Hey everyone! I was just wondering about something. Do any of you have an experience buying actual plants (not seeds) online? I was reading about tomatoes and all the different types available after being disappointed by the big stores and the lack of variety...
Next year I will be growing my own seedlings, but as I just moved down here I did not get that rolling this time.
Any recommendations for sites that you have used?
By chance, does anyone know any really great nurseries for veggie plants in the Louisville, Frankfort, or Lexington areas of Kentucky?
These are two fairly well respected sites.
https://www.selectedplants.com/
https://www.heirloomtomatoplants.com/
If you are close to Cincinnati you may want to check out
CHOPTAG spring plant swap and/or fall taste fest
Cincinnati Heirloom & Open Pollinated Tomato Associate Growers
Google it to find more info.
It might be be a good way to get heirloom seeds and plants. I'm not sure when the plant swap is, but it is probably coming up soon. Maybe they have sales too.
https://www.selectedplants.com/
https://www.heirloomtomatoplants.com/
If you are close to Cincinnati you may want to check out
CHOPTAG spring plant swap and/or fall taste fest
Cincinnati Heirloom & Open Pollinated Tomato Associate Growers
Google it to find more info.
It might be be a good way to get heirloom seeds and plants. I'm not sure when the plant swap is, but it is probably coming up soon. Maybe they have sales too.
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applestar
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My rule of thumb for on-line live plants is to order from geologically close source so the shipping time is minimized, OR bite the bullet and pay the extra express shipping fees.
But this is the time of the year for plant sales. You might want to look for one in your area. Almost all Ag extension and Master Gardener's programs have one more variety and selections. Last year, someone mentioned that they found huge variety at a flea market type farmers market.
But this is the time of the year for plant sales. You might want to look for one in your area. Almost all Ag extension and Master Gardener's programs have one more variety and selections. Last year, someone mentioned that they found huge variety at a flea market type farmers market.
I did a bit of asking around and got this info back from a CHOPTAG member.
TZ, This is my tenth year as a volunteer at Thieneman's Nursery in Louisville, Kentucky. I help select the seed for pepper and heirloom tomatoes and when possible assist in their germination. This year as last year we will be offering about 150 varieties of heirloom and a few F1 tomato varieties. There will be about fifty varieties of sweet and hot peppers. These will be available for sale on FRIDAY 23rd and 24th beginning at 9:00 am.
Please pass this information along to your contact. Tell them I will be present both days to help folks and answer any questions they might have. I am attaching the link to Thieneman's web sit which will have varieties listed and directions to the nursery.
Thanks for sharing your concerns here.
Gary Millwood
Thieneman's Nursery
https://www.thienemans.com/
TZ, This is my tenth year as a volunteer at Thieneman's Nursery in Louisville, Kentucky. I help select the seed for pepper and heirloom tomatoes and when possible assist in their germination. This year as last year we will be offering about 150 varieties of heirloom and a few F1 tomato varieties. There will be about fifty varieties of sweet and hot peppers. These will be available for sale on FRIDAY 23rd and 24th beginning at 9:00 am.
Please pass this information along to your contact. Tell them I will be present both days to help folks and answer any questions they might have. I am attaching the link to Thieneman's web sit which will have varieties listed and directions to the nursery.
Thanks for sharing your concerns here.
Gary Millwood
Thieneman's Nursery
https://www.thienemans.com/
Oh my, I was just looking at the list Thieneman's posted! 
Anyone have any recommendations for particular tomatoes for me...?
I was thinking I have 8 "spots" for toms in my beds. I want half of them to be the sauce/paste type. I want something like a Roma I guess but that I can grow up on a trellis. My Dad goes to Italy a lot and says they grow San Marazano and they are really good.
The other 4 I want to just do maybe even 4 different interesting types for slicing, salads, etc. Maybe some weird colors and 1 small "cherry" type.
Btw, Is it too late to do snow peas...? I just got some seeds today, and now I realized that it may be too late to even plant them (I'm in 6a, last frost date today 4/21)
Anyone have any recommendations for particular tomatoes for me...?
I was thinking I have 8 "spots" for toms in my beds. I want half of them to be the sauce/paste type. I want something like a Roma I guess but that I can grow up on a trellis. My Dad goes to Italy a lot and says they grow San Marazano and they are really good.
The other 4 I want to just do maybe even 4 different interesting types for slicing, salads, etc. Maybe some weird colors and 1 small "cherry" type.
Btw, Is it too late to do snow peas...? I just got some seeds today, and now I realized that it may be too late to even plant them (I'm in 6a, last frost date today 4/21)
The following are popular favorites for many people (safe bets) and will probably be available.
Many people tell me that the best tomato for sauce is Costoluto Genovese because of its flavor when cooked. It is not a paste/plum tomato.
