gunsmokex
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Location: South Dakota zone 4b

Fertilizer advice for a newbie

Hello everyone I have a question on fertilizer. I guess I have a rather unique problem here and I'll explain it the best I can.

Basically I have a garden 40'x18' below a cattle yard for years it used to have hogs a long time ago but the point is its always had some form or livestock there. The drainage from the yard has filtered into exactly where my garden is for 10's of years, very fertile lush soil I'd guess very high in nitrogen. I decided to put it there after getting sick of mowing the insanely tall grass lol. My corn is doing quite well but thats not what I'm concerned about. I'm more concerned about my tomatoes and pepper plants I guess I have others as well (cantelope, watermelon, onions, asparagus, fennel, celery, brussel sprouts, cabbage, strawberries, thyme, tarragon, rosemary, oregano, basil and a pole bean).

Anyways I want my garden to do as best as possible and need some advice on what to do. I think I'm ok on nitrogen and I don't want to mess anything up but I think my garden could do a lot better and suggestions on what type of fertilizer to use? The peppers and tomatoes are planted in the most fertile part of the garden with lots of organic material in it. The onions and asparagus are in a sandier part the rest is in the middle kind of an in between soil.

I'd like to keep it as organic as possible. But any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Justin

Dillbert
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you really should get a soil test - especially with the history. everything else is a blind guess!

https://www.sdstate.edu/ps/extension/soi ... stlabs.cfm

gunsmokex
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Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 am
Location: South Dakota zone 4b

Very true. I think I'll just take a sample to my local elevator they do soil sample tests all the time for my dad who farms. Thanks for the advice :) I'll post how it turns out. I can't get one now because it'd just be mud, its pouring outside right now :)

At the very least though I think I'm going to head to Ace or Menards and try to find something with low N and give them a good dose of Phos and Potassium. I'm also thinking I might need to add some calcium as well but for now I'll just find something at least. I know they need to be fed badly, I haven't done it yet this year and the fruits and peppers are all starting to form.

*dim*
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I've switched to organic fertilizers a few years ago and everything grows extremely well ...

I tend to foliar feed with a seaweed/algae extract (biobizz alg-a-mic), and I also use a fish fertilizer for foliar feeding (biobizz fish mix) ....

they work out very cheap, as you dilute 4ml per litre of water when foliar feeding (it only costs £10 per litre of the two mentioned fertilizers, so you get 200 litres of foliar feed for £10, and 1 litre of foliar feed is sufficient for my veg patch)

I also brew my own actively aerated compost teas, and also top dress with worm humis

when the veg/plants start flowering, I add bat guano (there are different ones available and I use the one that is low in N and high in P and K)

I also add volcanic rock dust to my beds (has over 70 minerals)

like I said, everything is doing very well (my tumbling toms have more than 200 tomatoes (so far) in the hanging basket )

gunsmokex
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Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 am
Location: South Dakota zone 4b

Hmm does biobuzz algamic have an NPK rating? It sounds like great stuff. I'll get a soil sample in tomorrow to the elevator, or rather a mud sample lol. I don't quite know if I'll need the fish stuff as that's mostly high in nitrogen right? With all the manure runoff that's been running over this plat over the years plus I've always mulched it when I've mowed I wouldn't think I need all that much N. Plus I did also till in a bunch of grass as well. The manure runoff I would think is kind of like a compost tea in its own way. But I'm thinking I'm going to make some compost and compost tea for next year.

Hmm now I just need to try to find some of this biobuzz stuff in Sioux Falls, SD. Arrrgghh I just did a search for it and the nearest place that sells it is in 350miles away in Minneapolis.

gunsmokex
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Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 am
Location: South Dakota zone 4b

Hmm I think I need to find a good store in town because I think it'll be an issue finding bat guano, the worm droppings well there are tons of earthworms in the garden already but regardless I think I'll need to find a good knowledgeable shop. Just as soon as this NASCAR race is over (until I found fantasy NASCAR I had no idea watching the race would be this much fun, well anything is if you add completion and $$ to it :)

imafan26
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When you take in your plant sample take in some leaves from the plants too. Nitrogen will not be listed on a soil sample but the nitrogen can be measured in the leaf. Here at least, it does not cost more to submit a tissue sample with the soil.

If everything is growing well and your plants are healthy and the tomatoes, cukes, squash, etc are fruiting, I really would not worry about it. Your soil probably has all that it needs. It probably has more than it needs.

