Drying out Chinese elm?

[Space]

Hey guys and gals,

I may have a problem with a Chinese elm I bought about a month ago: the leaves in the past week or so have started to dry out and almost all of them are brittle. They are mostly still green but I see a couple brown ones...

The plant was greenhouse-grown and is now outside of my home in a mostly shaded spot. I'm not sure if it's too much water, too little, or if it's confused by the temperature (it's been in the 60s Fahrenheit here the past week).

If needed I can post pics later today.

Thanks!

[Gnome]

Space,

Chinese Elms are very adaptable WRT temperatures so I doubt that is the issue. Mine are still outside where they have been all summer and despite several frosts are still green and just starting to show some signs of fading.

Green, dry leaves sounds more like underwatering to me. How are you watering it? Does the soil take water readily or does it run off the edges. I'm trying to determine if the core of the root-ball has been getting enough water. If your soil is compacted and you only hit it once you may not have been saturating the soil, which you should.

I take it that you are going to keep it outside and allow a dormancy. Is that correct? Also, generally, where are you located?

Norm

[Space]

Green, dry leaves sounds more like underwatering to me. How are you watering it? Does the soil take water readily or does it run off the edges. I'm trying to determine if the core of the root-ball has been getting enough water. If your soil is compacted and you only hit it once you may not have been saturating the soil, which you should.

I take it that you are going to keep it outside and allow a dormancy. Is that correct? Also, generally, where are you located?

Norm

I'm watering the tree with a small watering can at the moment; the water at times runs off the edges. I noticed when I bought it at the nursery that it is fairly well do for a re-potting but from what I've read, I should wait until spring for that.

I started saturating the soil today after posting here...from what I've read, Chinese Elms need more water than many bonsai, and mine is also in a small pot (about 5 inches long).

I am going to keep it outside and let it go dormant; I live in the Houston area so it won't get terribly cold here and there is a lot of humidity. The tree is also several years old from the looks of it so it's probably seen colder winters than what we'll get this year.

Thanks!

[Gnome]

Space,

It sounds as though the soil may not have been saturated properly. Dense soils often require more than one watering in a short time frame to become fully saturated. If soil is so dense that water runs off the sides it would not hurt to water it by the immersion method from time to time.

I am unsure what to suggest as far as re-potting as my climate is so much different than yours. Being so mild a Chinese Elm may not go fully dormant in your area. Although I have never needed to, apparently smaller trees can be kept in the refigerator if necessary. This might be something to consider since the current leaves are probably fried and your weather is so mild.

I would not be surprised if all of the current leaves drop. Keep a close eye on it and when you see new growth that would be your signal to re-pot. You will need to get some decent bonsai medium of you will not be improving matters much. You may be close enough to [url=https://www.dallasbonsai.com/index.html]Dallas Bonsai[/url] that you can drop in and pick up what you need. Call first, I seem to remember something about them not keeping regular store hours. I beleive that they are primarily a mail order outlet.

Norm

[Space]

Space,

It sounds as though the soil may not have been saturated properly. Dense soils often require more than one watering in a short time frame to become fully saturated. If soil is so dense that water runs off the sides it would not hurt to water it by the immersion method from time to time.

I am unsure what to suggest as far as re-potting as my climate is so much different than yours. Being so mild a Chinese Elm may not go fully dormant in your area. Although I have never needed to, apparently smaller trees can be kept in the refigerator if necessary. This might be something to consider since the current leaves are probably fried and your weather is so mild.

I would not be surprised if all of the current leaves drop. Keep a close eye on it and when you see new growth that would be your signal to re-pot. You will need to get some decent bonsai medium of you will not be improving matters much. You may be close enough to [url=https://www.dallasbonsai.com/index.html]Dallas Bonsai[/url] that you can drop in and pick up what you need. Call first, I seem to remember something about them not keeping regular store hours. I beleive that they are primarily a mail order outlet.

Norm

OK, thanks for the advice, I'll be checking the soil moisture every day from now on. I guess I got careless with it because my other bonsais, an Arboricola and a Juniper, don't need much "babying" when it comes to water.