One of the best "paste" tomatoes is Opalka. It also has an interesting pointed pepper shape. It is "low juice" and good for fresh salsas.
If given a choice, stay away from Roma plum types because blossom end rot will often drastically cut down on your harvest. San Marzano is good compared to Roma, but both are way down on the list of favorites.
Green when ripe: Try Cherokee Green or Green Giant. Green Zebra is a nice little salad tomato, but I think more people "Love" it for the advertizing hype than the flavor.
Cherries: Black Cherry, Sungold
Yellow-Gold: Earl of Edgecombe (short plant), Aunt Gerties Gold (long season), Kelloggs Breakfast (all are med to large varieties) . Juane Flamee' is a tasty little salad type.
Blacks: Cherokee Purple (doubles for red/pink beefsteak slicer), Black Krim (earthy "black "tomato flavor, early).
Bicolors (yellow/red): These have a fruity flavor and are often juicy so don't cook down easily. I would go with a green instead if space challenged. Best varieties = Lucky Cross and Little Lucky
Red-pink
Oxhearts (very meaty and good for everything)
Anna Russian: early
Kosovo: as good or better than AR, but later
Wes: Large plant, big fruit, heavy yield later in season.
Beefsteaks
Brandywine (pink not red) Sudduths variety is guaranteed real brandywine. Flavor is slightly different than others (so better?), production is variably/unpredictable for some.
Earls Faux- Reliable Brandywine substitute
Stump of the World- Reliable Brandywine substitute
Neves Azoeran Red- Favorite of many
Personally, If space limited I would grow good tasting varieties and whatever I didn't eat fresh I would make sauce out of them. They take a little while longer to cook down than paste types, but you get double duty out of them. Cherokee Purple, Brandywine etc make good sauces, and you can put them on burgers and in salads too. Opalka, Romas, Costoluto Genovese, etc make good sauces, but are not "mouth watering" for fresh eating.
Beware, none of these are going to make sauce that tastes like store bought. Add a can of tomato paste if you want to overwhelm the fresh flavor and make it taste like store bought, if not use corn starch as a thickener.
I used to love Prego sauce, but after several years of eating sauces from fresh eating varieties, even the best store bought has a harsh flavor.
If you want to be get excited/educated about different varieties go to laurels heirloom tomatoes (Heirloomtomatoplants.com) and look through her listings/descriptions. They are entertaining, and a pretty good balance of accuracy and sales hype.
Many people tell me that the best tomato for sauce is Costoluto Genovese because of its flavor when cooked. It is not a paste/plum tomato.
One of the best "paste" tomatoes is Opalka. It also has an interesting pointed pepper shape. It is "low juice" and good for fresh salsas.
If given a choice, stay away from Roma plum types because blossom end rot will often drastically cut down on your harvest. San Marzano is good compared to Roma, but both are way down on the list of favorites.
Green when ripe: Try Cherokee Green or Green Giant. Green Zebra is a nice little salad tomato, but I think more people "Love" it for the advertizing hype than the flavor.
Cherries: Black Cherry, Sungold
Yellow-Gold: Earl of Edgecombe (short plant), Aunt Gerties Gold (long season), Kelloggs Breakfast (all are med to large varieties) . Juane Flamee' is a tasty little salad type.
Blacks: Cherokee Purple (doubles for red/pink beefsteak slicer), Black Krim (earthy "black "tomato flavor, early).
Bicolors (yellow/red): These have a fruity flavor and are often juicy so don't cook down easily. I would go with a green instead if space challenged. Best varieties = Lucky Cross and Little Lucky
Red-pink
Oxhearts (very meaty and good for everything)
Anna Russian: early
Kosovo: as good or better than AR, but later
Wes: Large plant, big fruit, heavy yield later in season.
Beefsteaks
Brandywine (pink not red) Sudduths variety is guaranteed real brandywine. Flavor is slightly different than others (so better?), production is variably/unpredictable for some.
Earls Faux- Reliable Brandywine substitute
Stump of the World- Reliable Brandywine substitute
Neves Azoeran Red- Favorite of many
Personally, If space limited I would grow good tasting varieties and whatever I didn't eat fresh I would make sauce out of them. They take a little while longer to cook down than paste types, but you get double duty out of them. Cherokee Purple, Brandywine etc make good sauces, and you can put them on burgers and in salads too. Opalka, Romas, Costoluto Genovese, etc make good sauces, but are not "mouth watering" for fresh eating.
Beware, none of these are going to make sauce that tastes like store bought. Add a can of tomato paste if you want to overwhelm the fresh flavor and make it taste like store bought, if not use corn starch as a thickener.