I am concerned that the garden is located downhill from a piggery and depending on how long ago all that runoff was deposited, you may run into contamination issues especially if you are eating things from the garden raw.

gunsmokex
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Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 am
Location: South Dakota zone 4b

Thanks :) I'll take in a leaf sample and see if they can process that too, thanks imafan.

Don't worry it isn't sewage running down the hill there a very thick grass filter strip and the manure has been cleaned out a while ago all that is left is the very very small particles and by the time it gets out of the yard the water is clear. More or less the benefit goes directly into the soil from where it runs out at. The cattle are there when they calve and come out around May or June of every year then the yard gets clean out and they are gone. Hogs haven't been there for right around 25yrs.

I'm going to fire up this mini ipad that I got soon and take some pics of all of this stuff, so you guys can see what I'm talking about. But yeah I'm not too worried and I'll make sure I wash my veggies well.

*dim*
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Location: Cambridge UK

biobizz alg-a-mic has an NPK ratio of 0.1-0.1-0.1

the fish mix has an NPK of 6-2-4

don't be fooled by NPK ratios .... both products work wonders, not only with veg/fruit, but with all garden plants

you can buy similar products from amazon or ebay .... or from your local hydroponic store (google for one in your area)

the guys who grow 'medical' cannabis use these products .... there are several other products such as Advanced Nutrients (google is your friend) ... so check whats available in your country

gunsmokex
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Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:13 am
Location: South Dakota zone 4b

My friend had some fertilizer that I got for free. Its 0-5-4 I think it'll work just fine, I'll let you know how it turns out. I may just experiment though and get some of the biobizz and do 1/2 with 0-5-4 and 1/2 with biobizz but we'll see how much the biobizz is.

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ElizabethB
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Location: Lafayette, LA

Hi Gunsmoke,

You are making me kind of crazy. DO NOT add anything to your soil until you have had a soil test done through your equivalent of a county agent. You MUST have a base line to work from. Randomly adding fertilizer is a disaster waiting to happen.

If you amended your soil after sending off a sample you will need to do another soil test. You have changed things and the original test will be invalid.

Exercise patience. Wait for a soil test.

Good luck

imafan26
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Location: Hawaii, zone 12a 587 ft elev.

I agree. You could unbalance th soil by adding too much stuff it does not need. A few inches of blended compost is good to add . I would hold off on the other fertilizers until the soil test comes back and tells you what you need.

Organic fertilizer NPK's are not only low but deceptive. NPK of any fertilizer measures the total number of pounds per 100 lbs of fertilizer. All fertilizer has fillers. Organic fertilizers have a lot of bulk and organic material as fillers while synthetics have mainly salts and carriers. That is why organic fertilizers are better for the soil microbes in the long run. However, most of the NPK in synthetic fertilizers are in a form that is readily available to plants although a lot of fertilizers now are using slow N instead of fast N. (Not all ammonium, some forms of N will be in nitrate form).

Organic fertilizers are mostly slow and definitely slower than synthetic. While is it good to have a slow vs a fast feed, organic does not always provide nutrients at the time the plants need it. Some organic fertilizers realease so slowly that it may take a couple of years before it gets broken down and becomes available to the plants. That is why it takes about 3 years for an organic garden to really be able to be productive and sustainable. Organic gardens will always be dependent on the continual addition of compost and other feedstock to maintain fertility.

It is easy to overdose with synthetic fertilizers since comparatively small amounts are needed compared to organic fertilizers.
The plants don't care which one they get as long as it is available in a form the plant can use.

It is possible to overdoes on organic fertilizers and compost. That is why you should wait for the soil test before mixing things up. The recommendations you will be getting depend on the conditions that existed when the sample was taken. After you add things they interact with each other and some things like chiken manure and potash can alter pH a lot. Compost can also be alkaline.

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jal_ut
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"I'd like to keep it as organic as possible. But any advice would be much appreciated."

It seems that nitrogen is the nutrient most often lacking in soils. Most any plot will produce better if you put some nitrogen on it.
OK, if you don't want to use the packaged fertilizers, I suggest: All garden residues go back on the garden. Grass clippings can be used as mulch. In the fall when the leaves come down, they are raked up and put on the garden It all gets tilled in. If you put more on than you take off it will stay fertile. :)



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