will tell. You can't hurry mother nature.

Phil...

artisanoo
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i don't have a pic here (i finally have my computer and stuff set up at home though so hopefully i will be able to post some soon) but it is going well -

i don't remember off hand but there at least 7-10 areas where growth started,
so i will have some branches to choose from i hope.

its a weird shape for a tree so ill wait till i can post a picture and get some opinions from you guys as to what to do with it.



my one question though is this - there is still nothing on the one thickest trunk. i still have hope, but i am wondering what i could do in the worst case where it doesnt grow at all on that branch...
can you do anything with dead wood on this kind of tree or will it just rot..
it is still green under the thin bark, so maybe i can try a graft? it would fun to try.
i am going to want to cut back another scheff soon so maybe i can use that cutting for grafting?- what options are there for grafting.. can i do an approach graft when it is a different plant? or does that only work for branches of the same plant. i am asking about approach grafting specifically because the branch i would want to graft is thinner than the trunk i would graft on to, and i assume a normal graft wouldnt match up so well, cambium-wise....

arboricola
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Do you have two trees or one with a double trunk? If it's two, you can remove the thicker one at next repot. If it's one plant, I would just leave it alone. Older wood takes a little longer to break a bud. Give it some time and see what happens.

Phil...

artisanoo
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its one tree.

there is one thicker trunk, and then another which breaks off into 2 branches.
ill wait then -- if there is a difference in time for buds to break on old wood then maybe i am jumping the gun in thinking it wont happen. the parts where leaves are already coming out were from parts significantly thinner than the trunk in question, which would then explain why they budded so much faster.

if and when the thicker one buds, maybe ill separate it and have 2 trees.. one twin and one single, but for now ill take your advice and leave it alone.

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