I used to love Prego sauce, but after several years of eating sauces from fresh eating varieties, even the best store bought has a harsh flavor.
If you want to be get excited/educated about different varieties go to laurels heirloom tomatoes (Heirloomtomatoplants.com) and look through her listings/descriptions. They are entertaining, and a pretty good balance of accuracy and sales hype.
Beware of anything that compares itself to Brandywine, or tells a good story.
Although I have not grown it, I hear that Caspian Pink is a very good but not superb tomato (I never see it on favorites lists on other forums). According to Carolyn Male, the claims for the taste tests/"rivals Brandywine" actually came out at the same time Caspian Pink hit the market, so noone can figure out how the taste tests could be done if people couldn't grow it yet.
Brandywine rarely wins taste tests for a few reasons. The first is that SunGold Cherry usually wins anything in which it is entered (personally I think Cherry tomatoes should be in their own catagory). Second, the average person off of the street has a limited palate (from years of eating supermarket tomatoes, Early Girl, and Better Boy) so will tend to go with familiar "tomatoey" tasting varieties, or unusual (extra sweet etc) varieties, and third, there is quite a bit of variability in flavor even of fruits on the same plant so there is usually a good chance that there will be a really good tasting example of variety X, Y or Z going against a so-so Brandywine. But Brandywine is almost always in the top 5-10 while X,Y and Z range widely in results year to year.
Another commonly seen bit of misinformation has to do with Pruden's Purple. At one time a website mistakenly said that PP was related to Brandywine, which it isn't, and then several other websites used the same statement word for word. The origin of PP is unknown.
Most of the things with Brandywine in the name are not related to Brandywine, they are crosses with Red Brandywine, Yellow Brandywine etc. most of the really good Brandywine crosses do not have Brandywine in the name (Lucky Cross/Little Lucky, Gary'O Sena)
Also, beware of anything that says Brandywine is Amish. It isn't. It came from Doris Sudduth of Tennesee. The unrelated Red Brandywine is linked to the Amish in Pennsylvania, but probably originated from a commercial variety by that name in the late 1800s.
Although I have not grown it, I hear that Caspian Pink is a very good but not superb tomato (I never see it on favorites lists on other forums). According to Carolyn Male, the claims for the taste tests/"rivals Brandywine" actually came out at the same time Caspian Pink hit the market, so noone can figure out how the taste tests could be done if people couldn't grow it yet.
Brandywine rarely wins taste tests for a few reasons. The first is that SunGold Cherry usually wins anything in which it is entered (personally I think Cherry tomatoes should be in their own catagory). Second, the average person off of the street has a limited palate (from years of eating supermarket tomatoes, Early Girl, and Better Boy) so will tend to go with familiar "tomatoey" tasting varieties, or unusual (extra sweet etc) varieties, and third, there is quite a bit of variability in flavor even of fruits on the same plant so there is usually a good chance that there will be a really good tasting example of variety X, Y or Z going against a so-so Brandywine. But Brandywine is almost always in the top 5-10 while X,Y and Z range widely in results year to year.
Another commonly seen bit of misinformation has to do with Pruden's Purple. At one time a website mistakenly said that PP was related to Brandywine, which it isn't, and then several other websites used the same statement word for word. The origin of PP is unknown.
Most of the things with Brandywine in the name are not related to Brandywine, they are crosses with Red Brandywine, Yellow Brandywine etc. most of the really good Brandywine crosses do not have Brandywine in the name (Lucky Cross/Little Lucky, Gary'O Sena)
Also, beware of anything that says Brandywine is Amish. It isn't. It came from Doris Sudduth of Tennesee. The unrelated Red Brandywine is linked to the Amish in Pennsylvania, but probably originated from a commercial variety by that name in the late 1800s.
Just wanted to drop back to this thread to thank everybody for all the advice, especially TZ for contacting that tomato expert guy.
I went to that place and grabbed seven different heirloom tomato varieties to try out, including Pruden's Purple, Jack White, some different italian varieties of indeterminates, and a Kentucky heirloom called Viva Lindsay's Wedding. I also grabbed some Sudduth Brandywines.
The place also had a great selection of peppers and herbs and I picked up a bunch of those. I am super excited. I am also happy to find some great local family-owned places to support instead of big boxes or online places.
Thanks again, and wish me luck!
I went to that place and grabbed seven different heirloom tomato varieties to try out, including Pruden's Purple, Jack White, some different italian varieties of indeterminates, and a Kentucky heirloom called Viva Lindsay's Wedding. I also grabbed some Sudduth Brandywines.
The place also had a great selection of peppers and herbs and I picked up a bunch of those. I am super excited. I am also happy to find some great local family-owned places to support instead of big boxes or online places.
Thanks again, and wish me luck!