Dallas Bonsai is mostly online or mail ordering, I was thinking about getting soil mix from them but didn't have any reviews handy. If you think they're good, that's good enough for me. Thanks for everything!

[Gnome]

Space,

I guess I got careless with it because my other bonsais, an Arboricola and a Juniper, don't need much "babying" when it comes to water.

I have not found Chinese Elm to be any more finicky WRT to watering. If the soil was looser I don't think you would have this problem.

If you think they're good, that's good enough for me.

That was not necessarily an endorsement. I have never purchased their soil but I have purchased some pots a few years ago.

The description of their 'Fujiyama Potting Medium' is a little vague so I'm unsure about it. From the description I think I would prefer
'PM106 - Thomas J's Easy Soil Recipe Package'

Thanks for everything!

You're welcome. Make sure to let us know how it goes.

Norm

[midn1352]

Space,

Earlier this winter my Chinese Elm did the same thing. It stayed pitiful-looking for about a week. I thought it died but I watered it just in case it didn't. Within the month, my elm exploded with little new buds and is currently thriving. My suggestion is to first test your soil: if you stick your finger into the soil about an inch or so and the soil is dry, water your elm until the water runs clean from the bottom of the pot and the soil appears wet. If the soil is moist, I'd let it be until the soil starts drying out again. If the plant is overwatered, the roots can rot. Hopefully some TLC and some time will bring your elm back. Hope this is of some assistance, and good luck!! =]

[The Rookie]

Norm-

I seem to be having the same issue with a newly purchased elm. I repotted it about 3 weeks ago and it has been doing great, then last night I noticed the leaves are green, dry, and crispy. This happened over the course of a day or two.

I believe we've spoken in Chinese Elm threads where you and I discussed proper watering for a Chinese Elm, but I can't find them. I seem to recall you telling me that Chinese Elms should be allowed to dry out before watering.

The soil mix for my Elm drains very well. I check the moisture level daily with a moisture meter. Should I be concerned about over-watering it? I guess yellow leaves would be a sign of overwatering, right?

Your input is much appreciated.


Jason

Space,

It sounds as though the soil may not have been saturated properly. Dense soils often require more than one watering in a short time frame to become fully saturated. If soil is so dense that water runs off the sides it would not hurt to water it by the immersion method from time to time.

I am unsure what to suggest as far as re-potting as my climate is so much different than yours. Being so mild a Chinese Elm may not go fully dormant in your area. Although I have never needed to, apparently smaller trees can be kept in the refigerator if necessary. This might be something to consider since the current leaves are probably fried and your weather is so mild.

I would not be surprised if all of the current leaves drop. Keep a close eye on it and when you see new growth that would be your signal to re-pot. You will need to get some decent bonsai medium of you will not be improving matters much. You may be close enough to [url=https://www.dallasbonsai.com/index.html]Dallas Bonsai[/url] that you can drop in and pick up what you need. Call first, I seem to remember something about them not keeping regular store hours. I beleive that they are primarily a mail order outlet.

Norm

[Gnome]

The Rookie,

I seem to recall you telling me that Chinese Elms should be allowed to dry out before watering.

Not many species of trees like to remain wet but I suppose "dry" is a relative term. Dry, green and crispy sounds like you have waited too long to water or are not watering adequately. Also, newly re-potted trees could use a period of recuperation where you would keep them in a sheltered location and pampered a bit. Hopefully it will turn around for you.

Norm

[The Rookie]

Norm:

I put the elm in a little shade, monitored it more closely, and watered it with more frequency. New leaves have popped up & it is recovering nicely.

Its in a shallow pot, was in direct sun & is in fast draing soil. As a result, I believe it was drying quickly. I'm probably going to continue with the current conditions from here on out.

Thanks again for your guidance Norm!

Jason

The Rookie,

I seem to recall you telling me that Chinese Elms should be allowed to dry out before watering.

Not many species of trees like to remain wet but I suppose "dry" is a relative term. Dry, green and crispy sounds like you have waited too long to water or are not watering adequately. Also, newly re-potted trees could use a period of recuperation where you would keep them in a sheltered location and pampered a bit. Hopefully it will turn around for you.

Norm